Atheists thought immoral, even by fellow atheists: study

[The Big Dog]

Here is a summary of an interesting new study that reveals that Atheists thought immoral, even by fellow atheists.

And it revealed that "atheists are broadly perceived as potentially morally depraved and dangerous."

The study measured the attitudes of more than 3,000 people in 13 countries on five continents.

They ranged from "very secular" countries such as China and the Netherlands, to countries with high numbers of believers such as the United Arab Emirates, United States, and India.

Although not terribly surprising, the conclusion that it was due to "bias" seems like wishful thinking

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Excuse me but the study does not support the thread title or the news title.

Participants were given a description of a fictional evildoer who tortured animals as a child, then grows up to become a teacher who murders and mutilates five homeless people.
Half of the group were asked how likely it was that the perpetrator was a religious believer, and the other half how likely that he was an atheist.

Anyone care to point out the blatantly obvious logic fail here?

 

[The Big Dog]

Here is the actual paper referenced in the link in the OP.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-017-0151

I look forward to your thoughts.

 

[The Big Dog]

Excuse me but the study does not support the thread title or the news title.

Anyone care to point out the blatantly obvious logic fail here?

I am not sure that folks are just going to take your word for it, can you articulate an objection?

 

[thaiboxerken]

Half were asked one question, and the other half a different question?! LOL

Wow.

 

[The Big Dog]

Here is the actual paper referenced in the link in the OP.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-017-0151

I look forward to your thoughts.

Half were asked one question, and the other half a different question?! LOL

Wow.

the methodology is laid out in detail in the linked paper, can you articulate why you think the methodology is not appropriate?

 

[JayUtah]

the methodology is laid out in detail in the linked paper, can you articulate why you think the methodology is not appropriate?

The authors' conclusions are laid out in the linked paper. Can you articulate why you think they're "wishful thinking?"

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I am not sure that folks are just going to take your word for it, can you articulate an objection?

Oh for pity's sake:

If A then B
If B does not mean then A

Or if you need it dumbed down more than that:

If animal torturing serial killer then atheist (for any number of reasons).
If atheist does not mean then an animal torturing serial killer.

The researchers asked people if the animal torturing serial killer is likely to be an atheist or a theist.

That doesn't say jack about whether people think atheists as a whole are immoral.

It could be as simple as people viewing animal torturing serial killers as being psychopaths and psychopaths not likely to care about anyone including gods.

There is a lot of BS research confirming the bias people have that somehow god beliefs make a person behave morally, as if fear of hell and/or God's wrath actually crosses peoples' minds when deciding whether to do something like steal.

Most atheists know better so I can't see how they'd see atheists as less moral.

 

[fuelair]

While it is possible the described perp was an atheist, it is just as/more likely he/she was a fundamentalist religionist. That (and assuming even actually true) it is basically badly biased in the description and it, at best, demonstrates how to prove there are a lot of tools and fools out there. Trumpf voters being a perfect example of the type.

 

[fuelair]

Oh for pity's sake:

If A then B
If B does not mean then A

Or if you need it dumbed down more than that:

If animal torturing serial killer then atheist (for any number of reasons).
If atheist does not mean then an animal torturing serial killer.

The researchers asked people if the animal torturing serial killer is likely to be an atheist or a theist.

That doesn't say jack about whether people think atheists as a whole are immoral.

It could be as simple as people viewing animal torturing serial killers as being psychopaths and psychopaths not likely to care about anyone including gods.

There is a lot of BS research confirming the bias people have that somehow god beliefs make a person behave morally, as if fear of hell and/or God's wrath actually crosses peoples' minds when deciding whether to do something like steal.

Most atheists know better so I can't see how they'd see atheists as less moral.

This definitely also!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

While it is possible the described perp was an atheist, it is just as/more likely he/she was a fundamentalist religionist. That (and assuming even actually true) it is basically badly biased in the description and it, at best, demonstrates how to prove there are a lot of tools and fools out there. Trumpf voters being a perfect example of the type.

The study was only looking at people's biases, not at actual facts.

 

[fuelair]

The study was only looking at people's biases, not at actual facts.

Understood that!!! Specifically meant that the description could fit either personality format/belief system!!!

 

[John Jones]

Here is a summary of an interesting new study that reveals that Atheists thought immoral, even by fellow atheists.

And it revealed that "atheists are broadly perceived as ...

It never happened. Play nice or be recognized as a Jabba-type immoral example.

 

[Aepervius]

I was about to answer but I see SG already did.

TL;DR :
1) study is about perception of immorality, not factual immorality, which would require a study of acts by the two groups (theist , atheist)
2) They presented an utterly immoral situation from the onset which does not match believer credo and ask if it is likely to be an unbeliever. Practically a tautology. Change the story of "this guy kill prostitute in the name of god" (a real example : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Sutcliffe) and I am betting the results would be reversed. Their story is not unbiased.

 

[Tommy Jeppesen]

Here is the God that I believe in and it is an absurd joke. God was bored and created the Devil and asked the Devil for a fun idea.
The Devil answered in this manner: “You are the first unmoved mover and nothing can be without you as the first cause, right?
God: Yes!
Devil: Okay, so you caused the logic and illogical?
God: Yes!
Devil: So you can cause an illogical universe with human in it, for which you haven't created this universe and there is no Heaven, Hell, Souls or what ever. When these humans die, they die and they are no more.
God: Sweat, I will do so.
And God did so!!!

Yes, I am in practice an atheist and all that it means is that I believe differently that theists. Big deal

So if it makes you feel better to point out that some humans are amoral according to your morality, you do so. That is how you believe.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

I was about to answer but I see SG already did.

TL;DR :
1) study is about perception of immorality, not factual immorality, which would require a study of acts by the two groups (theist , atheist)
2) They presented an utterly immoral situation from the onset which does not match believer credo and ask if it is likely to be an unbeliever. Practically a tautology. Change the story of "this guy kill prostitute in the name of god" (a real example : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Sutcliffe) and I am betting the results would be reversed. Their story is not unbiased.

Good points.

 

[Hlafordlaes]

I say we use this space to discuss how the Man in the Moon makes craters with his pinkie. Far more important a topic.

 

[Darat]

Here is a summary of an interesting new study that reveals that Atheists thought immoral, even by fellow atheists.

And it revealed that "atheists are broadly perceived as potentially morally depraved and dangerous."

The study measured the attitudes of more than 3,000 people in 13 countries on five continents.

They ranged from "very secular" countries such as China and the Netherlands, to countries with high numbers of believers such as the United Arab Emirates, United States, and India.

Although not terribly surprising, the conclusion that it was due to "bias" seems like wishful thinking

Even if your summary was correct - "So what?"

 

[Sideroxylon]

Here is a summary of an interesting new study that reveals that Atheists thought immoral, even by fellow atheists.

And it revealed that "atheists are broadly perceived as potentially morally depraved and dangerous."

The study measured the attitudes of more than 3,000 people in 13 countries on five continents.

They ranged from "very secular" countries such as China and the Netherlands, to countries with high numbers of believers such as the United Arab Emirates, United States, and India.

Although not terribly surprising, the conclusion that it was due to "bias" seems like wishful thinking

You might want to back that up with criminal surveys that track religiosity. As I recall prison surveys dont offer your desired outcome, perhaps due to find God aiding parole.

 

[Sideroxylon]

The authors' conclusions are laid out in the linked paper. Can you articulate why you think they're "wishful thinking?"

I think its the charactisation of the findings being prejudice. This is a survey of perceptions. I wonder if the OP also thinks the perceptions are grounded in fact.