Destroyed Atlantis = Menorah

[Vixen]

The Menorah - Concentric Circles

I have no idea if the Menorah 'concentric circles' conforms to anything to do with Atlantis. However, I was intrigued enough to see whether it did form concentric circles when juxtaposed to itself.

Taking the photo I took of the stone relics excavated at Capernaum, dated by historians to AD1, and joining it to its inversion, I got the following, and they do indeed, look like concentric circles.

Bearing in mind, this is a sculpture hewn from stone, it's not a bad piece of geometry. The image is itself is much older than the date of the stone.

Given its pride of place on the artefact, it was likely considered an important symbol, being as it were the headstone of a temple/synagogue.

 

[King of the Americas]

I have no idea if the Menorah 'concentric circles' conforms to anything to do with Atlantis. However, I was intrigued enough to see whether it did form concentric circles when juxtaposed to itself.

Taking the photo I took of the stone relics excavated at Capernaum, dated by historians to AD1, and joining it to its inversion, I got the following, and they do indeed, look like concentric circles.

Bearing in mind, this is a sculpture hewn from stone, it's not a bad piece of geometry. The image is itself is much older than the date of the stone.

Given its pride of place on the artefact, it was likely considered an important symbol, being as it were the headstone of a temple/synagogue.

Thank you.

Add to that, that the base of the menorah is a 'fork', not a level base.

I think what we have here is cultural appropriation. One culture adopts symbols of another, not fully understanding its meanings or origins, bastardizing it to their own use.

 

[Vixen]

Not an ad-hom, because it refers to the argument put forth, not the arguer.

Anyhow, this link explains the weakness:
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/nat-geos-atlantis-rising-a-stew-of-fake-experts-motivated-reasoning-and-weird-claims-that-judaism-contains-atlantean-theology

Here's the relevant passage (why are we doing KOTA's sourcing for him?):

Jacobovici and Montexano, both standing in Spain, see a petroglyph composed of three upside-down arcs with a line drawn perpendicularly through them and declare it a Jewish menorah! The two men agree that Jewish menorahs are actually “an evolution of the Atlantean symbol of concentric circles,” a claim that lacks any factual foundation since Atlantis was, so far as we know, never symbolized as concentric rings. That was abstracted from Plato’s description of the city’s canals. Nevertheless, the two men conclude that the Bible reflects “Atlantean theology.”

Stop and consider that for a moment: A group of religious conspiracy theorists who already think Jesus is part of a secret conspiracy of ancient bloodlines now argue that Atlantis is the secret source of Judaism!

KOTA: We are none the wiser.

 

[Myriad]

As I understand it Atlantis was a hoax perpetrated by people like Madam Blavatsky and Edgar Cayce.

Some parts of the story are, especially if you add Dion Fortune to that list of names. Although, keep in mind that one person's "hoax" is another's "revelation of a deeper Truth that transcends mere history."

In any case, they're the ones who inflated Plato's version of Atlantis, a military threat to ancient Athens, into the capital of a world-spanning super-civilization of magical adepts, whose inundation resulted from over-use of bad magic despite the good magicians' opposition; the latter departing in the nick of time in a global diaspora that seeded the rise of every other known interesting ancient culture and began the occult traditions that to this day simultaneously preserve, and conceal from public view, the original Atlantean knowledge.

Thence, the idea that Atlantis was not just a lost civilization akin to other ancient civilizations of its time, but the focus of a lost age of magic and/or super-science, of which tempting traces can still be found (but remain so dangerous that they must also still be concealed). You know you're in the latter view when the amazing magical or technological powers of orichalcum come up for discussion.

The occult-history version has of course seeped into and colored the public perception of the Atlantis story, in part through such not-so-occult means as Hollywood movies (e.g. Atlantis, the Lost Continent, 1961, complete with mad scientists, power crystals, and good and evil high priests). Without this gussying up, people's relationships to the original Atlantis story would tend to be far more Platonic.

 

[Vixen]

Thank you.

Add to that, that the base of the menorah is a 'fork', not a level base.

I think what we have here is cultural appropriation. One culture adopts symbols of another, not fully understanding its meanings or origins, bastardizing it to their own use.

Here's a picture:

By Ellen Prokop - Own work, CC BY 3.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=35016696

 

[King of the Americas]

...You know you're in the latter view when the amazing magical or technological powers of orichalcum come up for discussion.

...

Micheal Jordan could not "fly," and Space Jam was a fictional movie.

Once the most recognizable figure on the planet, he now exists in the minds of many, part man, and part basketball-god.

Millennia from now, will images of him floating toward a dunk, Space Jam, and magic shoes that turned any normal player into a superstar be used to invalidate his existence, or to tell others they should not seek evidence of his actual existence?

I don't think Plato's narrative was one thing...nor a hoax. I don't know about a deeper truth transcending history, but I think because it is a part of our history, to treat it as pure fiction would be folly.

 

[Vixen]

Some parts of the story are, especially if you add Dion Fortune to that list of names. Although, keep in mind that one person's "hoax" is another's "revelation of a deeper Truth that transcends mere history."

In any case, they're the ones who inflated Plato's version of Atlantis, a military threat to ancient Athens, into the capital of a world-spanning super-civilization of magical adepts, whose inundation resulted from over-use of bad magic despite the good magicians' opposition; the latter departing in the nick of time in a global diaspora that seeded the rise of every other known interesting ancient culture and began the occult traditions that to this day simultaneously preserve, and conceal from public view, the original Atlantean knowledge.

Thence, the idea that Atlantis was not just a lost civilization akin to other ancient civilizations of its time, but the focus of a lost age of magic and/or super-science, of which tempting traces can still be found (but remain so dangerous that they must also still be concealed). You know you're in the latter view when the amazing magical or technological powers of orichalcum come up for discussion.

The occult-history version has of course seeped into and colored the public perception of the Atlantis story, in part through such not-so-occult means as Hollywood movies (e.g. Atlantis, the Lost Continent, 1961, complete with mad scientists, power crystals, and good and evil high priests). Without this gussying up, people's relationships to the original Atlantis story would tend to be far more Platonic.

AIUI neo-pagans and occultists - including Cayce - believed Atlantis contained a race of tall red-headed caucasians, and these were the advanced people of the ancient civilisations - including Egypt - not the brown-skinned natives we see today. Atlantis stories always makes me brace myself for this type of BS.

 

[Vixen]

Finally I have discovered what on earth The King of the Americas is talking about. The conspiracy-theorist filmakers equate Plato's capital city of Atlantis which was comprised of concentric circles of canals with an upside down Menorah.

I dare say this will be the next book idea for Dan Brown and film rights to star Tom Hanks as the mad professor running around ancient cities deciphering 'lost symbols'.

 

[King of the Americas]

Here's a picture:

By Ellen Prokop - Own work, CC BY 3.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=35016696

Check the date on that pic... 1600-1680.

---

"The symbols carved into the walls had distinct design resembling a bull’s eye standing on a stick with three legs. The ancient stone carvings in the Spanish shrines are strongly reminiscent of Plato’s description of the port of Atlantis: three concentric circular docks with a central rectangular temple to Poseidon, with a canal connecting out to the sea.

The symbol carved into the walls in Spain was an aerial view of the port Plato described, but with the canal depicted as Poseidon’s three-pronged trident,” Jacobovici explained.

Then Montexano showed him something even more remarkable. “In one of these of these shrines in Spain, the 3,000 year old carving is missing the top half of the bull’s eye. Montexano theorized that this symbolizes the refugees were praying for a restored Atlantis."

https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/...sh-temple-incredible-way/#xAfJALWrVWbSheVK.97

 

[Craig4]

The article is typical woo. Somebody knows so proper geologic terms and concepts. It's main failing is in using geofacts as supporting evidence when talking about past human physical culture. No amount of rocks is going to get you there absent artifacts.

 

[imodium]

Ahem

So...along the Spanish coast are remnants of 'half' of Atlantis...

, along the African coast you surely mean?
The given link shows the site to be next to Morocco.

Anyways, the Greeks weren't great sailors and Atlantis is a Greek legend, meaning it would have been around, Greece.
Akrotiri is the likely island, if the story has any base for truth, however logic makes it unsexy and not as much of a cash cow.

 

[King of the Americas]

The article is typical woo...

There used to be a roll eyes icon...where did it go?

 

[King of the Americas]

Ahem , along the African coast you surely mean?
The given link shows the site to be next to Morocco...

Sorry, the wrong link was issued.

 

[Craig4]

There used to be a roll eyes icon...where did it go?

You asked the question.

 

[Vixen]

Check the date on that pic... 1600-1680.

<snip>
---

Check the caption of that picture. It is explained that the drawing is to the specifications of Exodus.

 

[King of the Americas]

Check the caption of that picture. It is explained that the drawing is to the specifications of Exodus.

Sorry, did you mean that as a joke?

A 17th century rendering of a biblical text, likely re-written itself a few times...I don't think this is evidence of anything...

 

[Myriad]

AIUI neo-pagans and occultists - including Cayce - believed Atlantis contained a race of tall red-headed caucasians, and these were the advanced people of the ancient civilisations - including Egypt - not the brown-skinned natives we see today. Atlantis stories always makes me brace myself for this type of BS.

Yeah, that's another aspect of the occult-history version. As I understand it, the story of the Atlantis diaspora even figured (along with, somehow, the old Teutonic mythos) in the occult aspects of Nazi ideology, for that reason.

However, the racial aspect (in a nutshell, that the great prehistoric enlightened world-spanning advanced civilization was ancestral superior white folks) is not in play among all groups. I wouldn't, for instance, without a lot more evidence, accuse KotA of being motivated for his interest in alternative Atlantis history by racial concerns.

My point is that when Cameron or KotA talks about Atlantis being a cultural origin for other civilizations, such as the Hebrews, that's an aspect of the Atlantis story that harkens back to the modern occult-history version, not from anything Plato or other ancients wrote.

 

[Myriad]

Millennia from now, will images of him floating toward a dunk, Space Jam, and magic shoes that turned any normal player into a superstar be used to invalidate his existence, or to tell others they should not seek evidence of his actual existence?

I don't think Plato's narrative was one thing...nor a hoax. I don't know about a deeper truth transcending history, but I think because it is a part of our history, to treat it as pure fiction would be folly.

The existence of someplace that was the origin of the Atlantis story is indeed open to question as possible history, unless it's pure fiction instead.

The story of the Hebrews (or some significant portion of their culture) being Atlantis refugees (or influence therefrom), by virtue of their having one (1) religious symbol that can (if properly modified) resemble a characteristic of Plato's description of the physical layout of Atlantis, falls squarely into the Space Jam category. Without a lot more evidence, at least.

 

[King of the Americas]

Here's the relevant passage (why are we doing KOTA's sourcing for him?):



KOTA: We are none the wiser.

Not if you allow skeptics to disassociate you from facts on the ground, as they launch personal attacks on those who carry evidence they disapprove of...

This 'relevant passage' is just another personal attack.

"These people can't have anything good to say, they hate the baby Jesus!"

Pfft...

"a claim that lacks any factual foundation since Atlantis was, so far as we know, never symbolized as concentric rings"...???

Do a search for "symbols for Atlantis"...

 

[King of the Americas]

The existence of someplace that was the origin of the Atlantis story is indeed open to question as possible history, unless it's pure fiction instead.

The story of the Hebrews (or some significant portion of their culture) being Atlantis refugees (or influence therefrom), by virtue of their having one (1) religious symbol that can (if properly modified) resemble a characteristic of Plato's description of the physical layout of Atlantis, falls squarely into the Space Jam category. Without a lot more evidence, at least.

The evidence, at least in part, is that the menorah has in fact evolved. It was not as we see it today.

My point is that if we take it as pure fiction, then if it was in part, fact, we will never actually know of or find it...

Like Troy, it was not found, until people looked for it.

After watching Cameron's special, I find it difficult not to make clear connections, although I'd be in favor of much more underwater excavation.