New telepathy test, the sequel.

[John Jones]

So why do you respond on this Board? Why don't you just send your thoughts to the people who respond to this thread?
Norm

That's just what they'll be expecting.

 

[Dave Rogers]

I have already modified my tests in the past to take member suggestions into account, but I generally found that these suggestions did not lead to an improvement. In particular, evaluating in a "fair" way credibilities of the answers (making a distinction between friendly answers of people who cooperate and less friendly ones) has turned out to be an essential tool.

This is a classic example of the bias that permeates every aspect of your thinking. Your definition of "improvement" in this context is "gives me a result more like the one I want to get." That's why you see it as an improvement that you've come up with an excuse to discard the answers you don't want.

Dave

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

So why do you respond on this Board? Why don't you just send your thoughts to the people who respond to this thread?

There has been a test that has been suggested many times, which would conclusively prove Michel's telepathic abilities and would work to reassure him that the respondent(s) are being genuine: Don't post anything on this board, but instead write down his own telephone number (including international area code) and a nonsensical code phrase (such as "purple fish pyjamas happily bucket") and broadcast those.

Since Michel believes that he can broadcast his thoughts to everybody in the entire world, everybody should be able to discern his telephone number and the code phrase. Then anybody who is willing to confirm his abilities need only phone him up and repeat the code phrase. Michel is instantly in contact with one or more people who can not only hear his thoughts but who is willing to help him to prove that he has them. Then he can move on to those tests sceptic societies offer for cash and, in passing them with the help of his new friend or friends, will prove to the world that such phenomena are real.

If nobody phones then there are one of two conclusions - either nobody can actually hear his thoughts, or every single person in the world is conspiring against him. If it's the former, then he will have to face some difficult facts. If it's the latter, then there's no point putting tests like these on the internet. Since Michel believes that people in these threads are responding genuinely and can hear his thoughts, he shouldn't have any fear that the latter will occur, meaning that if someone does contact him he can prove his abilities are real and if nobody does then he can safely conclude that they are not.

Michel refuses to even acknowledge that this test has been suggested more than once by more than one person.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

John said "I did not use telepathy." (he seemed to know it). If no telepathy is used, his number is of no interest for me in my telepathy test, and it is normal that I reject it as non-credible.

That is confirmation bias at work. You have no way to tell whether his claim not to have used telepathy is because 1) he is telepathic but unaware of it or 2) he is telepathic and knows about the sensation but did not use it on this occasion or 3) he is not telepathic or 4) telepathy doesn't exist.

You had no good reason to reject his answer, only a bad reason; it was not the answer you wanted.

 

[Jack by the hedge]

There has been a test that has been suggested many times, which would conclusively prove Michel's telepathic abilities and would work to reassure him that the respondent(s) are being genuine: Don't post anything on this board, but instead write down his own telephone number (including international area code) and a nonsensical code phrase (such as "purple fish pyjamas happily bucket") and broadcast those.

Since Michel believes that he can broadcast his thoughts to everybody in the entire world, everybody should be able to discern his telephone number and the code phrase. Then anybody who is willing to confirm his abilities need only phone him up and repeat the code phrase. Michel is instantly in contact with one or more people who can not only hear his thoughts but who is willing to help him to prove that he has them. Then he can move on to those tests sceptic societies offer for cash and, in passing them with the help of his new friend or friends, will prove to the world that such phenomena are real.

If nobody phones then there are one of two conclusions - either nobody can actually hear his thoughts, or every single person in the world is conspiring against him. If it's the former, then he will have to face some difficult facts. If it's the latter, then there's no point putting tests like these on the internet. Since Michel believes that people in these threads are responding genuinely and can hear his thoughts, he shouldn't have any fear that the latter will occur, meaning that if someone does contact him he can prove his abilities are real and if nobody does then he can safely conclude that they are not.

Michel refuses to even acknowledge that this test has been suggested more than once by more than one person.

There was a story in the news last week about a man who's suing a movie star in (I think) Pakistan after his real phone number was mistakenly used as a pretend number in a film and he was bombarded by calls.

All Michel would have to do is think of his own number and he would be bombarded by calls from people begging him to stop projecting his thoughts at them as they're trying to get some sleep. But it doesn't happen because thought projection is just imaginary.

 

[Michel H]

... You have no way to tell whether his claim not to have used telepathy is because ...

Your sentence doesn't make any sense (it would perhaps make (just a little) more sense had you written:"... You have no way to tell whether his claim not to have used telepathy is true because ...").

When somebody in an ESP test says he/she did not use telepathy with no other comment, I uniformly consider the answer as non-credible (to me, such an answer cannot be trusted or taken seriously in a telepathy test). It does not matter at all which answer was given. If you say otherwise without giving a single counter-example, the most likely explanation is that you are being grossly dishonest, because it is so obvious.

 

[calebprime]

Actually the most likely answer is that we don't have that information at our fingertips. We remember the general case.

Is anyone generous enough or patient enough to go dig up the answer?

Maybe.

Not dishonesty.

This is where you get manipulative -- it really does seem that way to you, but the real reason you get that way is that most people will simply agree with you rather than risk unpleasantness.

 

[Loss Leader]

Your sentence doesn't make any sense (it would perhaps make (just a little) more sense had you written:"... You have no way to tell whether his claim not to have used telepathy is true because ...").

This is once again very hostile. Telling someone his statement makes no sense is a hostile act, especially since his sentence is perfectly fine english. On the other hand, you contort yourself to allow the statement "I'm and not" even though this is improper english and makes sense only after you add words that the person did not write. You also imply that Jack by the hedge is being "grossly dishonest". This is very aggressive.

Your continuing hostility indicates, by your own rules, that you are not credible. Thus, you are lying when you say an answer was not credible. You believed it was credible. However, admitting such would be a significant step towards realizing that you are not special and that I am.

It is perfectly understandable that you would be so upset to be hearing my thoughts that you deny it. The real question in my mind is figuring out why you're lying about my telepathic powers and how to get you to accept the truth about my abilities.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

Michel refuses to even acknowledge that this test has been suggested more than once by more than one person.

I just wanted to quote this to emphasise that Michel has posted in this thread since I made my post and he has yet again completely ignored the simplest test of his powers there could be, and one which would unequivocally settle the question of whether or not he has those powers.

 

[RoboTimbo]

You ran away from answering the question: if you can project your thoughts, why do you feel it necessary to post on a forum?

Michel H, I find it very hostile of you to not answer questions. I'm afraid nobody will be able to trust you to tell the truth about the telepathy you claim to have but refuse to prove. You have no credibility.

 

[Michel H]

That is confirmation bias at work. You have no way to tell whether his claim not to have used telepathy is because 1) he is telepathic but unaware of it or 2) he is telepathic and knows about the sensation but did not use it on this occasion or 3) he is not telepathic or 4) telepathy doesn't exist.
You had no good reason to reject his answer, only a bad reason; it was not the answer you wanted.

... his sentence is perfectly fine english ...

I have read carefully again the highlighted (complicated) sentence above by Jack by the hedge, and I think I understand what he meant now.

Nevertheless, as a rule, when somebody says he/she did not use telepathy to obtain his/her answer, with no further statement, I consider it non-reliable or non-credible (this has nothing to do with the correctness or incorrectness of the answer).

I wonder what Loss Leader would say if a surgeon said "I am going to operate on you, but I won't use my surgical instruments".

 

[Michel H]

You ran away from answering the question: if you can project your thoughts, why do you feel it necessary to post on a forum?

I don't see how I could interact and discuss with other people, with a result that other people can read, using thought transference alone. Actually, I think that many people (and animals) know many of my thoughts, but not all my thoughts. In addition, usually, when I start writing a post, I have only a vague idea myself of what I am going to say. I know it only at the end, when the post is completed.

 

[Michel H]

There has been a test that has been suggested many times, which would conclusively prove Michel's telepathic abilities and would work to reassure him that the respondent(s) are being genuine: Don't post anything on this board, but instead write down his own telephone number (including international area code) and a nonsensical code phrase (such as "purple fish pyjamas happily bucket") and broadcast those.

Since Michel believes that he can broadcast his thoughts to everybody in the entire world, everybody should be able to discern his telephone number and the code phrase. Then anybody who is willing to confirm his abilities need only phone him up and repeat the code phrase. Michel is instantly in contact with one or more people who can not only hear his thoughts but who is willing to help him to prove that he has them. Then he can move on to those tests sceptic societies offer for cash and, in passing them with the help of his new friend or friends, will prove to the world that such phenomena are real.

If nobody phones then there are one of two conclusions - either nobody can actually hear his thoughts, or every single person in the world is conspiring against him. If it's the former, then he will have to face some difficult facts. If it's the latter, then there's no point putting tests like these on the internet. Since Michel believes that people in these threads are responding genuinely and can hear his thoughts, he shouldn't have any fear that the latter will occur, meaning that if someone does contact him he can prove his abilities are real and if nobody does then he can safely conclude that they are not.

Michel refuses to even acknowledge that this test has been suggested more than once by more than one person.

I think this (in my opinion, very bad) test was originally proposed by Jack by the hedge, several times. Actually, if nobody phones me, it does not necessarily mean that everybody is (actively) "conspiring" against me, a different, less dramatic, explanation could be that people are just not interested. In addition such a test could affect adversely my privacy and everybody's mental health, in my opinion. A little guessing game is more normal and less scary, I believe.

 

[RoboTimbo]

I don't see how I could interact and discuss with other people, with a result that other people can read, using thought transference alone.

That's because you can't transfer your thoughts. If you could, you would transfer them telepathically and people would respond to you here. Since you know you can't, you have to actually type what you want to say to people.

Actually, I think that many people (and animals) know many of my thoughts, but not all my thougts.

Actually, we know only those thoughts you've typed here. (You've misspelled 'thoughts', by the way, eroding your credibility even more.)

In addition, usually, when I start writing a post, I have only a vague idea myself of what I am going to say. I know it only at the end, when the post is completed.

Yes, it's the same way with thoughts. Don't you wish you had the power to telepathically send your thoughts to others? If you could, you wouldn't have any qualms about thinking your phone number at us and waiting for a phone call.

Since I've given you zero credibility, every time you say that you can transmit your thoughts, we both know that you're not telling the truth.

 

[RoboTimbo]

I think this (in my opinion, very bad) test was originally proposed by Jack by the hedge, several times. Actually, if nobody phones me, it does not necessarily mean that everybody is (actively) "conspiring" against me, a different, less dramatic, explanation could be that people are just not interested. In addition such a test could affect adversely my privacy and everybody's mental health, in my opinion. A little guessing game is more normal and less scary, I believe.

Here I give you partial credibility. I find your overly wordy explanation at the beginning to be indicative of falseness where you're accusing people of conspiring against you. In your last sentence, however, I've given you higher credibility due to how concisely you've stated that you know it's just a guessing game and doesn't involve telepathy at all.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

I think this (in my opinion, very bad) test was originally proposed by Jack by the hedge, several times. Actually, if nobody phones me, it does not necessarily mean that everybody is (actively) "conspiring" against me, a different, less dramatic, explanation could be that people are just not interested.

As I said, you already believe that people are interested, because you have people in the threads such as these who you believe are posting evidence they can hear your thoughts.

In addition such a test could affect adversely my privacy and everybody's mental health, in my opinion.

So buy a burner phone. You can get them really cheaply and then you'll have number that you can give out that's not your private, personal one.

As far as everybody's mental health goes, how would it be any different from you doing what you're doing now?

 

[Michel H]

Here I give you partial credibility. I find your overly wordy explanation at the beginning to be indicative of falseness where you're accusing people of conspiring against you. In your last sentence, however, I've given you higher credibility due to how concisely you've stated that you know it's just a guessing game and doesn't involve telepathy at all.

When I say "guessing game", I mean "telepathic guessing game", of course, see for example the top of this webpage: http://www.gotoquiz.com/i_can_guess_a_number_you_are_thinking_of

 

[Loss Leader]

I have read carefully again the highlighted (complicated) sentence above by Jack by the hedge, and I think I understand what he meant now.

There are several markers of hostility in this statement. You cannot refer to Jack by the hedge's sentence without calling it "complicated." In fact, it is a simple and easily comprehensible list. Rather than say you understand it, you say you think you understand it.

Your hostility, by your own rules, shows you to be prone to lying.

Nevertheless, as a rule, when somebody says he/she did not use telepathy to obtain his/her answer, with no further statement, I consider it non-reliable or non-credible (this has nothing to do with the correctness or incorrectness of the answer).

Based on your hostility, you are lying. You do know that your "credibility" rating does have to do with the correctness or incorrectness of the answer. You do find incorrect answers to be untrustworthy just because they are incorrect.

I wonder what Loss Leader would say if a surgeon said "I am going to operate on you, but I won't use my surgical instruments".

This is a flat-out lie. You do know what I would say because I projected that thought to you. Why are you pretending you cannot hear my thoughts? I have found that you are so upset by the fact that I have telepathic powers that you lie rather than admit it. I have found that you are so upset that I am superior to you that you pretend I am not. You would be much happier if you just stopped lying. If you come to terms with my telepathic powers and your ordinariness, maybe we can move on to a real test of the strength of my powers.

(I recently thought to President Trump that he should be very complimentary towards the President of China during his visit. He obviously heard my thoughts very clearly, despite being about 7,700 miles from me.)

 

[Michel H]

As I said, you already believe that people are interested, because you have people in the threads such as these who you believe are posting evidence they can hear your thoughts.



So buy a burner phone. You can get them really cheaply and then you'll have number that you can give out that's not your private, personal one.

As far as everybody's mental health goes, how would it be any different from you doing what you're doing now?

So buy a burner phone. You can get them really cheaply and then you'll have number that you can give out that's not your private, personal one.

But once people have guessed the number of my temporary phone (if that happens), the next step is to guess the numbers of my fixed and mobile phones. No, thank you.

As far as everybody's mental health goes, how would it be any different from you doing what you're doing now?

It would be less natural, I think. I don't want to urge people to become super-telepaths (but nothing would probably happen, anyway).

 

[The Norseman]

When I say "guessing game", I mean "telepathic guessing game", of course, see for example the top of this webpage: http://www.gotoquiz.com/i_can_guess_a_number_you_are_thinking_of

That's very odd. When you read English on a website, do you refer to it as "an English guessing game"? Do you normally have to guess at what words mean when used in sentences?

But once people have guessed the number of my temporary phone (if that happens), the next step is to guess the numbers of my fixed and mobile phones. No, thank you.

There's no guessing involved. You are broadcasting the number of a burner phone and that's it. Only the people who have received your broadcast number will call it. Why in the world would anyone wish to call a number which you did not broadcast?