Merged General Holocaust denial discussion Part IV

[Dash80]

An honest mistake*. I've read 1000 sob stories about Jewish victims, and this was the first about a non-Jewish victim.

*That I didn't make.

Pure ignorance, that's what it is.

IF the Nazis didn't murder anyone, how do you explain this?

In 1941, as news of the T4 programme leaked out there were protests and opposition. On 3 August 1941 a Catholic Bishop, Clemens von Galen, delivered a passionate sermon in Münster Cathedral attacking the 'euthanasia' programme, which he described as ‘plain murder.’ He spoke of a terrible future for humanity if 'euthanasia' became an acceptable for those perceived to be weak.

 

[Nessie]

.....
Since the entire holohoax is based on 'testimony' of Jewish eyewitnesses......

Lie. It is common denialist tactic to lie that there is no other evidence that mass murder took place. They do that so they can cope with the cognitive dissonance of there really being no evidence for their belief millions were transited back out of the AR camps and resettled by the Nazis, until they were liberated by the Allies.

 

[LemmyCaution]

You do realize one of Hilberg's most cited sources was Yankel Wiernik, right

Another falsehood. Hilberg has over 3,400 footnotes - just 4 cite Wiernik and none cite only Wiernik.

Out of curiosity, how many times have you read Hilberg's 3 volumes?

 

[smartcooky]

Lie. It is common denialist tactic to lie that there is no other evidence that mass murder took place. They do that so they can cope with the cognitive dissonance of there really being no evidence for their belief millions were transited back out of the AR camps and resettled by the Nazis, until they were liberated by the Allies.

Another falsehood. Hilberg has over 3,400 footnotes - just 4 cite Wiernik and none cite only Wiernik.

Out of curiosity, how many times have you read Hilberg's 3 volumes?

Saggy has long since given up any pretence of debating honestly (as if a Holocaust Denier is even capable of honest debate any way).

Now he just repeats debunked, demonstrable lie after debunked, demonstrable lie.

 

[LemmyCaution]

Ummm... you do realise Morgen was mostly concerned with corruption and pilfering of valuables by guards, and killing of prisoners "beyond the general guidelines?"

He also saw the gas chambers, by the way:

Morgen wished to investigate murders in the camps, which he had learned of in his various inquiries, and did so to some extent, only to be - as noted above - subjected to a tirade from Gestapo Müller and eventually reassigned by Himmler.

Referring at the Pohl-WVHA trial in Nuremberg to the meeting in which Müller went ballistic on him, Morgen - asked to tell whether Müller had been surprised when told of the extermination policy against the Jews - explained that Müller had in fact been "surprised to hear about the illegal executions in the concentration camps." But Morgen added that Müller

was not at all surprised that there was an extermination of the Jews, that there were inhuman treatments which had been ordered, and he said to me, ironically, "Why don't you arrest me[?]"

Morgen went on to tell the tribunal that he had also informed Horst Bender, another SS judge (Himmler’s liaison to the SS judges) of these matters:

Of course, I did tell him, I did tell Oberfuehrer Bender because he was a judge who reported to the Reichsfuehrer-SS directly, and he also consulted him.

I also told the Chief of Main Office SS Court, Obergruppenfuehrer Breithaupt. I can state under oath that both personalities were horrified to hear about those things.

I am a man who studied in all sorts of fields, and I was quite familiar with International Law, and about principles for all the laws which existed for all the legal countries, and that is the reason why I left no doubt that if a State committed such crimes, that those things can have a dire and horrible result against the State as such. And I am positive as a result of my investigations that I was able to [show] with concrete cases that the agents which were used for the bloody practices became absolutely criminals. Absolutely putrid.

Morgen's testimony is not helpful to deniers.

I must share with readers that some years ago, vigorously denying mass murder at Majdanek and in the Einsatz Reinhard program during discussion of Morgen at AHF, Saggy wrote of Globocnik - and I kid you not - "So, this is quite a character, and I had never heard of him." In the same thread, Saggy also wrote, "this is the first time I've read anything about Belzec." Unsurprisingly, Saggy's ignorance of basic facts did not stop him from pontificating at length about Majdanek and Einsatz Reinhard and "ENTIRELY WORTHLESS" testimonies and evidence about the Nazi camps.

 

[Belz...]

Anyone who studies any of the witness testimony will quickly discover that it is prima facie absurd.

No, anyone who studies any of the witness testimony will quickly discover that it isn't.

See how easy and ridiculous it is when you construct an argument based on say-so alone?

 

[Dash80]

I'm well aware of that Leo, that is, that there is not a shred of documentary of physical evidence of the holohoax at Auschwitz, or anywhere else, just the endless Jewish lies and false and absurd 'confessions'.

Since the entire holohoax is based on 'testimony' of Jewish eyewitnesses, that is why it is important to examine that testimony closely, and why I will continue to present the testmony of the most important witnesses in subsequent posts. Jewish testimony is invariably false to the point of absurdity, as we have seen with the witnesses discussed to this point.

Are you attempting to establish some kind of record for number of lies you can rack up in just one post?

What about non-Jewish witness?

 

[Saggy]

I must share with readers that some years ago, vigorously denying mass murder at Majdanek

.. Thanks for sharing. But, it's a little suprising that you'd bring up my prior comments on Majdanek, the one camp I've visited, by chance before I was a denier, since the hoax has completely collapsed there, as even the hasbara can see but won't admit ...... I suppose you could call my earlier remarks prescient ....

[IMGW=500]https://i.imgur.com/2B86AqR.jpg[/IMGW]

 

[Saggy]

Morgen's testimony is not helpful to deniers.

Morgen's career demolishes the holohoax. And his testimony is a slightly weird bag, but deniers love it. Morgen was tortured and threatened at Nuremberg to implicate Isla(?) Koch, but refused. He testified that Buchenwald was a great place to be with many amenities (I'm not going to look it up right now), and he testified that there was a Jewish wedding party at one of the Reinhard camps.

Then his testimony veered off for a bit, and he testified that the Jews were responsible for the hoax as they were the ones who implemented it, and that there were gas chambers at Monowitz. The only explanation for these absurdities is that Morgen had to give something in exchange for his life, but insisted on protecting the SS.

 

[Dash80]

Morgen's career demolishes the holohoax. And his testimony is a slightly weird bag, but deniers love it. Morgen was tortured and threatened at Nuremberg to implicate Isla(?) Koch, but refused. He testified that Buchenwald was a great place to be with many amenities (I'm not going to look it up right now), and he testified that there was a Jewish wedding party at one of the Reinhard camps.

Then his testimony veered off for a bit, and he testified that the Jews were responsible for the hoax as they were the ones who implemented it, and that there were gas chambers at Monowitz. The only explanation for these absurdities is that Morgen had to give something in exchange for his life, but insisted on protecting the SS.

Source? Quotes?

I've read Morgen's testimonies and you are butchering it, lying again Saggy?

Of course, if you have indeed read Morgen's testimony, you would also know he also stated that Reinhard camp was exterminating Jews. Whoops, forgot that part did you?

 

[Saggy]

Another falsehood. Hilberg has over 3,400 footnotes - just 4 cite Wiernik and none cite only Wiernik.

Out of curiosity, how many times have you read Hilberg's 3 volumes?

I read the condensed version. Citiing Wiernik is equivalent to citing Irene Zisblatt. And the 'crucial' eyewitnesses, Rosenberg, Meuller, Vrba & ???, are no better. Just complete idiocy.

Which, of course, is why my challenge to name one credible Jewish eyewitness and summarize/discuss their testimony, along with any corroborating testimony, and and physical or documentary evidence that supports the testimony, goes unanswered (except for link farms of course).

Denierbud shows and discusses the Wiernik references in Hilberg in his long suppressed but now back on line vid,....

One Third of the Holohoax

 

[Dash80]

I read the condensed version. Citiing Wiernik is equivalent to citing Irene Zisblatt. And the 'crucial' eyewitnesses, Rosenberg, Meuller, Vrba & ???, are no better. Just complete idiocy.

Which, of course, is why my challenge to name one credible Jewish eyewitness and summarize/discuss their testimony, along with any corroborating testimony, and and physical or documentary evidence that supports the testimony, goes unanswered (except for link farms of course).

Denierbud shows and discusses the Wiernik references to his long suppressed but now back on line vid,....

One Third of the Holohoax

Here, knock yourself out:

http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/index-of-published-evidence-on.html?m=1

 

[Saggy]

S
Of course, if you have indeed read Morgen's testimony, you would also know he also stated that Reinhard camp was exterminating Jews. Whoops, forgot that part did you?

I didn't forget, mentioning that Morgen said that the Jews ran the extermination program (and not the SS) (in the Reinhard camps). Just completely absurd. It's in the avalon library and easy to find.

 

[abaddon]

I read the condensed version. Citiing Wiernik is equivalent to citing Irene Zisblatt. And the 'crucial' eyewitnesses, Rosenberg, Meuller, Vrba & ???, are no better. Just complete idiocy.

Which, of course, is why my challenge to name one credible Jewish eyewitness and summarize/discuss their testimony, along with any corroborating testimony, and and physical or documentary evidence that supports the testimony, goes unanswered (except for link farms of course).

Denierbud shows and discusses the Wiernik references in Hilberg in his long suppressed but now back on line vid,....

One Third of the Holohoax

Are the Nazi eyewitnesses credible? Do you accept their testimony?

 

[Belz...]

Yeah what about Rudolf Höss?

 

[Dash80]

I didn't forget, mentioning that Morgen said that the Jews ran the extermination program (and not the SS) (in the Reinhard camps). Just completely absurd. It's in the avalon library and easy to find.

How about you stop being dishonest with your "interpretation" of testimony and give a direct link to Morgen's own words?

EDIT: Unsurprisingly that's not what Morgen actually said at all. Shocker.

https://forum.axishistory.com//viewtopic.php?p=50653#50653

 

[Border Reiver]

Yeah what about Rudolf Höss?

Or Standartenfuhrer Karl Jager?

Surely we can trust the words of an SS officer.

 

[LemmyCaution]

.. Thanks for sharing. But, it's a little suprising that you'd bring up my prior comments on Majdanek, the one camp I've visited, by chance before I was a denier, since the hoax has completely collapsed there, as even the hasbara can see but won't admit ...... I suppose you could call my earlier remarks prescient ....

[IMGW=500]https://i.imgur.com/2B86AqR.jpg[/IMGW]

More dishonesty. Tell us the number of Jews said by Hilberg in 1961 to have been murdered at Majdanek.

You don't want to debate Majdanek with me. Just sayin'. Even more than you don't like debating other aspects of the Holocaust with me.

Btw when he gave up on denial Black Rabbit of Inle - who went so far as to make a dishonest and error filled video about me on Majdanek - came to accept that gassing of Jews occurred there in the bunker north of building no. 41. He also gave up on Eric Hunt's botched account of the bathhouses and bunker.

 

[Degeneve]

If you can present one credible Jewish eyewitness and discuss their testimony, along with corroborating testimony, and physical or documentary evidence that supports their testimony do so.

Does this mean that for you, nazis eyewitnesses, along with corroborating testimony, and physical or documentary evidence are not credible?

 

[Degeneve]

Claiming this photo is evidence of the hoax is pure idiocy. Way beyond rational comment.

It shows simultaneously the chutzpah and the desperation of the hoaxers.

As a matter of fact a single photo will never make an evidence. The problem for you is that there is much more than a single photo. There are hundreds of photos (and even movie footage) much more explicit that this one which clearly show mass murders. If this would not be enough there are also thousands of nazis documents who show beyond any reasonable doubt that the nazis have mass murdered millions of Jews. And the mass graves that can still be found in Ukraine, Belarus and other placeS. To which one can also add the radio communications of the Orndnungspolizei and other SS units (including the Einsatzkommandos) intercepted during the war by the Brits which confirm that there were mass murders on the East front. Finally all these material evidences are confirmed by numerous testimonies of victims, executioners and other witnesses.

If you had just a little bit knowledge of the History you would know that. But all what you have managed to achieve so far is to prove us that you are an ignorant idiot.