Ed Electoral College

If there were enough evidence that Trump was unfit for office, this evidence could have been presented to enough electors to prevent Trump from being elected.

Dictators don't spring up over night: they achieve and maintain power because people don't care enough to defend democracy. It takes time for people to lose faith in democracy. Either that or they never had any faith in it at all and desired an authoritarian form of government from the beginning.

During the election, and even after he won it, Trump has continuously worked to delegitimatize American democracy by asserting, despite plenty of evidence that says otherwise, that widespread electoral fraud and various conspiracies were acting against him. The entire system was "rigged against him". This is the exact same kind of rhetoric that would-be autocrats use to justify dispensing with democracy.

That alone should disqualify him from the presidency since he's intentionally harming societies support for democracy itself. Evidently it wasn't. Instead he won showing that a significant portion of the electorate isn't concerned with the health of their democracy and instead put far more importance on bread and circuses.
 
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If there were enough evidence that Trump was unfit for office, this evidence could have been presented to enough electors to prevent Trump from being elected.

It was. It didn't matter.

Merely believing something, or dreading something, or hating someone, is not evidence that they are unfit for office. If it were, then Obama would have been in jeopardy of faithless electors.

Should we argue the unfitness of Donald Trump for President in this thread? Should we reiterate the many constitutional problems with his dependencies on foreign interests? The way he invited other foreign interests to meddle in the US election? His refusal to divest himself of his business interests? His foundation's illegal bribe of a US state attorney? His racist outbursts? His many, many lies?

So, the EC certainly could have prevented Trump from winning.

The point is, they didn't.
 
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I can at least see some form of "dictator prevention" with the EC.

Where is this with a popular vote system?

The belief in the basic capability of the majority to make somewhat rational decisions. It worked this time. The majority did make a rational decision.
 
The problem here is what you wrote isn't an argument. It is more like a report. You never establish why being undemocratic is a bad thing.
More to the point, "one vote one value" is not the definition of democracy.

Like it or not, the US is not a single nation but a federation of states with a federal government. The fact that the federal government has been continuously increasing its power (by appointing judicial activists to the SC and by using its "power of the purse") doesn't change this fact.

If you want to abolish the special considerations given to the smaller states by the constitution then you need to
  • Abolish the states (or make state governments subservient to the federal government)
  • Abolish the Senate
  • Make House of Representatives seats not subject to state boundaries
Of course, none of the above will make the US "democratic" as long as FPTP remains in use.
 
Jeez...if we want a True Democracy™ why do we need representatives at all? One person one vote, right? Let's just decide everything by popular vote. Yay True Democracy™!

Oh, not everything can be decided by popular vote? We have to compromise True Democracy™ in order to get things done? Aw man...I was so excited.

Ok, fine. Let's start compromising....discussion ensues...hey look! It's the US Constitution!

And that's how the United States was born, kids.
 
Under that compact, California would give its votes to whoever wins the popular vote. What about a situation the exact reverse of this election where the Dem candidate loses the popular vote but would have won the EC? I can just hear the crying from California and the other affected States. "Waaah, we never should have abandoned the EC!"
 
And are you guys trying to say that if Clinton had lost the popular vote but won the EC you would be still be calling for the abolition of the EC? Please, we'd be hearing "Thabk God for the EC! The Founding Fathers were geniuses!"

This thread is nothing but the extended cry-fest that is already beginning to rival the Repub's over Obama's two wins...
 
And are you guys trying to say that if Clinton had lost the popular vote but won the EC you would be still be calling for the abolition of the EC? Please, we'd be hearing "Thabk God for the EC! The Founding Fathers were geniuses!"

This thread is nothing but the extended cry-fest that is already beginning to rival the Repub's over Obama's two wins...

No, the EC has been a bad idea from the beginning.
 
In a popular vote system, what would prevent a Duterte or Chavez or Castro from coming to power?

Nothing, but neither do the electoral college as it is now.
Can you imagine the revolt brewing if the EC had not voted trump in ? Imagine the same with a Duterte or Chavez or Castro if they had had the same vote as trump's.

You either utterly remove the EC from the hand of the vote of the people, or you make it fully democratic.

As it is now, it does not serve the purpose you cite.
 
Jeez...if we want a True Democracy™ why do we need representatives at all? One person one vote, right? Let's just decide everything by popular vote. Yay True Democracy™!

Oh, not everything can be decided by popular vote? We have to compromise True Democracy™ in order to get things done? Aw man...I was so excited.

Ok, fine. Let's start compromising....discussion ensues...hey look! It's the US Constitution!

And that's how the United States was born, kids.

The US is to my knowledge the only country using an EC like solution. All other country which have democratic election, use a mix of direct election and representation. Because it is not feasable to have popular vote on everything.

You are actually going from one extrem to the other which is absurd and is not really a valid argument.
 
Sure, losers have been bitching about the EC system since federation.

Actually not only the losers have discussed it. For example it was discussed in 2008 and 2012 too , two years where actually the democrate won.

For example on people thinking this is an outdated system even before those election, you can simply google. Here is a link plucked at random http://news.psu.edu/story/141225/20...ng-question-electoral-college-outdated-system taken at random

Fact is, every 4 years the issue is brought up, no matter who win.
 
Actually not only the losers have discussed it. For example it was discussed in 2008 and 2012 too , two years where actually the democrate won.

For example on people thinking this is an outdated system even before those election, you can simply google. Here is a link plucked at random http://news.psu.edu/story/141225/20...ng-question-electoral-college-outdated-system taken at random

Fact is, every 4 years the issue is brought up, no matter who win.

No no, it's just 'cause we iz losers.
 

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