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Destroyed Atlantis = Menorah

King of the Americas said:
If the definition of Atlantis is a sunken city/civilization now at the bottom of the Atlantic, and I showed you sunken ruins off the Spanish coast...I thusly qualify those as "Atlantan"...

If the connection there is unclear, I'll lend you my ruler.
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But, that is not the definition of Atlantis. Atlantis is properly defined as a fictional representative of a fictional city destroyed for fictional reasons as a literary warning. Not the first of such, not the last of such, but not real!!!
 
King of the Americas said:
Goolge Earth has become a poor-man's archaeology hobby.

Unknown sites are popping up everywhere someone looks.

There's a Ted Talk about modern spectroscopy and how it can determine where ruins are because the vegetation above it has different signature due to mineral and soil differences that produce different color leaves. Pretty cool stuff...
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It is a good tool to find crop marks and other indicators of past physical culture. However, it won't tell you the name of the city.
 
fuelair said:
But, that is not the definition of Atlantis. Atlantis is properly defined as a fictional representative of a fictional city destroyed for fictional reasons as a literary warning. Not the first of such, not the last of such, but not real!!!
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No, it has not.
 
Craig4 said:
It is a good tool to find crop marks and other indicators of past physical culture. However, it won't tell you the name of the city.
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I don't believe the actual name is important...

We have a myth of a sunk city/civilization named Atlantis. Finding sunken ruins named "Admantiz" would mean what, exactly, that "Atlantis" never existed, or that the original myth was indeed true?

I hold that sunken ruins in the Atlantic off the Spanish coast are by definition Atlantan.
 
You were yelling and screaming at us for daring to doubt the factuality of the great Plato and his great attention to details and accuracy upon which his reputation supposedly depended, but when it suits you, you just claim that everything Plato wrote can be ignored, as long as we find a tiny little ruin that's under water.
The location is irrelevant, the size doesn't matter, nor does the dating, shape, culture. Plato can get all of those wrong, but still needs to be regarded as an historian who would never write something that isn't factual because...
Well, because you don't have an argument to make.


Of course, we've been over this before, but you don't listen.
 
Porpoise of Life said:
You were yelling and screaming at us for daring to doubt the factuality of the great Plato and his great attention to details and accuracy upon which his reputation supposedly depended, but when it suits you, you just claim that everything Plato wrote can be ignored, as long as we find a tiny little ruin that's under water.
The location is irrelevant, the size doesn't matter, nor does the dating, shape, culture. Plato can get all of those wrong, but still needs to be regarded as an historian who would never write something that isn't factual because...
Well, because you don't have an argument to make.


Of course, we've been over this before, but you don't listen.
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History MUST, ALL of it be mined for truth.

Sunken city, at the bottom of the Atlantic, that we have yet to study/name/excavate is proof that Plato was wrong...?

Ummm, yeah, well, see....You are ...difficult...for me to be 'gentle' with, here.

Edited by jsfisher: 
<snip> Edited for compliance with Rule 11 of the Membership Agreement.
 
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No, can't blame you. It's much easier to ignore valid criticism if you can't actually see it. It's not as if you haven't been ignoring everything I've posted so far.
Now, whether or not the internet equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and going nananananana is the mature thing to do? I'll leave that to the other posters to decide.
 
King of the Americas said:
Yes, I NEVER argued it was not a lamp.

You went through a lot of trouble to flap your wings about, but you never got off the ground.

Why "7" and why this "pattern"...where did this symbolism come from?

Also, your evidence proves that this biblical authority "shown" the "pattern" to them. They didn't create it, on their own. Their religious authority just pointed to it, and said this is cool, build it.

You've only re-provided proof that the symbol was adopted, and you have not produced an alternative for the origin of symbolism behind the artifact people now worship.
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I think it has been mentioned before, but I think it is worth repeating. The number seven is important in judaism.

http://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/judaism-numbers/
(I am sorry for the missing parts. I assume it is pictures that have not been copied. /Hgus)
Seven

Seven is one of the greatest power numbers in Judaism, representing Creation, good fortune, and blessing. A Hebrew word for luck, gad, equals seven in gematria. Another Hebrew word for luck, mazal, equals 77.

The Bible is replete with things grouped in sevens. Besides the Creation and the exalted status of the Sabbath, the seventh day, there are seven laws of Noah and seven Patriarchs and Matriarchs. Several Jewish holidays are seven days long, and priestly ordination takes seven days. The Land of Israel was allowed to lie fallow one year in seven. The

in the Temple has seven branches. The prophet Zechariah describes a strange celestial stone with seven eyes (Chapter 4).

This emphasis on seven continues post-biblically with seven wedding blessings, seven circuits performed about a groom, and seven days of mourning after the death of a close relative.

Events, prayers,and esoteric observances that involve multiples of seven are also common. Entities both natural (gold) and supernatural (angels) are often grouped by sevens (I Enoch 20; II Enoch 19). Seven is a factor in many occult elements and events.

The first verse of the
consists of seven words and seven is the recurrent number in Pharaoh’s divinatory dreams in Genesis. The walls of Jericho fall after the Israelites encircle it seven times. In the Zohar, the seven lower sefirot are those aspects of God that are present in asiyah, our world of action. Seven is also the preferred number in spells, magic squares, amulets, and the like (Genesis 7:2; I Kings 18:43; Deuteronomy 16:9; Pesahim 54a; Sotah 10b).
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Significance_of_numbers_in_Judaism
7:
The gematria of the Hebrew letter ז
The number 7 is the Divine number of completion
A covenant promise (in Hebrew, the expression literally translated as "to seven oneself" means "to swear a covenant")[2]
The general symbol for all association with God; the favorite religious number of Judaism, typifying the covenant of holiness and sanctification, and also all that was holy and sanctifying in purpose
The Seventh Day, the Sabbath
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I think we can all agree, that the design of the light source in the holiest room in the temple is going to be deeply symbolic. I claim that it is much more likely that the source of the design lies in Judaism number tradition, rather then in adapting a symbol of a foreign city. So that is my alternative theory: A design based on Jewish number symbolism.
King of the Americas said:
Also, your evidence proves that this biblical authority "shown" the "pattern" to them. They didn't create it, on their own. Their religious authority just pointed to it, and said this is cool, build it.

You've only re-provided proof that the symbol was adopted, and you have not produced an alternative for the origin of symbolism behind the artifact people now worship.
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Why do you think it is impossible for the priests, or god, did not point at a design of there own making?
 
hgus said:
I think it has been mentioned before, but I think it is worth repeating. The number seven is important in judaism.

http://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/judaism-numbers/
(I am sorry for the missing parts. I assume it is pictures that have not been copied. /Hgus)


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Significance_of_numbers_in_Judaism
7: [/HILITE]

Agreed.

Then why not KEEP the "7"...why allow it to evolve and or change to 8 or 9, and become candles rather than lamps, and change its shape?

7- planets, days, toes on someone missing the piggy who had roast beef, none, and the one who wee'd all the way home. To some seven symbolized the 3 concentric circles of Atlantis, cut in half, and mistaken for a candle holder/lamp.

hgus said:
I think we can all agree, that the design of the light source in the holiest room in the temple is going to be deeply symbolic. I claim that it is much more likely that the source of the design lies in Judaism number tradition, rather then in adapting a symbol of a foreign city.

So that is my alternative theory: A design based on Jewish number symbolism.


Why do you think it is impossible for the priests, or god, did not point at a design of there own making?
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Lamps or candle holders? 7, 8, or 9 flames?

Number symbolism? Why not gold symbolism, light symbolism?

It is ALL 'made up' symbolism...

No one KNOWS exactly what the menorah means or represents, or why lamps turned to candles? (*Let's bring Herman Melville into this!? lol)

My point is, that it was an adopted symbol, otherwise meaningless to the Jewish people. They have applied their own meaning(s).

What would a Nazi say the swastika represents?
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King of the Americas said:
Number symbolism? Why not gold symbolism, light symbolism?

It is ALL 'made up' symbolism...

No one KNOWS exactly what the menorah means or represents, or why lamps turned to candles? (*Let's bring Herman Melville into this!? lol)

My point is, that it was an adopted symbol, otherwise meaningless to the Jewish.
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Well, you still haven't shown that the menorah was adopted rather than conceived by the Jews.

But yes, apart from the meaning people give a symbol, it has no meaning.

Which ties the menorah to Atlantis... how?
 
King of the Americas said:
History MUST, ALL of it be mined for truth.

Sunken city, at the bottom of the Atlantic, that we have yet to study/name/excavate is proof that Plato was wrong...?

Ummm, yeah, well, see....You are ...difficult...for me to be 'gentle' with, here.

Edited by jsfisher: 
<snip> Moderated content redacted.
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Translation
You've yet to proved anything to support your baseless claim ...<snip>...

Edited by jsfisher: 
Edited to remove response to redacted content.
 
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King of the Americas said:
Did you check out that Hancock video I linked?
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No I'm waiting for you to mine it and provide your support for your baseless claim...you know...here on this fourm, why don't you take a whack at it you might find it refreshing....I know we would ;)
 
Cervelo said:
No I'm waiting for you to mine it and provide your support for your baseless claim...you know...here on this fourm, why don't you take a whack at it you might find it refreshing....I know we would ;)
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Hancock presents HIS gold pan, after decades of HIS mining...the Ted 'reading' is only 18 minutes, and it has TONS of 'color' (gold miners' term).
 
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Cervelo said:
Yup....20 pages of appealing for you to support your baseless claim...
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I was referring to his placement on my Ignore List.

He flatly ignored the evidence I presented, and claimed it was proof Plato was wrong.

Baseless claim...?

You REALLY should not ignore links, and then claim someone is making baseless claims.
 
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