Cont: All things Trump + Russia Part 2

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Cl1mh4224rd said:
I highly suspect the persecution complex is carried over from Christianity. They view sticking to their guns in the face of such insurmountable odds as a virtue, and any victory as a validation of the righteousness of their cause.
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I think it's carried over from Karl Rove's Playbook, calculated political propaganda.
 
Cl1mh4224rd said:
I highly suspect the persecution complex is carried over from Christianity. They view sticking to their guns in the face of such insurmountable odds as a virtue, and any victory as a validation of the righteousness of their cause.
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Defeats are also described in such terms.
 
Childlike Empress said:
That's beyond pathetic.
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What is beyond pathetic is the pretense that it even matters who was or wasn't involved in the production of the dossier.

The dossier is nothing but raw intelligence. Lots of individuals and organizations collect all kinds of raw intelligence all the time. Some of it may be true. None of it may be true. All of it may be true. To date, none of it has been publicly verified, and none of it has been credibly debunked.

Trump may or may not be a pisshead. Hillary may or may not need to be locked up. At this point, none of that matters.

What does matter is that Trump, pisshead or not, now controls a large nuclear arsenal, thanks in part to one Vladimir ****head Putin. That should be the primary matter of concern among any sane, rational parties that may continue to persist in isolated pockets on the surface of the monkeyball. Whether he is vulnerable to Russian blackmail is, at this point, both unknown and of secondary importance.

The important question is how crazy is the bastard.

Putin doesn't seem to be worried, but he's probably a psychopath, and they don't worry about anything. Little Rocket Man seems somewhat purturbed, throwing rockets around every time Trump's nose twitches and regularly describing him as a geriatric lunatic - which has compelled me to conclude that Little Rocket Man may not be as high on the psychopath scale as I had him pegged.

The only certainty in all of this is that these three creatures have clawed and scrabbled their ways into positions from which they threaten all of human civilization.

So. We keep playing silly games. No use trying to change now.
 
Putin btw had his "mission accomplished" moment today, visiting Syria, meeting with Assad and calmly ordering the withdrawal of Russian troops from combat operations after he defeated the Empire's tool ISIS. He hurried up to make that order to again humiliate the Pentagon who are at the moment in complete denial mode frantically searching for some excuse to keep their new bases in north-eastern Syria while everybody in the region including their ex-proxies chant "get out" in unisono.
 
Wolrab said:
Has anyone found any voters who were swayed by Russian facebook posts?
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I'd guess that might depend on what you count as "swayed" and what point you're trying to get at. Trump was elected by the American people. There was a narrow enough margin that Russian ads that helped depress the turnout for Hillary and helped promote the turnout for Trump could maybe have swayed things, but that would just be one of many factors in play, the overwhelming amount of which are quite rooted in the US. Trying to demand clear evidence that one factor among many was completely responsible is not even potentially going to lead to any good argument.

Either way, that Russia was trying to mess with our elections is a problem all it's own, completely separate from whether their attempts to support Trump actually did enough to lead to his victory. Contrary to how I've seen some right-wingers try to dismiss the whole matter, being concerned about foreign countries (for many, that can and does include when the US has done so) trying to use illegal and/or underhanded methods to interfere with democratic electoral processes (especially in ways that we don't have decent countermeasures for) is worthy of attention on its own merits, with no need to try to make it all about unhappy people trying to get rid of Trump and make Hillary President.
 
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Wolrab said:
Has anyone found any voters who were swayed by Russian facebook posts?
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What a truly ludicrous question. Have you found any Twinkie eaters who were swayed by Hostess ads? People don't necessary know what swayed them. Especially dimwits, e.g. Trump supporters (disproportionately).

On top of which, I'm highly dubious that many people could identify which content emanated from Russia. And even if they could, I'm equally dubious they would admit to being swayed.

On top of which (as if necessary), do you actually suppose your readership is out polling their friends, neighbors, and co-workers on such matters? With said polling involving a statistically significant population size?

<loud guffaw>
 
Childlike Empress said:
The plot thickens. Whoosh goes the boomerang.
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They keep repeating the same half-truths/lies. They say:
Fusion GPS has attracted scrutiny because Republican lawmakers have spent the better part of this year investigating whether the dossier, which was funded by the Hillary Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee, served as the basis for the Justice Department and the FBI to obtain FISA surveillance last year on a Trump campaign adviser named Carter Page.

When the reality is:
http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/18/polit...-donald-trump-russia-investigation/index.html
The FBI last year used a dossier of allegations of Russian ties to Donald Trump's campaign as part of the justification to win approval to secretly monitor a Trump associate, according to US officials briefed on the investigation
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Officials familiar with the process say even if the application to monitor Page included information from the dossier, it would only be after the FBI had corroborated the information through its own investigation.
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US law enforcement and intelligence officials have said US investigators did their own work, separate from the dossier, to support their findings that Russia tried to meddle in the 2016 presidential election in favor of Trump.

And round and round we go....
 
TheL8Elvis said:
They keep repeating the same half-truths/lies. They say:
Fusion GPS has attracted scrutiny because Republican lawmakers have spent the better part of this year investigating whether the dossier, which was funded by the Hillary Clinton campaign and the Democratic National Committee, served as the basis for the Justice Department and the FBI to obtain FISA surveillance last year on a Trump campaign adviser named Carter Page.

When the reality is:
http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/18/polit...-donald-trump-russia-investigation/index.html
The FBI last year used a dossier of allegations of Russian ties to Donald Trump's campaign as part of the justification to win approval to secretly monitor a Trump associate, according to US officials briefed on the investigation
...
Officials familiar with the process say even if the application to monitor Page included information from the dossier, it would only be after the FBI had corroborated the information through its own investigation.
...
US law enforcement and intelligence officials have said US investigators did their own work, separate from the dossier, to support their findings that Russia tried to meddle in the 2016 presidential election in favor of Trump.

And round and round we go....
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Plus the pinning of the dossier's existence on Hillary. Republican primary candidates funded the creation, Hillary paid for a product that was already on the market.

This is where the tapatalk signature that annoys people used to be
 
Stacko said:
2017 Lie of the Year: Russian election interference is a 'made-up story'
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"A mountain of evidence points to a single fact: Russia meddled in the U.S. presidential election of 2016." Another mountain of evidence points to the Trump campaign knowing about it. Another mountain of evidence points to a long list of things Trump has done or tried to do that would be on Putin's letter to Santa. So we know the quid, we know the quo, and we now know that both were discussed in secret meetings that TrumpCo repeatedly lied about. And of course we know of all the efforts to end any investigations.

The only thing that stands between Trump and impeachment is a Republican congress that appears to be completely devoid of integrity. But fortunately, there is a solution available in 2018.
 
Childlike Empress said:
Putin btw had his "mission accomplished" moment today, visiting Syria, meeting with Assad and calmly ordering the withdrawal of Russian troops from combat operations after he defeated the Empire's tool ISIS. He hurried up to make that order to again humiliate the Pentagon who are at the moment in complete denial mode frantically searching for some excuse to keep their new bases in north-eastern Syria while everybody in the region including their ex-proxies chant "get out" in unisono.
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Your praise of a great leader mixed with disdain for empire is endearing. I'll stop here, for kindness sake.
 
Fun fact/reminder of the day: Robert Mueller's first day on the job as FBI Director was September 4, 2001.

Explains a lot about how he was able to so rapidly build a massive (and so far, successful) investigation into a devastating attack on the United States that was carried out by foreign actors, IMO.
 
WilliamSeger said:
"A mountain of evidence points to a single fact: Russia meddled in the U.S. presidential election of 2016." Another mountain of evidence points to the Trump campaign knowing about it. Another mountain of evidence points to a long list of things Trump has done or tried to do that would be on Putin's letter to Santa. So we know the quid, we know the quo, and we now know that both were discussed in secret meetings that TrumpCo repeatedly lied about. And of course we know of all the efforts to end any investigations.

The only thing that stands between Trump and impeachment is a Republican congress that appears to be completely devoid of integrity. But fortunately, there is a solution available in 2018.
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I would like evidence of the "pro"
 
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