Trump and NFL boycott

[BobTheCoward]

But I certainly know whether or not I was referring to "a power".

I wasn't.

You're wrong.

You said "the power of the office." However you intended doesn't matter. The power of the office is the enumerated powers. Effectiveness at communication is not power.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

The President has no more power to change the tax code than Rachel Maddow does.

For certain definitions of "president" and "power"

 

[Spindrift]

You said "the power of the office." However you intended doesn't matter. The power of the office is the enumerated powers. Effectiveness at communication is not power.

No. The enumerated powers of the office are the enumerated powers of the office. The office has other powers that are real and are used. The president has the power to influence events and people.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

You said "the power of the office." However you intended doesn't matter. The power of the office is the enumerated powers. Effectiveness at communication is not power.

For certain definitions of "power"

 

[BobTheCoward]

No. The enumerated powers of the office are the enumerated powers of the office. The office has other powers that are real and are used. The president has the power to influence events and people.

And I'm saying that is not power no matter how much others wish it.

 

[Spindrift]

And I'm saying that is not power no matter how much others wish it.

Enjoy being wrong.

 

[BobTheCoward]

For certain definitions of "power"

Exactly. I don't see why the argument even hinges on it being defined as power. It doesn't need to be power for it to be a negative.

 

[johnny karate]

You said "the power of the office."

Right, not "a power of the office".

However you intended doesn't matter.

Yes, it does.

The power of the office is the enumerated powers.

Had I meant that, I would have said "powers", plural. I didn't. I was referring to the power implicit in the office of the President.

If you want a real-world example, all you need to do is look at exactly what happened. President Donald Trump threatened the NFL, and the NFL capitulated. That wasn't because of any specific enumerated power of the presidency. It was because the office itself is powerful. Do you think the commissioner of the NFL would have capitulated so readily to a threat from private citizen Donald Trump? Of course not.

That the American presidency is a powerful office isn’t even remotely a controversial concept.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

Exactly.

Hmm ... I wasn't agreeing with you.

Right, not "a power of the office".



Yes, it does.



Had I meant that, I would have said "powers", plural. I didn't. I was referring to the power implicit in the office of the President.

If you want a real-world example, all you need to do is look at exactly what happened. President Donald Trump threatened the NFL, and the NFL capitulated. That wasn't because of any specific enumerated power of the presidency. It was because the office itself is powerful. Do you think the commissioner of the NFL would have capitulated so readily to a threat from private citizen Donald Trump? Of course not.

That the American presidency is a powerful office isn’t even remotely a controversial concept.

Not yet anyway

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...e-for-players-to-stand-during-national-anthem

The NFL has no plans to mandate players stand for the national anthem, a league spokesman told NFL.com Wednesday.

 

[Trebuchet]

It's the "bully pulpit" you're talking about. In Trump's case, for a more modern definition of "bully" than what TR meant.

 

[Galaxie]

This latest news is sure to upset Trump:
https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/10/12/nfl-nflpa-owners-meeting-anthem-discussion

"Commissioner Roger Goodell reached out to NFLPA executive director DeMaurice Smith today and both he and player leadership will attend the League meetings next week," the statement said. "There has been no change in the current policy regarding the anthem."

ETA: Ninja'd by TheL8Elvis!

 

[johnny karate]

Not yet anyway

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...e-for-players-to-stand-during-national-anthem

The NFL has no plans to mandate players stand for the national anthem, a league spokesman told NFL.com Wednesday.

Good. Seems like the players union is pushing back.

Hopefully, the NFL will come to realize that true patriotism isn't mindlessly participating is some empty ritual, but rather defiance in the face of government oppression.

 

[BobTheCoward]

Right, not "a power of the office".



Yes, it does.



Had I meant that, I would have said "powers", plural. I didn't. I was referring to the power implicit in the office of the President.

If you want a real-world example, all you need to do is look at exactly what happened. President Donald Trump threatened the NFL, and the NFL capitulated. That wasn't because of any specific enumerated power of the presidency. It was because the office itself is powerful. Do you think the commissioner of the NFL would have capitulated so readily to a threat from private citizen Donald Trump? Of course not.

That the American presidency is a powerful office isn’t even remotely a controversial concept.

I would not call being more persuasive"the powers."

 

[Spindrift]

I would not call being more persuasive"the powers."

Yes, you've made it clear that you have your own definition of the word power.

 

[BobTheCoward]

Yes, you've made it clear that you have your own definition of the word power.

The nuance of a definition of power is vital here. If we are going to define abuse of power as a problem, the very nature of power and it's definition matters.

 

[Segnosaur]

Well, it looks like some sports teams are willing to visit Trump in the White House...

https://www.vox.com/world/2017/10/10/16455140/trump-pittsburgh-penguins-2017
The NHL champion Pittsburgh Penguins visited the White House on Tuesday...
“You are true, true champions — and incredible patriots,” Trump said....But describing the Penguins as “incredible patriots” really gives away the game here: Most of the Pittsburgh Penguins squad aren’t American patriots, because they aren’t American at all.

But that's ok... being white (even if you're not American) seems to be enough to be in Trump's good graces.

 

[Spindrift]

The nuance of a definition of power is vital here. If we are going to define abuse of power as a problem, the very nature of power and it's definition matters.

It's not vital, we will survive without it.

 

[Hlafordlaes]

Well, nice to read the NFL isn't going to fold so easily after all. Score one for democratic sanity. Trump, on the other hand, is fast losing it entirely on this and every other topic. I give him very little time before the talk of making 45 into 46 by 25 becomes a clamor. Problem is, that 46 is not much better than this 45.... oh, well, one at a time, I reckon.

 

[johnny karate]

I would not call being more persuasive"the powers."

I wouldn't either.

 

[dudalb]

Trump shows respect for the flag:

https://www.salon.com/2017/10/12/tr...r-you-or-me/[url] God, what total hypocrisy.