Disgraceful! Richard Spencer Sucker-Punched While Giving Interview

[NWO Sentryman]

Yes. There I wouldn't trust myself to assign political figures as appropriate victims of punching, let alone anyone else.

However, if you issue threats, you can't complain if a victim retaliates.

So someone says "Fascists should be killed on sight!". How long before we get another Jo Cox, this time with the perpetrator accusing the victim of fascism?

 

[jimbob]

So someone says "Fascists should be killed on sight!". How long before we get another Jo Cox, this time with the perpetrator accusing the victim of fascism?

That was sort of my point. Saying that fascists should be killed on site could easily be incitement or intimidation if one defines fascists elastically enough.

If one says that any group of people should be assaulted, one shouldn't be surprised if individuals from that group decide to physically retaliate, regardless as to whether it is actually right.

 

[uke2se]

If one says that any group of people should be assaulted, one shouldn't be surprised if individuals from that group decide to physically retaliate, regardless as to whether it is actually right.

Precisely. That's why people punch Nazis.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

Precisely. That's why people punch Nazis.

When you make violence an acceptable first resort when it comes to what essentially boils down to "people you don't like", you get a compromised rule of law, like Northern Ireland: where Torturing children in front of their mothers is acceptable, or threatening to put bombs under people's cars, or having to carry a handgun for your own protection. As well as that, you get the higher likelihood of another Jo Cox, which is now acceptable as long as you cry "Nazi!" before murdering someone. Or, what happens if someone murders a controversial imam and says "Muslims are like nazis!"

 

[uke2se]

When you make violence an acceptable first resort when it comes to what essentially boils down to "people you don't like", you get a compromised rule of law, like Northern Ireland: where Torturing children in front of their mothers is acceptable, or threatening to put bombs under people's cars, or having to carry a handgun for your own protection. As well as that, you get the higher likelihood of another Jo Cox, which is now acceptable as long as you cry "Nazi!" before murdering someone. Or, what happens if someone murders a controversial imam and says "Muslims are like nazis!"

I was agreeing with this statement:

If one says that any group of people should be assaulted, one shouldn't be surprised if individuals from that group decide to physically retaliate, regardless as to whether it is actually right.

Nazis like Spencer wants to ethnically cleanse the US. Nobody should be surprised when people defend themselves and pop him on the nose.

Also, nobody is talking about shooting or killing anyone (except the Nazis themselves). We're talking about punching someone. You do understand the difference, right?

 

[NWO Sentryman]

I was agreeing with this statement:



Nazis like Spencer wants to ethnically cleanse the US. Nobody should be surprised when people defend themselves and pop him on the nose.

Also, nobody is talking about shooting or killing anyone (except the Nazis themselves). We're talking about punching someone. You do understand the difference, right?

It always starts with a punch, and because of how nebulous the definition of "Nazi" is, it will eventually boil down to "people I don't like". FFS, what happens if someone decides "I think my MP is a nazi!" and murders them? And I guess the kids who are tortured in Northern Ireland are just "subjects of community justice" then? You want to know why Northern Ireland takes great pains to avoid normalising violence like this? We tried the "Punch people you don't like!" routine. We'll be paying for it for a century.

 

[uke2se]

It always starts with a punch, and because of how nebulous the definition of "Nazi" is, it will eventually boil down to "people I don't like". FFS, what happens if someone decides "I think my MP is a nazi!" and murders them? And I guess the kids who are tortured in Northern Ireland are just "subjects of community justice" then?

I take it you don't actually understand the difference between murdering someone and punching someone then. Sad.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

I take it you don't actually understand the difference between murdering someone and punching someone then. Sad.

Because it ALWAYS starts with a Punch. Eventually, the Nazis will take to carrying weapons like clubs. I mean, Weimar Germany was full of paramilitary violence and it STILL didn't stop the Nazis. Worse still, it strengthened them.

 

[uke2se]

[

Because it ALWAYS starts with a Punch. Eventually, the Nazis will take to carrying weapons like clubs. I mean, Weimar Germany was full of paramilitary violence and it STILL didn't stop the Nazis. Worse still, it strengthened them.

Ah yes, the people opposing the Nazis in Germany on the streets were actually helping them. #alternativehistory

 

[NWO Sentryman]

[

Ah yes, the people opposing the Nazis in Germany on the streets were actually helping them. #alternativehistory

Where the hell did you get that idea? What I was saying was: Normalising violence only makes things worse. Why do you think normalising violence has been disastrous for Northern Ireland? There's the other big problem that you REFUSE to address: who gets to define "Nazi"? After all, since 9/11, people have actively been comparing Islam to Nazism, and it isn't a big leap for someone to murder an imam on the grounds that they are a "Nazi".

 

[uke2se]

Where the hell did you get that idea? What I was saying was: Normalising violence only makes things worse. Why do you think normalising violence has been disastrous for Northern Ireland? There's the other big problem that you REFUSE to address: who gets to define "Nazi"? After all, since 9/11, people have actively been comparing Islam to Nazism, and it isn't a big leap for someone to murder an imam on the grounds that they are a "Nazi".

Nazi has a definition. How about we use that?

Violence against minorities is normalized when you allow people to call for ethnic cleansing without consequence.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

Nazi has a definition. How about we use that?

Violence against minorities is normalized when you allow people to call for ethnic cleansing without consequence.

Which is highly subjective and has always boiled down to "People I don't like". Hell, Pinochet could point to Pol Pot as an excuse to send dissidents on helicopter rides on the grounds that they were "communists" like the Khmer Rouge. Or people were actively comparing Islam to Nazism when Da'esh came along, yet instead of "punch an imam!", great pains were taken to say #notallmuslims.

And Northern Ireland had taken your prescription, and it has set us back a century. I mean, if you asked Unionists at the time the IRA were clearly calling for Protestant Genocide, therefore it was acceptable to engage in internment and put the province under Martial Law.

 

[uke2se]

Which is highly subjective and has always boiled down to "People I don't like".

Nope.

Hell, Pinochet could point to Pol Pot as an excuse to send dissidents on helicopter rides on the grounds that they were "communists" like the Khmer Rouge. Or people were actively comparing Islam to Nazism when Da'esh came along, yet instead of "punch an imam!", great pains were taken to say #notallmuslims.

Not Nazis.

And Northern Ireland had taken your prescription, and it has set us back a century. I mean, if you asked Unionists at the time the IRA were clearly calling for Protestant Genocide, therefore it was acceptable to engage in internment and put the province under Martial Law.

I'd say Northern Ireland has gotten through the troubles quite well. The Unionists are no longer dominating the catholics, are they?

 

[NWO Sentryman]

Nope.

Not Nazis.

That's entirely my point. What if someone says "A communist is as dangerous as a nazi, therefore helicopter rides are necessary!" or "An Imam is like a Nazi because they preach the doctrine of Da'esh therefore we should punch them!". You act as though you will be the sole arbitrator of when violence will be acceptable, but it never stops there.

I'd say Northern Ireland has gotten through the troubles quite well. The Unionists are no longer dominating the catholics, are they?

Except the Peace Process is now breaking down, we have death squads who disguise themselves as "alternative justice", a government that has been a sick joke for its entire existence and a belief that violence is acceptable when it comes to people you don't like.

 

[uke2se]

That's entirely my point. What if someone says "A communist is as dangerous as a nazi, therefore helicopter rides are necessary!" or "An Imam is like a Nazi because they preach the doctrine of Da'esh therefore we should punch them!". You act as though you will be the sole arbitrator of when violence will be acceptable, but it never stops there.

That's up to them. Are you saying people aren't using the justification that someone is a Muslim to assault them now? That happens all the time. You understand Nazis like to beat up on minorities, right?

Except the Peace Process is now breaking down, we have death squads who disguise themselves as "alternative justice", a government that has been a sick joke for its entire existence and a belief that violence is acceptable when it comes to people you don't like.

Too bad. Any Nazis around?

 

[TubbaBlubba]

Because it ALWAYS starts with a Punch. Eventually, the Nazis will take to carrying weapons like clubs. I mean, Weimar Germany was full of paramilitary violence and it STILL didn't stop the Nazis. Worse still, it strengthened them.

OK, and how do you think things would have turned out if everyone decided to try and sit down to talk nicely to the Sturmabteilung? Hitler would've come into power through a coup instead of through political bargaining.

Hitler recognized that it was unrealistic to come into power by force after 1924, and he instead moved on to exploiting precisely the tendency to "play nicely" that many politicians have.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

That's up to them. Are you saying people aren't using the justification that someone is a Muslim to assault them now? That happens all the time. You understand Nazis like to beat up on minorities, right?

Except you just said "Call your target a nazi and it's okay to beat them up!". It's practically the perfect excuse for violence.

Too bad. Any Nazis around?

No, but Northern Ireland is what happens when you say "It's okay to use violence against anyone you don't like!".

The problem with Weimar was that it had little, if any legitimacy, and normalising street violence made it much easier for the Nazis to gain support. When rule of law is eroded due to normalised political violence, it's not the fascists who will lose out. Because they will learn to bring weapons as "self defence". You imagine yourself as the Glorious Socialist Revolutionaries in a People's War against the Reactionaries, but you will most likely end up being blown up in your car, or tortured by masked thugs for "being a traitor to the revolution!"

 

[uke2se]

Except you just said "Call your target a nazi and it's okay to beat them up!". It's practically the perfect excuse for violence.

I said no such thing.

No, but Northern Ireland is what happens when you say "It's okay to use violence against anyone you don't like!".

Thankfully, nobody is saying that.

The problem with Weimar was that it had little, if any legitimacy, and normalising street violence made it much easier for the Nazis to gain support. When rule of law is eroded due to normalised political violence, it's not the fascists who will lose out. Because they will learn to bring weapons as "self defence". You imagine yourself as the Glorious Socialist Revolutionaries in a People's War against the Reactionaries, but you will most likely end up being blown up in your car, or tortured by masked thugs for "being a traitor to the revolution!"

Not if I blow up their car first.

 

[NWO Sentryman]

I said no such thing.

Thankfully, nobody is saying that.

Except there is no objective definition of "Nazi" and "Fascist", as even Orwell noted near the end of the Second World War, they became cheapened to ludicrous extents.

Not if I blow up their car first.

Unlikely.

 

[uke2se]

Except there is no objective definition of "Nazi" and "Fascist", as even Orwell noted near the end of the Second World War, they became cheapened to ludicrous extents.

That's fine. I include Fascists when I say it's ok to punch Nazis. "Nazism" is a subset of "Fascism" after all.

Unlikely.

What are you saying about my technical skills? Don't you think I'm as capable of blowing up a car as a Nazi is. That's a low blow, man.