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Cont: JFK Conspiracy Theories V: Five for Fighting

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So no reaction to being struck then. Maybe a reaction to hearing something that sounded like a shot shortly (1-2 seconds) before that, allowing for reaction time?

Does that sound possible? How did you eliminate that possibility?

I believe there is virtually no witness evidence for a loud shot before z190-224.

If you want evidence that Kennedy was reacting to something by z190, review one of my earlier posts here where I compiled the evidence for this.

It what ways does it not fit well? You're the 'medical expert' on this forum (or so you'd like us to believe). You tell us how you excluded a 6.5mm round as making that wound, and tell us how many bullets were manufactured in the history of the world having cross-sectional dimensions of 15mm by 6mm, and how those bullets would spiral down a barrel.

Or do you suppose there might be another reason for the elliptical entry wound other than an elliptical bullet?

Hmmm?

Hank

What angle was the back of Kennedy's head from the Sniper's Nest at z313? 14 degrees or so?
 
Let's backtrack a bit.

In the prior thread, you argued here:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11847719&postcount=3845

For this:


If the wound was devoid of both scalp and skull, what was the wound IN?

Please note the original autopsists had no problem thinking of the way that wound could have a relationship to the large head wound... they determined the small wound was the entrance and the large wound was the exit.

Tell us on what basis you think they are not related. Cite the evidence, not your opinion of the evidence. That means quoting the actual experts for their opinions, not telling us what you think they missed, what you think they should have done, or what you think they should have thought.

We're looking for evidence from qualified medical professionals here.

Hank

The cerebellum would be more damaged if a 6.5 round had entered near the EOP.

The small head wound was low enough that it could be preserved on the intact portion of the cranium after it had already been opened up to remove the brain?
 
The cerebellum would be more damaged if a 6.5 round had entered near the EOP.

The small head wound was low enough that it could be preserved on the intact portion of the cranium after it had already been opened up to remove the brain?

Hank has addressed your points and I'll add The small entry wound that was created by the 6.5mm x 52 bullet, and there was NO other entry wound noted by the doctors during the autopsy. What part of that don't you get? The large exit wound was caused by the same bullet. And since you aren't a ballistics/forensic expert you can't make the statement of how a bullet will travel or make wounds in the brain.
 
I believe there is virtually no witness evidence for a loud shot before z190-224.

If you want evidence that Kennedy was reacting to something by z190, review one of my earlier posts here where I compiled the evidence for this.

So there is both evidence for a shot before Z190 and no witness evidence of a shot before Z190-224.

Ok.........



What angle was the back of Kennedy's head from the Sniper's Nest at z313? 14 degrees or so?

Not an answer, merely another deflection by you. Try answering the question asked, which dealt with the argument you raised:

Reminder, it dealt with the size of the wound on the back of JFK's head:
In what way does a 15x6mm elliptical entry wound fit well with a 6.5 round?
In what ways does it not fit well? You're the 'medical expert' on this forum (or so you'd like us to believe). You tell us how you excluded a 6.5mm round as making that wound, and tell us how many bullets were manufactured in the history of the world having cross-sectional dimensions of 15mm by 6mm, and how those bullets would spiral down a barrel.

Or do you suppose there might be another reason for the elliptical entry wound other than an elliptical bullet?

And by the way, I thought you argued for the small bullet wound in JFK's head being made at Z190-224?

Now you're referencing the angle at Z313? How come? I thought you argued that was a tangential shot. Can't keep your own arguments straight?

Hank
 
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So there is both evidence for a shot before Z190 and no witness evidence of a shot before Z190-224.

Ok.........





Not an answer, merely another deflection by you. Try answering the question asked, which dealt with the argument you raised:

Reminder, it dealt with the size of the wound on the back of JFK's head:


And by the way, I thought you argued for the small bullet wound in JFK's head being made at Z190-224?

Now you're referencing the angle at Z313? How come? I thought you argued that was a tangential shot. Can't keep your own arguments straight?

Hank

I'm not sure whether (s)he realizes that contradictory posts destroy any credibility. That is unless (s)he is nothing but a troll, a quite likely scenario.
 
Let's backtrack a bit.

In the prior thread, you argued here:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11847719&postcount=3845

For this:
One autopsy conclusion was that there was a small wound devoid of scalp and skull approximately 2.5 centimeters to the right and slightly above the external occipital protuberance. If you can think of a way this wound could have any relation to the large head wound, be my guest.

If the wound was devoid of both scalp and skull, what was the wound IN?

Please note the original autopsists had no problem thinking of the way that wound could have a relationship to the large head wound... they determined the small wound was the entrance and the large wound was the exit.

Tell us on what basis you think they are not related. Cite the evidence, not your opinion of the evidence. That means quoting the actual experts for their opinions, not telling us what you think they missed, what you think they should have done, or what you think they should have thought.

We're looking for evidence from qualified medical professionals here.
The cerebellum would be more damaged if a 6.5 round had entered near the EOP.

The small head wound was low enough that it could be preserved on the intact portion of the cranium after it had already been opened up to remove the brain?

What part of "evidence from qualified medical professionals" did you not understand? I didn't ask for your opinion. I asked you to cite the evidence. And you're responding to a different issue than was originally raised by you in any case ("If you can think of a way this wound could have any relation to the large head wound, be my guest"). Let's pretend you didn't run away again, shall we?

And despite changing the subject, your own argument about the damage to the cerebellum eliminates the EOP wound, because we know a 6.5mm round caused the head damage.

How do we know? Let's look at some of the evidence.

(a) Numerous witnesses pinpointed the SE corner window on the sixth floor of the Depository as the source of the shooter.
(b) A rifle that fired 6.5mm bullets was found on the same sixth floor of the same building that the witnesses saw the shooter.
(c) Three 6.5mm shells were found in the SE corner by the window on the sixth floor of the Depository.
(d) Two fragments from a 6.5mm round were found in the limo, forward of JFK and consistent with a shot from behind striking JFK in the head.
(e) Those fragments were traceable to the weapon mentioned in (b).
(f) A nearly whole 6.5mm bullet was discovered in Parkland Hospital, where the victims were taken.
(g) No other shooter, weapon, ammo, or bullet fragments traceable to another weapon was ever seen in Dealey Plaza, or recovered from the limo or the Hospital.
(h) All the experts who examined either the body or reviewed the extant autopsy material determined JFK suffered one bullet strike to the head. One.

All that evidence, taken together, not only eliminates a second shooter firing a smaller caliber weapon, it also eliminates the EOP as the entry wound, according to your own argument above that a 6.5mm round would have caused more damage to the cerebellum than the autopsists noted in the autopsy.

I listed points (a) to (h) in favor of 6.5mm ammo hitting JFK in the head. Show us the list of evidence you've compiled in favor of any other bullet striking JFK.

You don't have any. We covered this ground previously.

The best you could do was an unseen gunman shooting an unseen weapon firing ammunition that struck nothing and left no trace of itself behind. Almost like he didn't exist. In fact, exactly like he didn't exist.

Hank
 
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I'm not sure whether (s)he realizes that contradictory posts destroy any credibility. That is unless (s)he is nothing but a troll, a quite likely scenario.

MicahJava previously argued for a shot from the knoll causing the supposed tangential head wound he conjectured (with an entry in the front / right side of the head).

On the other hand, I have a hard time believing that the official fragments could be planted if one of them was found to have a particle of human skin attached to it. So maybe those could be a candidate for a shot entering the top-right side of the head and creating the large head wound.


Now he's arguing that this supposed tangential wound was caused by a shooter from behind.

If the fragments are real, then they were created by a 6.5 round tangentially striking JFK's head from behind.

Trying to nail down his arguments is like trying to nail jello to a wall.

He does keep us on our toes trying to figure out what his argument is going to mutate into next, I will give him that.

Hank
 
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Kennedy was lowering his arm from waving the last time at z190+.

In what way does a 15x6mm elliptical entry wound fit well with a 6.5 round?

The 6mm is the 6.5 part, and the 15mm is the god-awful tearing part when the bullet ripped through the skin on his back.

Didn't they teach you that at USMC Scout Sniper School?
 
I said that I DON'T think the X-rays or photographs are faked. They can be compatible with the EOP wound, if not prove it. If the X-rays or photographs were ever proven to be incompatible with the EOP wound, only then I would then think that they are faked.

Double-speak. This means you only agree with evidence if it supports your pet theory. Why should anyone take you seriously?
 
I see little point of questioning if John Stringer, even as an old man, could remember the types of film stock he used throughout his entire career.

What are you afraid of?


He said the photographs are copies because they aren't made with the film he always used.

Which, if you were a wise CTist, means that the Kennedys made copies of the original photos, and those are the negatives in the Archives, and the originals are safe.

I know...Logicking is hard.

So not only are some autopsy photographs missing from the official collection, but some of the versions in evidence today are apparently just copies.

Humes thinks there are only 3 photos missing, but they aren't key to eliminating anything. As far as the existing versions being copies I'm reminded of the Stephen Wright joke:

"I came home to find everything in my apartment had been replaced with an exact replica."

You're talking in circles BTW.
 
I believe there is virtually no witness evidence for a loud shot before z190-224.

Nobody cares, ear-witness testimony in this specific case is problematic even without tying it to a film.

If you want evidence that Kennedy was reacting to something by z190, review one of my earlier posts here where I compiled the evidence for this.

Nope, nobody's referring back. Big Boy rules apply here. Post the link, or restate your case again as you insist everyone else do when you're backed into a corner.
 
The cerebellum would be more damaged if a 6.5 round had entered near the EOP.

You base that on what? Your time as marksmanship instructor for the Italian Army? Maybe your tenure at Johns Hopkins? That bullet struck at over 1,700 ft-lbs. I know I don't have to tell you what that meant to the inside of JFK's head what with your years as a Delta Force medic and everything.
 
Blast from the past.

A year ago today MicahJava was being pedantic about whether you can read the autopsy or if the poster should have written 'autopsy report', and also apparently being critical of the autopsy report because it was revised before being typed up.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11576202&postcount=2124

Later that same day, he declared this:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11576202&postcount=2124
"TO ANY LURKERS READING THIS I HAVE ALL OF THE EVIDENCE AND EVERYBODY ELSE ONLY HAS BS"
[All upper case in the original]

I would think if someone had all they evidence, they could quote some of it on occasion.

Hank
 
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Blast from the past.

A year ago today MicahJava was being pedantic about whether you can read the autopsy or if the poster should have written 'autopsy report', and also apparently being critical of the autopsy report because it was revised before being typed up.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11576202&postcount=2124

Later that same day, he declared this:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11576202&postcount=2124
"TO ANY LURKERS READING THIS I HAVE ALL OF THE EVIDENCE AND EVERYBODY ELSE ONLY HAS BS"
[All upper case in the original]

I would think if someone had all they evidence, they could quote some of it on occasion.

Hank

There are many questions about the autopsy, but there is just so much evidence for the EOP wound that I do not suspect that the doctors are lying about it.
 
So there is both evidence for a shot before Z190 and no witness evidence of a shot before Z190-224.

Ok.........





Not an answer, merely another deflection by you. Try answering the question asked, which dealt with the argument you raised:

Reminder, it dealt with the size of the wound on the back of JFK's head:


And by the way, I thought you argued for the small bullet wound in JFK's head being made at Z190-224?

Now you're referencing the angle at Z313? How come? I thought you argued that was a tangential shot. Can't keep your own arguments straight?

Hank

I think you're the one who is either confused or trying to confuse others.
 
I see little point of questioning if John Stringer, even as an old man, could remember the types of film stock he used throughout his entire career. He said the photographs are copies because they aren't made with the film he always used.
Cameras use negatives. The photo print paper is a positive print from the negative and is not in the camera at the time.
 
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