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The Deep State

zorro99

Graduate Poster
zorro99
Joined
Apr 27, 2008
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A thread for discussing the so-called Deep State, a term that has become common since Trump's election
 
Isn't that just a conspiratorial term for 'bureaucracy', with a bit of lobbying from industries thrown in?
 
Ah, I see, it means "everyone who disagrees with me" and "nebulous cabal of bad guys I can use to shift the blame away from the government".
It's the international jewry of our age.
 
Porpoise of Life said:
Ah, I see, it means "everyone who disagrees with me" and "nebulous cabal of bad guys I can use to shift the blame away from the government".
It's the international jewry of our age.
Click to expand...

:thumbsup:

it's a deliberately empty term, a catch-all to excuse the administrations ineptitude and stupid games.
 
It's a term used when one attempts to explain why leaks damaging Clinton are good leaks, while leaks damaging Dump are bad leaks.
 
Is that the new term for what was called the 'shadow' government?
 
Porpoise of Life said:
Ah, I see, it means "everyone who disagrees with me" and "nebulous cabal of bad guys I can use to shift the blame away from the government".
It's the international jewry of our age.
Click to expand...

This.

As an opponent, it's perfect - can't be disproven, it's always there and it's always working for their own goals, not yours.
 
Back in the 60's, it was the "secret government." That's not very catchy, so the wisenheimers started using what were supposed to be more evocative adjectives. Still lame.

Jeezuss, I almost wish Donny Drumpf and his boys were smart enough to go deep. Shallow government's only good for broad jokes.
 
sackett said:
Back in the 60's, it was the "secret government." That's not very catchy, so the wisenheimers started using what were supposed to be more evocative adjectives. Still lame.

Jeezuss, I almost wish Donny Drumpf and his boys were smart enough to go deep. Shallow government's only good for broad jokes.
Click to expand...

This. It actually does have a relevant and useful meaning - the "deep state" remains no matter which faction of the civilian rabble is running things at the head of government.

But i think people like using it now because it just sounds so cool and scary.
 
It's ...

Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious
Even though the sound of it
Is something quite atrocious
If you say it loud enough
You'll always sound precocious
Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious
 
In The Atlantic, albeit in cautionary quotation marks.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/trump-constraints-opposition/516825/

ETA: And elsewhere in the same publication, treated textually different. https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/american-deep-state-trump/516780/

Some commentators have dubbed what’s going on the revenge of the American Deep State, in reference to the existence—real, imagined, or a little bit in between—of a bureaucratic shadow government that constrains the legitimate government in places like Turkey.
Click to expand...

The author then goes on to contrast important differences between the influence that are being termed the American "deep state" and the conditions in other countries where the term was first applied. In sum: the American situation is merely the application of unformalized pressures through formal institutional channels whereas the situation in, say, Turkey would be considered more extrajudicial.
 
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Porpoise of Life said:
Isn't that just a conspiratorial term for 'bureaucracy', with a bit of lobbying from industries thrown in?
Click to expand...
It does seem to bee this, which actually merits serious discussion. Numerous Cabinet heads have complained about how hard it is to get things done on account of the bureaucracies. But on account of the tinfoil hat wearing folks who drive the discussion, it will never get serious discussion.
 
Most of the "Deep State" actors are folks who have security clearances, and many took an oath to defend the Constitution from enemies foreign and domestic. So when you're bureau has a recording of the National Security Adviser talking with a Russian diplomat - before he has been sworn in - red flags shoot up, and when you see your bureau's leadership sitting on it without taking action you have a choice: You can do nothing and hope the Russians only use their influence for good, or you leak the transcripts.

If you are a good American you leak the transcripts.

There is legal precedent for this with Daniel Ellsberg a the "Pentagon Papers". Unlike Manning and Snowden,who gave away the entire store, Ellsberg leaked important documents about Vietnam without compromising the larger National Security apparatus.

We have seen this many times, most recently with enhanced interrogation (torture), and the NSA's eavesdropping during the Bush Administration (prior to Snowden).

This is why big evil secrets are hard to keep. I know, it sucks all the fun out of the CT world, but it is the real truth. :thumbsup:
 
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