Are all Trump supporters racists?

[turingtest]

Obviously, there was also input by others on the Constitution, but yes Jefferson pops up as the lead effort. I'm sure there were other copies penned by other individuals as well. My statement was inclusive of Thomas Jefferson and not meant to be taken as excluding the other founding fathers.

"Input by others..." like Madison, maybe? ("The Father Of The Constitution") It's true that Jefferson wrote a letter to Madison calling for the addition of a Bill Of Rights; but "the lead effort" seems a little strong a characterization for a part played by a man who was, after all, in France when the thing was written.

Perhaps to cover all bases I should have simply said the founding documents were prepared by a Brotherhood of Masons. Chris B.

Sure- it would have been just about as accurate as saying Jefferson wrote the Constitution, considering that (for example) only a third of the signers of the Constitution were actually members of what was really only a club that socially/politically active men happened to belong to. Or is the US Constitution some grand Masonic conspiracy we should be aware of?

 

[bruto]

I am late to this thread, and have not had time to read through it.

Are all Trump supporters racists? Probably not intentionally, but I'm just plain sick and tired of people who vote for things they don't support because they don't understand the human implications of what they do.

If you vote for someone whose public and published opinion and personal history opposes human rights - as Trump does in many cases, then I think it does not matter what you think you believe. You are voting against human rights. If you vote for the curtailment of civil rights for any group you are voting for the curtailment of all the rights for every individual. If you vote against civil rights for gay couples, you should be able to walk up to any gay person and say "I believe you should go to prison for what and who you are. I believe that if you become ill your partner should be barred from visiting you and you should die alone and unloved." If you vote to exclude Muslims you do so for all forever. Every time you vote against someone's civil rights you do so for everyone, always and forever. If you cannot say this then you are sadly, woefully, fatally mistaken, and have voted for a creature that will eat the liberties and dignity of yourself and all around you. Shame on you.

 

[Resume]

"Input by others..." like Madison, maybe? ("The Father Of The Constitution") It's true that Jefferson wrote a letter to Madison calling for the addition of a Bill Of Rights; but "the lead effort" seems a little strong a characterization for a part played by a man who was, after all, in France when the thing was written.

Of course it was Madison who wrote this:

"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution." "What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not."

 

[blutoski]

Here's a Baptist view on integration:

Obviously "Baptists" aren't uniform (eg: would a black Baptist church have the same position on segregation as Jerry Falwell - obviously not). But, According to historian and former Southern Baptist Wayne Flynt, "The Southern Baptist church was the last bastion of segregation." The SBC (Southern Baptist Convention) issued an apology for its emphasis on White Supremacy in 1995. They do maintain a segregationist 'permissive' stance, but no longer insist on it as part of their "autonomy of the local church" position. On the other hand they did issue an unenforceable request for their member churches to stop using the Confederate flag as a backdrop behind altars... I think in 2012? Seems a day late and a dollar short on that one.

SBC is the mothership of Baptist churches in the USA. (second only to the Catholic Church in terms of population in the US), and their official position is that women aren't entitled to their own vote; their enfranchisement is only allowed if it amplifies their man's vote. A woman voting independently is a sin in their eyes. ("A wife is to submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband even as the church willingly submits to the headship of Christ.")

The SBC's attitude toward blacks and women is one of the reasons my wife left her SBC affiliated church. She joined an Evangelical Free congregation.

 

[Resume]

Obviously "Baptists" aren't uniform (eg: would a black Baptist church have the same position on segregation as Jerry Falwell - obviously not). But, According to historian and former Southern Baptist Wayne Flynt, "The Southern Baptist church was the last bastion of segregation." The SBC (Southern Baptist Convention) issued an apology for its emphasis on White Supremacy in 1995. They do maintain a segregationist 'permissive' stance, but no longer insist on it as part of their "autonomy of the local church" position. On the other hand they did issue an unenforceable request for their member churches to stop using the Confederate flag as a backdrop behind altars... I think in 2012? Seems a day late and a dollar short on that one.

SBC is the mothership of Baptist churches in the USA. (second only to the Catholic Church in terms of population in the US), and their official position is that women aren't entitled to their own vote; their enfranchisement is only allowed if it amplifies their man's vote. A woman voting independently is a sin in their eyes. ("A wife is to submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband even as the church willingly submits to the headship of Christ.")

The SBC's attitude toward blacks and women is one of the reasons my wife left her SBC affiliated church. She joined an Evangelical Free congregation.

From here:
http://www.sbc.net/resolutions/899/...nniversary-of-the-southern-baptist-convention

WHEREAS, The Scriptures teach that Eve is the mother of all living (Genesis 3:20), and that God shows no partiality, but in every nation whoever fears him and works righteousness is accepted by him (Acts 10:34-35), and that God has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on the face of the earth (Acts 17:26); and

WHEREAS, Our relationship to African-Americans has been hindered from the beginning by the role that slavery played in the formation of the Southern Baptist Convention; and

WHEREAS, Many of our Southern Baptist forbears defended the right to own slaves, and either participated in, supported, or acquiesced in the particularly inhumane nature of American slavery; and

WHEREAS, In later years Southern Baptists failed, in many cases, to support, and in some cases opposed, legitimate initiatives to secure the civil rights of African-Americans; and

WHEREAS, Racism has led to discrimination, oppression, injustice, and violence, both in the Civil War and throughout the history of our nation; and

WHEREAS, Racism has divided the body of Christ and Southern Baptists in particular, and separated us from our African-American brothers and sisters; and

WHEREAS, Many of our congregations have intentionally and/or unintentionally excluded African-Americans from worship, membership, and leadership; and

WHEREAS, Racism profoundly distorts our understanding of Christian morality, leading some Southern Baptists to believe that racial prejudice and discrimination are compatible with the Gospel; and

WHEREAS, Jesus performed the ministry of reconciliation to restore sinners to a right relationship with the Heavenly Father, and to establish right relations among all human beings, especially within the family of faith.

Therefore, be it RESOLVED, That we, the messengers to the Sesquicentennial meeting of the Southern Baptist Convention, assembled in Atlanta, Georgia, June 20-22, 1995, unwaveringly denounce racism, in all its forms, as deplorable sin

But as reported upthread, it didn't take all that well.

 

[blutoski]

Wow, that would be a very racist and sexist view......I don't know anyone like that. Perhaps those attending cross burnings in sheets may think that way?

Or possibly those that practice Sharia law? Certainly doesn't sound like a Baptist view.....Chris B.

My previous posts covered race and gender disenfranchisement. Regarding disenfranchising the poor, we only have to go to Bannon. Bannon's explanation is that it's a way to sort out the genetically superior versus inferior and exclude the inferior from voting. His suggested threshold was profitable real estate ownership. (what previous generations called Landed Genrtry)

 

[blutoski]

From here:
http://www.sbc.net/resolutions/899/...nniversary-of-the-southern-baptist-convention

But as reported upthread, it didn't take all that well.

Indeed. 30 years too late to contribute to the Civil Rights movment, and even in 1995 it led to schism and the departure of some SBC member churches. It also isn't binding on individual churches, should they choose to stay segregated, they remain in good standing with the SBC. Weak sauce.

 

[thaiboxerken]

Nice Huffington Post piece. I don't believe we'll ever be rid of racism as long as we keep pointing out everyone's skin color. Chris B.

Ahh. The classic, conservative, answer to racism is to ignore it.

Pathetic.

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

"Input by others..." like Madison, maybe? ("The Father Of The Constitution") It's true that Jefferson wrote a letter to Madison calling for the addition of a Bill Of Rights; but "the lead effort" seems a little strong a characterization for a part played by a man who was, after all, in France when the thing was written.


Sure- it would have been just about as accurate as saying Jefferson wrote the Constitution, considering that (for example) only a third of the signers of the Constitution were actually members of what was really only a club that socially/politically active men happened to belong to. Or is the US Constitution some grand Masonic conspiracy we should be aware of?

Certainly the US was founded by Masons, but I'm not surprised if the average person did not know this as Masonic folks keep everything buried within a secret society. The layout for Washington DC and the Capitol were designed by Masons, this much is common knowledge. Check out the detail for building placement there sometime and draw a few lines to connect them, you may be surprised what you find. Free Masons were and are a great deal more than "only a club that socially/politically active men happened to belong to."
Without them, it's doubtful we would've had a Country, as sure as the Sun rises in the East, we have them to thank for the USA. Chris B.

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

Ahh. The classic, conservative, answer to racism is to ignore it.

Pathetic.

If you ignore race, racism has no basis to exist. Chris B.

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

Obviously "Baptists" aren't uniform (eg: would a black Baptist church have the same position on segregation as Jerry Falwell - obviously not). But, According to historian and former Southern Baptist Wayne Flynt, "The Southern Baptist church was the last bastion of segregation." The SBC (Southern Baptist Convention) issued an apology for its emphasis on White Supremacy in 1995. They do maintain a segregationist 'permissive' stance, but no longer insist on it as part of their "autonomy of the local church" position. On the other hand they did issue an unenforceable request for their member churches to stop using the Confederate flag as a backdrop behind altars... I think in 2012? Seems a day late and a dollar short on that one.

SBC is the mothership of Baptist churches in the USA. (second only to the Catholic Church in terms of population in the US), and their official position is that women aren't entitled to their own vote; their enfranchisement is only allowed if it amplifies their man's vote. A woman voting independently is a sin in their eyes. ("A wife is to submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband even as the church willingly submits to the headship of Christ.")

The SBC's attitude toward blacks and women is one of the reasons my wife left her SBC affiliated church. She joined an Evangelical Free congregation.

Confederate flags behind the altars! Are you seriously this misinformed? Do you just make this stuff up as you go or what? Ridiculous BS! Chris B.

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

My previous posts covered race and gender disenfranchisement. Regarding disenfranchising the poor, we only have to go to Bannon. Bannon's explanation is that it's a way to sort out the genetically superior versus inferior and exclude the inferior from voting. His suggested threshold was profitable real estate ownership. (what previous generations called Landed Genrtry)

link?

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

I am late to this thread, and have not had time to read through it.

Are all Trump supporters racists? Probably not intentionally, but I'm just plain sick and tired of people who vote for things they don't support because they don't understand the human implications of what they do.

If you vote for someone whose public and published opinion and personal history opposes human rights - as Trump does in many cases, then I think it does not matter what you think you believe. You are voting against human rights. If you vote for the curtailment of civil rights for any group you are voting for the curtailment of all the rights for every individual. If you vote against civil rights for gay couples, you should be able to walk up to any gay person and say "I believe you should go to prison for what and who you are. I believe that if you become ill your partner should be barred from visiting you and you should die alone and unloved." If you vote to exclude Muslims you do so for all forever. Every time you vote against someone's civil rights you do so for everyone, always and forever. If you cannot say this then you are sadly, woefully, fatally mistaken, and have voted for a creature that will eat the liberties and dignity of yourself and all around you. Shame on you.

I voted for the right of unborn babies to live as well. What did the candidate you supported say about unborn babies lives?

If you voted for someone that would kill the innocent unborn, what does this say about you as a person? Would their Civil Rights matter to you? Are you fine with killing the unborn? I expect millions of Black babies have been the victims of the mass genocide called abortion. Did you support the candidates who supported those Black children being killed?
Chris B.

 

[Resume]

Confederate flags behind the altars! Are you seriously this misinformed? Do you just make this stuff up as you go or what? Ridiculous BS! Chris B.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/s...drance-to-unity-of-the-body-of-christ-165197/

Over 90 percent of messengers at the Southern Baptist Convention repudiated the Confederate flag in a vote Tuesday that calls on all Christians and member churches to remove the divisive symbol from public display.

 

[bruto]

I voted for the right of unborn babies to live as well. What did the candidate you supported say about unborn babies lives?

If you voted for someone that would kill the innocent unborn, what does this say about you as a person? Would their Civil Rights matter to you? Are you fine with killing the unborn? I expect millions of Black babies have been the victims of the mass genocide called abortion. Did you support the candidates who supported those Black children being killed?
Chris B.

Emotional language and gratuitous racial nonsense aside, I support legal abortion, and I'm willing to say I do.

 

[Resume]

Certainly the US was founded . . .

By these folks. Start here:
https://www.boundless.com/u-s-histo...s-1365/the-american-enlightenment-1369-10315/

The American Enlightenment was an era of prolific discourse in which Anglo-American intellectuals studied human nature, society, and religion . . . Enlightenment thinkers often criticized religious institutions, seeing them as irrational, if not tyrannical . . . The Declaration of Independence, written by Thomas Jefferson, is seen as an embodiment or culmination of Enlightenment ideas.

 

[Aridas]

Completely agree, there are Atheists who view Christmas with a chuckle as they should. You're right. I've got to remember to not type anything that could be viewed as an all inclusive statement. That's what gets Trump into trouble.
Chris B.

More than that, there are lots of atheists who value the time with friends and family, regardless of the religious origin of the holiday. Origins tend to matter far less than current state, after all.

If you ignore race, racism has no basis to exist. Chris B.

For you, perhaps. That doesn't mean that others are also ignoring race, though, which leaves plenty of room for racism to still exist.

 

[quadraginta]

Almost every Country is where it is because they killed off all the natives that were living there before.......Sure, we killed lots of American Indians, they killed lots of us too. We killed lots of Mexicans and they likewise killed lots of Americans. But they lost and to the victors go the spoils. God Bless America!
Chris B.

And after they got done with all that killing?

How do you feel about God Blessed America repeatedly violating the very contracts they drew up with the ones they didn't get around to killing, according to God Blessed America's own God Blessed laws?

It shows just how much God Blessed America's God Blessed word of honor is worth. Can't even stick to their own God Blessed rules.

 

[quadraginta]

Certainly doesn't sound like a Baptist view.....Chris B.

Here's a Baptist view on integration:

“The facilities should be separate. When God has drawn a line of distinction, we should not attempt to cross that line,” he said in one sermon. In another: “The true Negro does not want integration. He realizes his potential is far better among his own race.”

<snip>

I guess it takes a rabid, right wing-nut, Christian fundie to have the chutzpah to whip out a No True Negro argument.

I won't go into what it says about the people who take their lead from someone like that.

 

[quadraginta]

From here:
http://www.sbc.net/resolutions/899/...nniversary-of-the-southern-baptist-convention

But as reported upthread, it didn't take all that well.

And it should be noted that it is a step they only took when backed to a wall, watching their membership plummet as local churches left in droves in disgust at the blatant racism, sexism, and generally overt, petty, small-minded bigotry of the Convention's historical stance and modern behavior about nearly everything.