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We live in a infinite universe

slipknot0129 said:
Yes the universe came from nothing.
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Don't you realise that this is logically impossible?


The universe came from an earlier state; one that happens to be timeless, which is a convenient way to avoid the "turtles all the way down" nonsense (look it up). It's simple and easy to understand, but for some reason you're stuck with the very common misconception that the universe came from nothing, which given your posts so far, you can't possibly know.
 
Just checking. Are you a rep-programmed bot? We don't get any actual answers, just repetition of the same assertions, so it feels like a conversation with a bot.
 
Argumemnon said:
Physical principle? What are you asking me?

First, we know that nothing can't come from something; that's logic and not physics, sure, but it's a good start.
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It's not a good start and neither is it true. Virtual particles are created from nothing all the time, as described by Heisenberg's equations and evidenced in the Casimir effect.

That the universe arose from nothing is not proven but is, I believe, accepted by most scientists as an approximate description of what happened at the time of the Big Bang (the only alternative, of course, being that the universe is timeless). With all this comes the rider that 'nothing' is not a particularly useful term in physics, and neither is 'something'. 'Nothing' means different things in different situations and being that the situation at T=0 is unknown, it is not a precise descriptor.

Argumemnon said:
Second, we know a bit about quantum mechanics now, enough to say that the universe is, most probably, a semi-stable bubble within the spacetime substrate. Note that the previous sentence is my wording. In any case it's not written in stone, but it's the best thing we have, which is a lot better than Slip's empty claim.
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That doesn't explain its origins and neither is it a description of our universe that I recognise.
 
Argumemnon said:
Don't you realise that this is logically impossible?


The universe came from an earlier state; one that happens to be timeless, which is a convenient way to avoid the "turtles all the way down" nonsense (look it up). It's simple and easy to understand, but for some reason you're stuck with the very common misconception that the universe came from nothing, which given your posts so far, you can't possibly know.
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It's common sense the universe came from nothing.
 
baron said:
That the universe arose from nothing is not proven but is, I believe, accepted by most scientists as an approximate description of what happened at the time of the Big Bang...
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No, I don't think that's accurate. The Big Bang theory specifically disavows any knowledge of what state, if any, may have existed prior to the Big Bang. There are no observations possible. Therefore to suggest that before the bang there was nothing is considered speculation only.
 
baron said:
It's not a good start and neither is it true. Virtual particles are created from nothing all the time, as described by Heisenberg's equations and evidenced in the Casimir effect.
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I expected you to bring them up. They're not created from nothing. They're created from the quantum substrate. "Nothing" doesn't exist. It's a human concept that has no correlation with reality.

That the universe arose from nothing is not proven but is, I believe, accepted by most scientists as an approximate description of what happened at the time of the Big Bang (the only alternative, of course, being that the universe is timeless).
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Maybe you should check your physics too, then. Because that's definitely not what they're saying. When someone says "nothing" and they mean "quantum state", that's not "nothing". It's definitely "something".

That doesn't explain its origins and neither is it a description of our universe that I recognise.
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What is your objection, exactly? Look up "false vacuum". There's a very real possibility that this is exactly what the universe is; a 'bubble' of essentially self-replicating reality with random physical laws that could "pop" at any moment.

Ignorance is no excuse for incredulity. No in this day and age.
 
slipknot0129 said:
It's common sense the universe came from nothing.
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It's not common sense at all. Common sense was that the universe was created by spirits. Then we thought it was immutable. Then we learned it's expanding. Now we know there's a basic "reality" underlying the whole thing.

Repeating the same nonsense over and over won't make your beliefs more true. You need to stop repeating yourself and educate yourself.

slipknot0129 said:
It's impossible for something to always have existed.
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Why not?

So the universe came from nothing.
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That doesn't follow from your previous statement. It could have come from another something.
 
JayUtah said:
No, I don't think that's accurate. The Big Bang theory specifically disavows any knowledge of what state, if any, may have existed prior to the Big Bang. There are no observations possible. Therefore to suggest that before the bang there was nothing is considered speculation only.
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Plus we have a good grasp of what's making reality tick, and we know time only exists within the context of the universe; so it's not a stretch to conclude that whatever the universe sprang up from, for lack of better terms, is timeless.
 
Argumemnon said:
I expected you to bring them up. They're not created from nothing. They're created from the quantum substrate. "Nothing" doesn't exist. It's a human concept that has no correlation with reality.
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What is the 'quantum substrate'? I've never even heard the term. It certainly has no physical meaning. How can this 'quantum substrate' be measured? What are its properties? Let's have some links.

Argumemnon said:
Maybe you should check your physics too, then. Because that's definitely not what they're saying. When someone says "nothing" and they mean "quantum state", that's not "nothing". It's definitely "something".
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The quantum state isn't a even a thing, is a bunch of attributes that describe a quantum system. Nothing can arise from a quantum state any more than it can from 'green' or '3.9Kg'.

Argumemnon said:
What is your objection, exactly? Look up "false vacuum". There's a very real possibility that this is exactly what the universe is; a 'bubble' of essentially self-replicating reality with random physical laws that could "pop" at any moment.

Ignorance is no excuse for incredulity. No in this day and age.
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Where have you got this from? Maybe if I can see it explained clearly I can pass comment. I have right beside me at least 40 layman's books on cosmology and quantum physics and I don't recall reading in any of them a hypothesis that resembles what you wrote.
 
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baron said:
What is the 'quantum substrate'? I've never even heard the term. It certainly has no physical meaning. How can this 'quantum substrate' be measured? What are its properties? Let's have some links.
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You hint further in your post that you're aware of the existence of a scientific theory known as quantum mechanics, but at the same time you're surprised -- shocked, even -- by the implications of that theory. It's like you know about it but have never bothered to read up on it, which doesn't fit with your other claims of having many books on the topic.

Anyway, read up.
 
slipknot0129 said:
I'll be in another universe that is better for life.
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Sorry, but I was just talking to God and he assured me that you are already in the very best universe that is now available, or ever will be available.

Therefore, you will just have to make the best of your time in this here universe.
 
slipknot0129 said:
We live in a infinite universe. So our souls are eternal. Our universe just keeps getting better and better because it has no limits. The thing that makes everything have so much order is love. Love is the strongest force in the universe. So there is a God. God did a great job making this universe.

Things like love, sex, fiction, and technology happen because we live in a infinite universe. We get better technology with time, the universe gets better overall with time. The universe came from nothing. Nothingness is infinite. So that's how the universe is able to evolved to be better with time. Basically time condensed nothingness to become physical. The force of God takes all this randomness and puts it all in perfect order. Our lives are in perfect order for eternity.
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Testify, brother.

(Just don't testify in court because very close to nothing you said has any logic to it whatsoever.)
 
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