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Cont: The Trump Presidency Part III

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phiwum said:
But it's not that their vote for President was a matter of being hornswaggled. No, he's a good and decent man, maybe even chosen by God (honestly, I've heard him compared to Saul by family members, the point being that though he's been despicable in the past, he will still be working God's plan at some point real soon now).
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Well, there's no reasoning with people like that anyway.
 
The Don said:
Then you've just lost my vote forever because:

  • You say I can't have my job back
  • You pointed out that I was conned - in effect you're saying I'm stupid
  • You pointed out that I was conned - that makes me feel bad so I'm going to blame you
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Tough situation, ain't it? Some claim that the Dems have to tell voters that they weren't wrong to vote for the least competent, most transparent con man ever, while still suggesting that next time they should know better.

Yeah, it's tough. The fact is that a large minority was hoodwinked and doesn't want to admit it. The grownups have a difficult row to hoe.

NOTE: I'm not at all partisan in this, at least not much. I think that the GOP of old was a principled party. Not of late, however. I loathed W., but thought he actually had some principles, just few I agreed with. His father was a better man, by and large.
 
Giordano said:
It may have been the message that Clinton intended to give in her heart of hearts, but it was not the one she effectively presented publicly. Let's face it, Hillary Clinton was not good at connecting with people at the personal, at the emotional level. And she spoke offhandedly at several public functions in ways that were easily distorted and used against here.
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I think that says a lot about the political environment in general, and Trump supporters in particular.

Clinton makes a statement/gives a speech, but ONE part of the speech happens to be bad when taken out of context (like Clinton's "deplorables" comment) and she is evil/a failure/etc. Trump gives speeches where every part of the speech is somehow wrong (racist/sexist/lies/contradictory) and it is acceptable.

It seemed that Clinton was being held to a higher standard (i.e. no mistakes are allowed at all) than Trump (where flaws are overlooked.) Some might wonder why the difference.
 
Argumemnon said:
Well, there's no reasoning with people like that anyway.
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But that's some of the people who are registered to vote. If'n we can't reason with them, then we have to find some non-rational basis to sway them away from the stupidity that is Trump.

I honestly don't take any of our local alleged conservatives seriously when they say Trump was the better option. Their party is being co-opted by a child who happened to master reality TV. If they gave a damn about principles, they would acknowledge that he has none, that his presidency is all about him rather than about conservatism, that he's a damned shame not only for the nation, but also for Republicans. The party does not benefit no matter which of its members is in power. Rather, the party benefits if the right member is in power.

Sorry, I digress. I don't, in principle, mind a GOP president. I can live with that. Trump is the uniquely least qualified, most incompetent candidate in my lifetime. He makes Ross Perot seem levelheaded. I can't understand how folk like theprestige think there's no good argument about Trump's competency, since it's clear to the most disinterested observer that the man is a buffoon, pretending to be in charge. Honestly, God help us all, because having Trump in the executive seat of power is damned dangerous.
 
phiwum said:
But that's some of the people who are registered to vote. If'n we can't reason with them, then we have to find some non-rational basis to sway them away from the stupidity that is Trump.

I honestly don't take any of our local alleged conservatives seriously when they say Trump was the better option. Their party is being co-opted by a child who happened to master reality TV. If they gave a damn about principles, they would acknowledge that he has none, that his presidency is all about him rather than about conservatism, that he's a damned shame not only for the nation, but also for Republicans. The party does not benefit no matter which of its members is in power. Rather, the party benefits if the right member is in power.

Sorry, I digress. I don't, in principle, mind a GOP president. I can live with that. Trump is the uniquely least qualified, most incompetent candidate in my lifetime. He makes Ross Perot seem levelheaded. I can't understand how folk like theprestige think there's no good argument about Trump's competency, since it's clear to the most disinterested observer that the man is a buffoon, pretending to be in charge. Honestly, God help us all, because having Trump in the executive seat of power is damned dangerous.
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The BBC world service OS radio programmes from the local newspapers that supporeted Trump were pretty depressing - they seem to think that Trump has achieved a lot of legislation

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w172vrb5cv0t32m
 
jimbob said:
The BBC world service OS radio programmes from the local newspapers that supporeted Trump were pretty depressing - they seem to think that Trump has achieved a lot of legislation

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w172vrb5cv0t32m
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Yes, this might be good argument that folks aren't competent to govern themselves. Darn shame, but maybe most folk haven't a clue.

Or maybe folks don't see the difference between executive actions and legislative achievements.
 
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Giordano said:
It may have been the message that Clinton intended to give in her heart of hearts, but it was not the one she effectively presented publicly. Let's face it, Hillary Clinton was not good at connecting with people at the personal, at the emotional level.
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Most people who personally interacted with her seem to think differently, she is not good at projecting the appearance of that kind of connection which is a very different thing.
 
phiwum said:
But that's some of the people who are registered to vote. If'n we can't reason with them, then we have to find some non-rational basis to sway them away from the stupidity that is Trump.
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No we don't. If you can convince most Democratic voters to show up, the Democratic nominee will win. So focus on them and independants and undecided. Don't waste time on those who'll never vote for you.
 
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jimbob said:
The BBC world service OS radio programmes from the local newspapers that supporeted Trump were pretty depressing - they seem to think that Trump has achieved a lot of legislation

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w172vrb5cv0t32m
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Sadly it's not legislation where the damage is being done, that is the distraction. All the while Trump appointees are gutting regulations and damaging agencies.
 
phiwum said:
Tough situation, ain't it? Some claim that the Dems have to tell voters that they weren't wrong to vote for the least competent, most transparent con man ever, while still suggesting that next time they should know better.

Yeah, it's tough. The fact is that a large minority was hoodwinked and doesn't want to admit it. The grownups have a difficult row to hoe.

NOTE: I'm not at all partisan in this, at least not much. I think that the GOP of old was a principled party. Not of late, however. I loathed W., but thought he actually had some principles, just few I agreed with. His father was a better man, by and large.
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What majority are you thinking about? Hillary Clinton won the popular vote by three million votes. She's not president because she won those votes in the wrong states and Trump got the electoral college.
 
Is DeVos a goner?

It seemed probable yesterday she's on her way out.
Not quite a done deal, but likely she'll resign soon.

Thought I'd see mention of it here... did I miss it? Or misread the tea leaves?

And any chance she can be chained to about 27 of her admin compatriots... drag them out with her? :p
 
Arcade22 said:
https://www.politico.com/magazine/s...rump-johnstown-pennsylvania-supporters-215800

Deep down the know that they were scammed by Trump.
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I strongly disagree. They support Trump because they truly believe that he is against the status quo. Currently, they're hurting economically and anybody who says he'll make a change meets their approval. Is Trump honest? Is he really going to help them? No, of course not. But they have to believe SOMEONE is going to "fix" things and now he's the one. That's the only "deep down" here.
 
Giordano said:
"We understand your anger and frustration as you were being left behind in the economy. We understand your fears as what were solid jobs disappeared and your own financial situation became more and more marginal. We understand why you wanted to change the business-as-usual thinking in government that appeared to ignore you and your problems. We understand how Trump spoke to you on these issues and why you hoped he would be the one, the outsider who would help you. But sadly he lied, he betrayed you! You counted on him caring about you, but he turned out to be just another lying billionaire seeking to line his own pockets and the pockets of his wealthy friends. Rather than trying to solve your concerns he only cynically exploited them for his own benefit. You only have to look at what he's done in the last year to prove that to you.

The Democrats are the party who has historically done more for those who are not wealthy than the Republicans. We now, better than ever, understand your views, and this is what we are going to do if elected to prove that we are on your side..."
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Giordano 2020
 
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