nurse cuffed by cop for not breaking law

[bonzombiekitty]

What part of a hospital policy compels and binds the cop to obey it?

They didn't abide by the agreement they had already made.

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My understanding is that what the cop wanted was illegal in and of itself. There is no implied consent, so they can't just go and take blood from an unconscious patient without a warrant or the patient being under arrest. The agreement was just spelling out how to the hospital and police are supposed to handle such an issue.

 

[Delphic Oracle]

My understanding is that what the cop wanted was illegal in and of itself. There is no implied consent, so they can't just go and take blood from an unconscious patient without a warrant or the patient being under arrest. The agreement was just spelling out how to the hospital and police are supposed to handle such an issue.

And when presented with this information, they...?

Did the right thing and dutifully obtained a warrant?

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[Dr. Keith]

My take is that a good supervisor would have told the nurse to leave the scene and would have taken over the conversation with the cop and moved it away form the patient.

Nurse W, can you please go talk to (some one in another part of the building) while nurse (other nurse) takes over your patients. Thank you. Hello officer, I understand you need to talk to someone about a a blood draw, lets go to my office and see what we can do to help you with that. Don't worry, the patient is going anywhere, but I can't help you down here. (turn and walk towards office)​

Then you get the cop to call his supervisor on speaker phone and have a supervisor to supervisor conversation with the Hospital's General Counsel or AGC on the line as well, so the cops understand the severity of what is happening.

The cop was most wrong here, but the hospital was unprepared for how wrong the cop was. Maybe that isn't their fault, but I would expect better crisis management from seasoned administrators. My kid's middle school principal could have handled this better.

 

[pgwenthold]

Yes. Well, the supervisor, anyways. "Step back sir, I'm asking her. If you keep interfering with my questioning of her, I will arrest you for obstruction of legal process, now step back" (maybe a hand on a taser for emphasis).

We're in a thread about a cop arresting someone for absurd reasons, after all.

This is my take on it as well. The cop is completely in the wrong here, and there is nothing the hospital should have done differently. It's not about having a supervisor there, or what she was wearing, the cop committed the violation.

The suggestion here is that the cop might have not done his violation had he been dealing with a higher authority, but there is no reason to think that as far as I can see. He would have just arrested the supervisor instead (or, as well).

I understand the argument that this should have been dealt with by management, but no, she had the proper authority. She cited the policy involved. What's the supervisor going to do? Come down and say, "Yeah, that's the policy"? Sure, the supervisor would have her back, but all that means is that they are going down together.

The cop was wrong, and unreasonable. It's not the hospital's fault.

 

[pgwenthold]

Worst case scenario: Yes. The nurse should not have had to deal with the cop..

Nurses deal with cops all the time, and they do it in a colleagial manner. That's because the cops treat it that way.

However, when the cops decide that rights don't matter, it doesn't matter who they are working with, it's wrong.

 

[bonzombiekitty]

Nurses deal with cops all the time, and they do it in a colleagial manner. That's because the cops treat it that way.

Yes, nurses can deal with cops as you said in a colleagial manner. This was not such a situation though. The cop was being obstinate, it's not the nurse's job to deal with that. My mom worked as a nurse in an ER for 20 years, she would interact with cops often, and as far as I know any sort of disagreement between them were handled pretty amicably. The nurses were generally friends with the cops actually and had been known to do things like let them out of speeding tickets and the like.

However, when the cops decide that rights don't matter, it doesn't matter who they are working with, it's wrong.

I'm not saying otherwise. I'm saying the administration left the nurse out to dry and to deal with a situation that had gone completely out of her scope of what she should have had to deal with. The cop is still totally in the wrong, but it shouldn't have been left to the nurse to deal with how wrong the cop was. That's a job for people higher up the ladder. The administration utterly failed to properly support their employee.

Once it became clear the cop was not going to listen to nurse and continued being obstinate, a supervisor should have been present, and told the nurse to continue her normal duties until the situation was resolved and then been the person interacting with the cop. Whether the cop would have excused the nurse or what-not is irrelevant, as it is what the hospital admin should have done regardless.

 

[3point14]

I don't really think hospitals should need special procedures for policemen that enter the hospital intent on breaking the law.

 

[Dr. Keith]

I don't really think hospitals should need special procedures for policemen that enter the hospital intent on breaking the law.

Agreed. They need procedures for dealing with anyone that is taking up so much of a nurse's time that she is not able to perform her duties as a nurse. Whether that person is a police officer, politician, news crew, celebrity, crazed relative, zombie, grieving parent, lawyer, judge, waste disposal engineer, insurance salesman, proselytizing Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, or anyone else.

 

[SteveL]

Agreed. They need procedures for dealing with anyone that is taking up so much of a nurse's time that she is not able to perform her duties as a nurse. Whether that person is a police officer, politician, news crew, celebrity, crazed relative, zombie, grieving parent, lawyer, judge, waste disposal engineer, insurance salesman, proselytizing Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, or anyone else.

Yes, to this. They did have procedures for dealing with the hilited examples, and even had some people there to deal with those disruptive individuals (the university police). What they didn't have was a procedure to handle an out of control cop, hopefully because it never occurred to anyone that they'd need to do that. Now they do.

 

[Dr. Keith]

Yes, to this. They did have procedures for dealing with the hilited examples, and even had some people there to deal with those disruptive individuals (the university police). What they didn't have was a procedure to handle an out of control cop, hopefully because it never occurred to anyone that they'd need to do that. Now they do.

To me it is the same procedure you use to deal with any other person you have a respectful disagreement with. In other words, a news crew or politician would get the same treatment as a cop while a homeless person may see a different response. But the response should never be "leave the front line nurse to handle it".

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Agreed. They need procedures for dealing with anyone that is taking up so much of a nurse's time that she is not able to perform her duties as a nurse. Whether that person is a police officer, politician, news crew, celebrity, crazed relative, zombie, grieving parent, lawyer, judge, waste disposal engineer, insurance salesman, proselytizing Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, or anyone else.

This ^

And that is what the house supervisor's job is. Their job is to deal with unhappy people if any situation with nursing staff escalates.

And all this nonsense about what the cop would have done if a supervisor intervened is an exercise in pure silliness.

 

[Bob001]

Agreed. They need procedures for dealing with anyone that is taking up so much of a nurse's time that she is not able to perform her duties as a nurse. Whether that person is a police officer, politician, news crew, celebrity, crazed relative, zombie, grieving parent, lawyer, judge, waste disposal engineer, insurance salesman, proselytizing Mormons, Jehovahs Witnesses, or anyone else.

Wouldn't a zombie deserve a nurse's help? "Stay with me! You're not dead until I say you're dead!"

 

[Dr. Keith]

Wouldn't a zombie deserve a nurse's help? "Stay with me! You're not dead until I say you're dead!"

That's the thing, it is outside the nurses purview. Already dead or unable to die, however you take it, the nurse doesn't have the tools to deal with that. It's a bureaucrats game at that point.

 

[Bob001]

That's the thing, it is outside the nurses purview. Already dead or unable to die, however you take it, the nurse doesn't have the tools to deal with that. It's a bureaucrats game at that point.

"Sir, I'm the house supervisor. Let me give you this brochure about our hospice partners."

 

[Belz...]

Wouldn't a zombie deserve a nurse's help? "Stay with me! You're not undead until I say you're undead!"

Fixed.

 

[Dr. Keith]

"Sir, I'm the house supervisor. Let me give you this brochure about our hospice partners."

Nah, hospice is only cost efficient for end of life. The undead need more managed care to preserve bits from falling off. Gotta look for the up-sell here, unless they poor. That's what the back door is for.

 

[jimbob]

Nah, hospice is only cost efficient for end of life. The undead need more managed care to preserve bits from falling off. Gotta look for the upset here, unless they poor. That's what the back door is for.

No more nails?

 

[Dr. Keith]

No more nails?

Sorry, autocorrect did not like upsell so I had to edit my post after your reply. Still I have no idea if the s DIY joke or a crucifixion joke.

 

[jimbob]

Sorry, autocorrect did not like upsell so I had to edit my post after your reply. Still I have no idea if the s DIY joke or a crucifixion joke.

Joke? I thought you wanted a serious answer for how zombies could economically deal with bits dropping off. Glue seems a good answer. I suppose Duck tape would be more standard.



<goes off in a huff>

 

[Dr. Keith]

Joke? I thought you wanted a serious answer for how zombies could economically deal with bits dropping off. Glue seems a good answer. I suppose Duck tape would be more standard.



<goes off in a huff>

Understood.