Merged All things Trump + Russia

[JihadJane]

Why would I write my post to sound more certain than I am right now?

Although you have yet to substantiate the assertion, you appear to be certain that Putin influenced the elections by attacking Clinton.

 

[Belz...]

In what way Russia is an enemy of the United States of America?

Well, trying to undermine NATO and the US and expand their power base in the east at the expense of them counts, I think.

By definition, it is not possible for one country to commit an act of treason (the crime of betraying one's country) against another country.

I'm talking about Americans acting against their country by helping Russia undermine it.

How did Putin act on his alleged bias? How did Putin help Trump and his team? Real-life examples, please.

You can't possibly be this ignorant. We're talking about the DNC hacking to influence the elections and get people with Russian ties into the White House. How is this not acting on Putin's anti-Clinton bias?

Although you have yet to substantiate the assertion, you appear to be certain that Putin influenced the elections by attacking Clinton.

I'm reasonably certain because, unlike you, my opinions are not based on political ideology.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

No, we do not know that Putin hacked into DNC emails and dripped them out at convenient times. Please provide the evidence that leads you to believe otherwise.

Seriously, have you not kept up on this matter?

CIA concludes Russia interfered to help Trump win election, say reports

Agency reportedly believes individuals acting for Moscow hacked Democrat party emails and gave them to WikiLeaks

Reuters, The NYT and the WA Post all reported sources who revealed this was the CIA's conclusion.

A secret CIA assessment found that Russian operatives covertly interfered in the election campaign in an attempt to ensure the Republican candidate’s victory, the Washington Post reported, citing officials briefed on the matter.

A separate report in the New York Times said intelligence officials had a “high confidence” that Russia was involved in hacking related to the election....

A separate report in the New York Times, also sourced to unnamed officials, claimed US intelligence agencies had discovered that Russian hackers had also penetrated the Republican National Committee’s networks, but conspicuously chose to release only the information stolen from the Democrats.

A third report, by Reuters, said intelligence agencies assessed that as the campaign drew on, Russian government officials devoted increasing attention to assisting Trump’s effort to win the election. Virtually all the emails they released publicly were potentially damaging to Clinton and the Democrats, the official told Reuters.

You can choose to not believe these three separate corroborating reports. I choose to believe it. It's not like any official CIA report released to the public has any more cred than good investigative reporter sources.

 

[skyeagle409]

No, we do not know that Putin hacked into DNC emails and dripped them out at convenient times. Please provide the evidence that leads you to believe otherwise.

Let's take a look here.

Intel report: Putin directly ordered effort to influence election

Washington (CNN)The US intelligence community concluded in a declassified report released Friday that Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered an "influence campaign" aimed at hurting Hillary Clinton and helping Donald Trump in the 2016 presidential election.

The campaign -- which consisted of hacking Democratic groups and individuals, including Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta, and releasing that information via third-party websites, including WikiLeaks -- amounted to what the intelligence report called "a significant escalation" in longtime Russian efforts to undermine "the US-led liberal democratic order."

http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/06/politics/intelligence-report-putin-election/

 

[skyeagle409]

In what way Russia is an enemy of the United States of America?

Why do you think Russia has been testing our air defenses and buzzing our naval vessels? One of my chapters has ties to the 477th Fighter Group, which has been intercepting Russian bombers with their F-22 Raptors. The F-22 in the following picture is from the 477th Fighter Group, 302nd Fighter Squadron.

 

[JihadJane]

Why do you think Russia has been testing our air defenses and buzzing our naval vessels? One of my chapters has ties to the 477th Fighter Group, which has been intercepting Russian bombers with their F-22 Raptors. The F-22 in the following picture is from the 477th Fighter Group, 302nd Fighter Squadron.

[qimg]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ae/477th_Fighter_Group_-_F-22_Raptor.jpg/1280px-477th_Fighter_Group_-_F-22_Raptor.jpg[/qimg]

Self-defense.

 

[JihadJane]

Let's take a look here.

"With high confidence" is not evidence. It's speculation.

 

[JihadJane]

Seriously, have you not kept up on this matter?

CIA concludes Russia interfered to help Trump win election, say reports

Reuters, The NYT and the WA Post all reported sources who revealed this was the CIA's conclusion.You can choose to not believe these three separate corroborating reports. I choose to believe it. It's not like any official CIA report released to the public has any more cred than good investigative reporter sources.

Why do you believe the CIA?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Why do you believe the CIA?

Not the CIA, multiple leakers within their ranks.

But what's your alternative?

 

[JihadJane]

Well, trying to undermine NATO and the US and expand their power base in the east at the expense of them counts, I think.

How is Putin "trying to expand its power base in the east".?

I'm talking about Americans acting against their country by helping Russia undermine it.

OK

You can't possibly be this ignorant. We're talking about the DNC hacking to influence the elections and get people with Russian ties into the White House. How is this not acting on Putin's anti-Clinton bias?

The ignorance is yours. There is no evidence that Putin hacked into the DNC. How did Putin get "people with Russian ties into the White House"?

I'm reasonably certain because, unlike you, my opinions are not based on political ideology.

Look in the mirror, my friend. What is your reasonable certainty based on?

 

[Belz...]

How is Putin "trying to expand its power base in the east".?

Did you miss the whole Ukraine invasion thing?

I don't believe for a second that you're so ignorant of world events.

The ignorance is yours. There is no evidence that Putin hacked into the DNC.

You're the one who ignores the evidence, and then you say that the ignorance is mine? Beautiful.

How did Putin get "people with Russian ties into the White House"?

This isn't skeptical inquiry. This is a ten year-old asking "why" endlessly.

If you influence US elections to favour the guy who has ties to you, and he puts other people who have ties to you into his cabinet, then you have "gotten people with Russian tiest into the White House". Stop pretending to understand or know none of this.

Look in the mirror, my friend. What is your reasonable certainty based on?

Evidence.

 

[TofuFighter]

There is no evidence that Putin hacked into the DNC.

(my bolding)
Why are you so sure of this?

 

[Tony Stark]

Well certainly Putin himself certainly didn't hack anyone. He just ordered to have it done. Because he hates Hillary Clinton and believed Donald Trump would be his bitch.

 

[Trebuchet]

There's a perfectly good Trump + Russia thread. How about we take this off-topic discussion there?

 

[Trebuchet]

From the Syria missles wag the dog thread, in hopes of getting off topic discussion moved here:

Well certainly Putin himself certainly didn't hack anyone. He just ordered to have it done. Because he hates Hillary Clinton and believed Donald Trump would be his bitch.

He probably didn't even expect Trump to be his bitch, just the destabilization of the US government is an advantage to him.

 

[Mycroft]

The alternative is to not believe anything the CIA or any one else in power tells you, particularly when they are trying to start a war.

What's your evidence anyone is trying to start a war? Can all criticisms of any country be dismissed because you think they're trying to start a war?


Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

There is no evidence that Putin hacked into the DNC.

Seriously? That's your conclusion?

How did Putin get "people with Russian ties into the White House"?

Are you unaware of Tillerson's connections to Putin?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

There's a perfectly good Trump + Russia thread. How about we take this off-topic discussion there?

I agree.

 

[NoahFence]

Seriously? That's your conclusion?

Are you unaware of Tillerson's connections to Putin?

Come on. It's not like Putin gave him a medal or anything.

 

[skyeagle409]

Self-defense.

That is what an enemy would do and the Russians were doing it during the Cold War as well.