Merged All things Trump + Russia

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intlman said:
Try again-



The emotional reaction is so strong that you completely fabricate what "I want", because anyone who isn't actively bashing Trump must surely be in full support of him and want to put fingers in ears.
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What do you suggest then? Only that we shut up about it here?

intlman said:
And, evidence doesn't "suggest" a Trump conspiracy with Russia - not even a little.
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Quite a lot, actually. No fire yet, but quite a lot of smoke.

intlman said:
See? this is what I mean. It is now taken as fact, despite zero actual evidence or anything approaching it. Zero.
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Except for all the evidence, you mean?
 
intlman said:
Never before on this forum, in any other section, have I seen so many unsupported, outlandish, baseless or simply delusional assertions.
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Presumably, that's because you haven't been following the news and the evidence.

Seriously, if your spouse had financial interests in Russia, your uncle received a Friend of Russia medal from Putin himself, your father was a paid lobbyist for the Russian government, four of your cousins had contacts with the Russian ambassadors, your mother was involved in an incident where she was contacted by Russian spies for information, your sister had lied about her Russian contacts under oath, your family lawyer was a former financial advisor for the pro-Putin Ukranian dictator, and you yourself had large loans from a bank that dealt in laundering dirty Russian money, in addition to a scandal in which a rival family had been hacked by Russian intelligence and smeared in an online campaign to discredit them and net you a lucrative contract for your family business, you don't think it'd be reasonable to assume that you had knowledge of all this and used it to your family's advantage? You don't think It'd be reasonable to conclude that your family was in bed with the Russians?

That's some serious benefit of the doubt you're giving Trump, here.
 
intlman said:
Try again-



The emotional reaction is so strong that you completely fabricate what "I want", because anyone who isn't actively bashing Trump must surely be in full support of him and want to put fingers in ears.

And, evidence doesn't "suggest" a Trump conspiracy with Russia - not even a little.

See? this is what I mean. It is now taken as fact, despite zero actual evidence or anything approaching it. Zero.
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For someone who's complaining about the skepticism of others, you've offered ZERO reasons to change anyone's minds.

How about you address all of those Trump-Russia links I mentioned above (but in their actual context)?
 
intlman said:
<snip for brevity>
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Unimpressive. When you don't point out with specificity what you object to, it renders your criticism useless. Posters who are perhaps guilty of the sins you accuse are deprived of enlightenment, because they don't know if your comments apply. You too might be deprived of enlightenment, because they may have cogent replies. Lacking specificity, your post is an empty diatribe.
 
trustbutverify said:
I would accept that there was no coordination/direct communication between the Trump Campaign and Russian officials in their efforts to damage Clinton with stolen, private information.
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I didn't mean if you would accept it, but how it would make you feel. Would you be relieved​? Disappointed?
 
Argumemnon said:
Presumably, that's because you haven't been following the news and the evidence.

Seriously, if your spouse had financial interests in Russia, your uncle received a Friend of Russia medal from Putin himself, your father was a paid lobbyist for the Russian government, four of your cousins had contacts with the Russian ambassadors, your mother was involved in an incident where she was contacted by Russian spies for information, your sister had lied about her Russian contacts under oath, your family lawyer was a former financial advisor for the pro-Putin Ukranian dictator, and you yourself had large loans from a bank that dealt in laundering dirty Russian money, in addition to a scandal in which a rival family had been hacked by Russian intelligence and smeared in an online campaign to discredit them and net you a lucrative contract for your family business, you don't think it'd be reasonable to assume that you had knowledge of all this and used it to your family's advantage? You don't think It'd be reasonable to conclude that your family was in bed with the Russians?

That's some serious benefit of the doubt you're giving Trump, here.
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The highlighted part - in addition to a scandal in which a rival family had been hacked by Russian intelligence and smeared in an online campaign to discredit them, when someone in your family announces the smears in advance of them being publically released
 
Argumemnon said:
Presumably, that's because you haven't been following the news and the evidence.

Seriously, if your spouse had financial interests in Russia, your uncle received a Friend of Russia medal from Putin himself, your father was a paid lobbyist for the Russian government, four of your cousins had contacts with the Russian ambassadors, your mother was involved in an incident where she was contacted by Russian spies for information, your sister had lied about her Russian contacts under oath, your family lawyer was a former financial advisor for the pro-Putin Ukranian dictator, and you yourself had large loans from a bank that dealt in laundering dirty Russian money, in addition to a scandal in which a rival family had been hacked by Russian intelligence and smeared in an online campaign to discredit them and net you a lucrative contract for your family business, you don't think it'd be reasonable to assume that you had knowledge of all this and used it to your family's advantage? You don't think It'd be reasonable to conclude that your family was in bed with the Russians?

That's some serious benefit of the doubt you're giving Trump, here.
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I must just give people a ton of benefit of the doubt. I think it is unreasonable to assume knowledge ahead of time (provided by the Russians) without specific evidence of that.
 
Argumemnon said:
Even with all those connections? You don't think the amount of smoke at some point indicates a fire?
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Never. On anything. I'm sure I fail at that sometimes, but I might be actively trying not to make connections like that.
 
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intlman said:
[snipped petty-outrage scolding]

"You wouldn't be the first person putting out the false narrative that collusion has been disproved because it has yet to be proved. You do know the difference, right?
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Who/what are you addressing here and does it mean you agree or disagree? And you forgot to close the quote so I can't tell where your words start. I said something like this earlier, or at least I agree with it. Collusion has not been disproved and no one is claiming it has been proved.

But to call it TDS when there is a pretty high pile of circumstantial evidence that is hard to otherwise explain, no, it is not TDS.

Not to mention, Trump has serious mental problems and has shown incredible incompetence so far that his followers brush off as, "he's not a politician" as if that makes incompetence OK.

intlman said:
[snip] It is apparently no longer up to the person making the claim to provide the supporting evidence.
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You do know the difference, right, between evidence piling up and no evidence?


intlman said:
[snip]

"Guess you'll have to wait for the FBI to complete their investigation, that is if Trump doesn't try to snuff out the investigation. And I'm surprised he hasn't already."
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Don't know who you are quoting but the evidence Trump will try to stop the investigation is there. He fired Yates, he's tried to throw suspicion on Obama and Rice while not demonstrating the charge of collusion is false, but rather hoping people will see it as persecution, hoping we all ignore the thing he's being persecuted for.

Think about it. Evidence is piling up. Trump accused Obama of spying on Trump. Did Trump say the evidence was contrived? No, because he can't. All those connections to Russia are well documented. Trump can say the connections are meaningless, and he has tired to say that. But Trump cannot say Obama and Rice planted the evidence. So how does an accusation of being spied on do anything except to distract people from the evidence.

intlman said:
And if/when the investigation is concluded and there is still no basis for the "collusion" CT you will simply claim Trump snuffed it out/pressured the FBI and that it still a totally valid and real accusation.

There is no scenario where some of you will be satisfied there was no collusion. It will just turn in to more sad version of 911 Truth, where only you know what "really" happened but everyone is covering it up. I wish I could find some of Gingers past posts on people starting with a conclusion and then finding "evidence" to support it.
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:id:
 
BobTheCoward said:
I didn't mean if you would accept it, but how it would make you feel. Would you be relieved​? Disappointed?
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Well, let's see, I'd feel a few things. A bit of a sting for sure, but that's no big deal. Definitely surprised that so much legit smoke and frantic Trump lying had no fire associated with it, but also satisfied that the system was still capable of providing a comprehensive investigation, and the truth had come out.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
Who/what are you addressing here and does it mean you agree or disagree? And you forgot to close the quote so I can't tell where your words start. I said something like this earlier, or at least I agree with it. Collusion has not been disproved and no one is claiming it has been proved.
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Carter has now admitted having interactions with Russian spies.

https://t.co/JgBYMyuAba

But he didn't tell them anything of importance, he claims.

He could have just said he didn't inhale.
 
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