Why anti-Semitism? I don't get it.

[baron]

It was sort of a combination of the two. In many societies, there were jobs that were considered unsavory or "unclean", or in other ways relegated to the lowest castes and outcasts. In many cultures, this would be things like butchering/tanning, and undertaking. In Christian and Muslim cultures, "usury" was forbidden. In Muslim cultures, that meant that they were not allowed to charge interest (which they got around by charging various other fees to make a profit). In Christian cultures, that meant only very low levels of interest could be charged, 10% being the hard ceiling (you couldn't charge more than that, because G-D only asked for 10%).

Since Jews were outcasts and not subject to those laws, they could get away with charging interest, and at higher rates than Christians were allowed to. This enabled them to quickly grow very wealthy, which led to a lot of animosity and suspicion, which resulted in a lot of conspiracy theories and anti-Jewish propaganda, and eventually blood libel.

Thing is of course, I doubt one in a thousand antisemites knows any of this.

 

[Hercules56]

They hate us, cause they ain't us.

 

[dudalb]

You also have to distinguish between religious Anti Semitism and Racial/Ethnic Anti Semitism.though, of course, they are connected. The Nazi Leadership basically hated Christianity ( they were careful not to push this angle too far,though Hitler constanly said,in private, that someday a "settling of accounts" with the Churches would come) so the "Killers of the Christ "angle was not a biggie to them (though they were willing to use it in the propaganda...and frequently did so). In fact, the hard core Nazis felt that Christianity was a Jewish plot to corrupt the Aryan race,the Germans in particular.
They hated the Jews because the Jews were a evil "race". Hitler criticized Religious Anti Semitism,saying it actually helped the Jews since worse come to worse a simple baptism would turn the Jew into a Good Christian,but he remained a evil Jew;you cannot change a Jew into a Noble Aryan.
The religious form of Anti Semitism has being going on since New Testament times,but the racial form is relatively new,being created in the early 19th Century, largely in Germany.

 

[The Norseman]

Jews are successful in business, excel massively in the sciences, don't attempt to impose their own culture onto wider society (on the rare occasions where the two differ) and arguably contribute to society proportionally more than any other ethnic or religious grouping. Reason enough for a bit of hate from inadequates world wide, don't you think?

Got any evidence for these statements other than anecdotal?

 

[dudalb]

Got any evidence for these statements other than anecdotal?

It's called look around, and see how many major figures in Business, Entertainment, and Science are Jewish. Far exceeding their percentage of the population as a whole.

 

[imodium]

The modern hate stems from 2001, not a space odyssey but bear with me.

The early days of online gaming had a hand in the modern usage, to get around swear filters people would use the word Jew.
New players would yahoo (it was the then google) to find out why they were being called Jewish and, like other high traffic searches this was incorporated into conspiracies of the time to make sure they turned up on the search.
In 1996 the new world order was the most searched for item, the Hollywood Hulk Hogan led wrestling faction made world championship wrestling the highest viewed program every Monday night in America, around 97 it also became some laughable conspiracy, you may have heard of it.

Throw in 9/11 becoming a pretty big search term around 2001 and, these purveyors of conspiracies offering truth on their websites, along with their previous gubbins, Jews and the new world order became one big lie conspiracy.

Historical facts, brilliantly summed up in prior posts, can't be ignored but, Cleetus from Kentucky who gets his real news from say Jeff Rense is more than likely unaware of the pogrom.

FYI: When David Ickes first draft went to the publishers it was nixed for being anti-Semitic, he simply changed the words Jew to lizard, so next time one of his nutcases try to explain that the queen and every president ever is a lizard, you know what they really mean, also explains his support of Ernst Zundel.

 

[The Norseman]

It's called look around, and see how many major figures in Business, Entertainment, and Science are Jewish. Far exceeding their percentage of the population as a whole.

I'll wait for more than just anecdote, thanks.

 

[Giordano]

Warning- the following is posted by a Jewish atheist:

It is complicated as far as I can guess. Several things, including some mentioned above, come to my mind:

1. Being of a different religion yet living as a minority (post diaspora) within other cultures for many, many years. Therefore Jews suffered all of the suspicion directed at any minority, particularly religious minorities, while in the very societal and geographic heart of another, majority religion. Makes for a lot of paranoia! And of course religious divisions are among the most emotional and generate the most savage responses.

2. Add to that the fact that Jews had to either retain their own distinct forms of dress, food requirements, social rituals or assimilate within the larger culture to some extent. The former were often considered weird alien others; the latter were considered to be sneaky potential conspirators who were only pretending to be part of the larger culture for some nefarious purpose (probably so as to have sex with the majority women. as is attributed to any minority).

3. Being portrayed as "killing Christ" certainly didn't/doesn't help how Christians view Jews.

4. As noted up thread, Jews have often be restricted to/allowed to do jobs that the larger majority was not permitted to do. Not infrequently this was an intentional method by the leaders of a society to further divide Jews from the rest and make them more unpopular.

5. What is particularly resented in a minority is success, and Jews have generally been seen as somewhat more successful in a number of fields than the average population. Although I have some relatives who would like to attribute this to something special about Jewish genes (who doesn't want to feel special simply from being born, right?) it seems clear to me and to most of the rest of my relatives that if there is a difference, it relates to a long-held emphasis and appreciation in Judaism on education. Look at the fields in which Jews are thought to be more represented than in the overall population- typically they are fields that are linked to higher forms of education.

BTW: I see a very similar resentment of Asians in non-Asian cultures for much the same reason- their economic, academic, artistic, and musical success which arises from pretty much the same basis- an emphasis on education (and on family). And like Jews, Asians have distinct cultural rituals, many have distinct religions, etc. They are "different" from the majority in certain societies (although not in the world as a whole), and different often creates dislike.

6. I should note that I start to feel uncomfortable when even well meaning people are incautious with their attributions of some of the stereotypes. Even positive ones. Such as the ideas that Jews are typically wealthy, or insular, or haughty. The vast majority of Jews I know are middle class. No international bankers in my group of acquaintances! A Rothschild would spit at me if I could ever find one. My father and I buy stocks and stuff high and sell low- we have no ability with money whatsoever! I, my family, and friends grew up as typical Americans- went to the same schools, watched the same TV programs, read the same comic books, thought the same thoughts, and even ate the same foods (minus the ham) as any one else in America. We identify as Americans first and foremost, not as Jews. We are Americans who happen to be Jewish in the same way some Americans happen to be Catholic. Perhaps with a little mix of the idea that we are Americans with a Jewish origin in the same way there are Americans with an Italian origin (because of the intertwining of Jewish being both a religion and often an ethnicity).

I am often surprised when a non-Jewish American assumes that I am somehow different from them. Or that I have a different loyalty than they do. Hey- I am a typical baby-boom guy- and I love my country, the USA, just like anyone else. I have no more loyalty to Israel than to Sweden. Sure I like knishes and corned beef sandwiches, but so do many Swedish-Americans. And I like Ikea meatballs too. So the very nature of these discussions, which inevitably stray into how Jews are "different" can often be disturbing to me. I don't feel different. It is very strange when I find that there are people who think that I am different, and hate me for it. I can accept being hated because I am an American, but not because I am Jewish in terms of my cultural background.

 

[baron]

Got any evidence for these statements other than anecdotal?

To get you started

https://www.algemeiner.com/2013/10/...by-high-number-of-jewish-nobel-prize-winners/

although it's difficult to miss the broader success factor of Jews unless you walk around with your eyes shut.

 

[Craig B]

I was under the impression, possibly wrongly, that Jews were forbidden in some countries/societies from entering certain professions or undertaking many business activities and that moneylending/financing was one of the few things, or perhaps the only thing left open to them.

Quite so. See Cum nimis absurdum^WP, Papal Bull, 1555.

Apart from money lending, rag picking was permitted to them. This occupation was dangerous to bodily health, as infectious diseases were often carried in old clothing, or in the insects which frequently infested it. (That was the source of the most famous outbreak of the plague during the 1666 epidemic in England.) Money lending was equally dangerous, according to the ideas of the time, to the soul. But as Jews were destined for Hell anyway, that didn't matter.

 

[fuelair]

My understanding is that there are two primary reasons:

1. Christian bigotry against the people who killed their god.
2. Christian attitudes toward loaning money. Christians were not supposed to charge interest on loans, Jew could, and some made their fortunes being bankers. Consider the modern attitudes by many people toward bankers as a class and imagine those bankers belonged to a distinct group of people. You can imagine negative attitudes toward the banking class transferring to the group they belong to.

Except for the thing that it was Romans what dun it!!!!! The Jews just made a choice of who got offed and it was not that many of them......... And, since the whole story is a fraud anyway (like the Nazis, Romans kept great records!!!)

 

[fuelair]

Yep. That train's never late (NSFW link).

As for these particular guys, they idolize Nazi Germany and their attempt at what is in their view a white ethnostate, enough to act as a pathetic shadow of it. And that includes sneaking around drawing what are supposed to be swastikas (sometimes they get it right!), desecrating graves, and so forth.

Reminds me of a fun fact. Back in the 50's on the old but fun Rin-Tin- Tin Show ("Yo-ho, Rinty!!!") Lt. Masters was pow-wowing with the Indians (the ones our ancestors misnamed for idiot geographical errors)and they had a peace pipe with a swastika on it (painted the Nazi way) I was quite surprised and, until I was in fourth grade and had more research material available, I really wondered what was going on there!!!!

 

[fuelair]

Jews are successful in business, excel massively in the sciences, don't attempt to impose their own culture onto wider society (on the rare occasions where the two differ) and arguably contribute to society proportionally more than any other ethnic or religious grouping. Reason enough for a bit of hate from inadequates world wide, don't you think?

Unfortunately a large part of the reason. Sort of how trumpf got elected - the inadequates voted for him!!!!!

 

[fuelair]

Jews are successful in business, excel massively in the sciences, don't attempt to impose their own culture onto wider society (on the rare occasions where the two differ) and arguably contribute to society proportionally more than any other ethnic or religious grouping. Reason enough for a bit of hate from inadequates world wide, don't you think?

Also, as a culture, they hold learning in high esteem!!!

 

[alfaniner]

This is all interesting information, thanks! I remember the early times I heard Woody Allen making jokes about being Jewish -- I just had no idea why that was supposed to be funny, or some sort of stereotype.

Reminds me of a fun fact. Back in the 50's on the old but fun Rin-Tin- Tin Show ("Yo-ho, Rinty!!!") Lt. Masters was pow-wowing with the Indians (the ones our ancestors misnamed for idiot geographical errors)and they had a peace pipe with a swastika on it (painted the Nazi way) I was quite surprised and, until I was in fourth grade and had more research material available, I really wondered what was going on there!!!!

I recall seeing an old Buster Keaton movie (perhaps "The General"?) where he was involved with Native Americans at one point, and a blanket with a prominent swastika played a part in a bit -- the symbol had nothing to do with the bit but was obviously just a part of the decoration.

 

[ahhell]

Except for the thing that it was Romans what dun it!!!!! The Jews just made a choice of who got offed and it was not that many of them......... And, since the whole story is a fraud anyway (like the Nazis, Romans kept great records!!!)

Couldn't blame the Roman's though. They were the definition of civilization for the West for 1800 years or so.

As noted:
1. They killed Christ
2. They were often on of the few distinct minorities in most European countries, the other being Gypsies who have a similar status in the European mind. This made them an easy scapegoat for leaders to play on the very natural xenophobic tendency of pretty much every human population.
3. Money, the were often forced into occupations that are almost universally reviled by laws that prevented them from owning property and preventing Christians from fulfilling those roles; money lending and economic middlemen. There really are super rich Jewish bankers.

So, we have 2000 years of bias based on these factors. Billy bob doesn't care much about that but he was taught by his grandpappy that the jews are bad because of that rich tradition.

It makes it easy because in the modern world they really to punch above their weight in terms of success and influence in proportion to the population. They make up something like 2% of the US population but are clearly well represented in business, government and entertainment. As others have said, mostly because of cultural values; mostly respect for education, probably derived from point number 2.

 

[blutoski]

There's an old joke:

A Jew finds himself stuck on a crowded train next to an anti-Semite who rants on and on blaming every serious problem on “The Jews!” to which our hero, sitting next to him, adds, “And the bicycle-riders!”
“This terrible economy?” says the anti-Semite, “obviously a result of the secret machinations of the Jews.”
“And the bicycle-riders!” says the Jew.
“The war is also the Jews’ fault.”
“And the bicycle-riders!” says the Jew.
Finally, the anti-Semite has had enough.
“Bicycle-riders? Why the bicycle-rider?” he asks, exasperated.

The Jew answers, “Why the Jews?”

 

[Noztradamus]

2. Christian attitudes toward loaning money. Christians were not supposed to charge interest on loans, Jew could, and some made their fortunes being bankers. Consider the modern attitudes by many people toward bankers as a class and imagine those bankers belonged to a distinct group of people. You can imagine negative attitudes toward the banking class transferring to the group they belong to.

The Medici never got the memo then.

 

[blutoski]

Couldn't blame the Roman's though. They were the definition of civilization for the West for 1800 years or so.

As noted:
1. They killed Christ
2. They were often on of the few distinct minorities in most European countries, the other being Gypsies who have a similar status in the European mind. This made them an easy scapegoat for leaders to play on the very natural xenophobic tendency of pretty much every human population.
3. Money, the were often forced into occupations that are almost universally reviled by laws that prevented them from owning property and preventing Christians from fulfilling those roles; money lending and economic middlemen. There really are super rich Jewish bankers.

So, we have 2000 years of bias based on these factors. Billy bob doesn't care much about that but he was taught by his grandpappy that the jews are bad because of that rich tradition.

It makes it easy because in the modern world they really to punch above their weight in terms of success and influence in proportion to the population. They make up something like 2% of the US population but are clearly well represented in business, government and entertainment. As others have said, mostly because of cultural values; mostly respect for education, probably derived from point number 2.

I don't think we can underestimate the renewing impact from concentrated deliberate propaganda, either.

Antisemitism was in decline in the latter 19th century (eg: Benjamin Disraeli was UK PM on and off starting in 1868). But then we got the Dreyfus affair in 1894, and Protocols in 1903. Largely due do these government financed propaganda campaigns, within a decade, European antisemitism was back in full force.

 

[baron]

Couldn't blame the Roman's though. They were the definition of civilization for the West for 1800 years or so.

As noted:
1. They killed Christ

You'd imagine they'd thank them. After all, if Christ had died of old age they wouldn't be Christians in the first place.