Who killed Meredith Kercher? part 23

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Vixen said:
In any case, velocity is only of interest in the Kercher case as a means of determining the impact of the boulder. What we are really interested in is the force.
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I don't have the strength or inclination to even address the sheer torrent of bollocks spewing forth from within Vixen's "arguments" about Newtonian physics and ballistics science this evening - they are so many kinds of wrong that it's almost astonishing.

But this combination of two sentences quoted above should serve, to anyone who has even the most basic understanding of the relevant subjects, as a pretty good primer as to the grotesque scientific illiteracy (coupled, for good measure, with extraordinary levels of hubris and bluster based on a supposed actual understanding of the subjects!!) on display within Vixen's missives. I am at a total loss. Even a 12-year-old reasonably well schooled in the subjects could do measurably better. And know when he/she was wrong. Wow.

(Anyone who feels like counting and detailing the errors contained within just those two sentences is welcome to contribute. I can see three - two of which are absolute zingers which would require a rewriting of the laws of physics. Lovely stuff!)
 
Vixen said:
Try it for yourself. A ball thrown straight up into the air has little power, little distance and the only force acting on it is gravity, which is why we can use the law of gravity to calculate its pound-force.
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Nope. This one sentence might be even worse, all on its own, than the two I quoted before!! It's beyond parody. Amazing. Totally amazing.

Again, if a 12-year-old school pupil had written the above, I'd genuinely be surprised to read it (and I'd be deeply, deeply embarrassed if I was that pupil's physics teacher). And of course again, what makes it worse (though, at the same time, much funnier to people who actually understand the physics of motion) is the apparent insistence by author that she knows what she is talking about. Truly awesome to observe!
 
Cheeky side question for Vixen: if a ball is thrown horizontally, how many forces are acting on that ball which are different from the forces that would be acting on the same ball thrown vertically upwards?
 
Second cheeky side question for Vixen: are you sure that the only force acting on a ball thrown vertically upwards is the force of gravity?
 
If we take the PGP theory at face value it's freaking hilarious because Amanda keeps hitting holes-in-one despite doing EVERYTHING POSSIBLE to completely **** herself over.

First she picks an awkwardly high window very few would ever think about trying to break in through - but lucky for her the random accomplice that showed up at the crime scene to leave all the evidence happens to have a history of "absolutely not easy climbs" up to second story high windows.

Then she makes an even dumber mistake, and decides to break the window from INSIDE the room, smashing the rock into the window opened and angled directly into the room leaving irrefutable evidence of staging. But again, fantastic improbable luck bails her out, and every last piece of glass burst out perpendicular to the window pane, in the exact direction one would expect had the rock been thrown from outside.

But the PGP don't even notice these compounding improbabilities, because glass magically flying in the wrong direction just makes perfect sense if it means AK is guilty.

I've never been so obsessed with something being true that my mind works tirelessly to shield me from reality :\
 
Chris_Halkides said:
Link to video of his reconstruction. By analyzing the trajectory of the rock and the projection of the glass shards, Pasquali said he could "exclude that the glass could have been broken from the inside." As reported by Ann Wise of ABC news.
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Vixen said:
LOL And as promulgated by Amanda Knox misinformation services, 'Injustice in Perugia' funded by 'Friends of Amanda'.
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Try this one, it's from the case files:
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.c...os/misc/2009-05-13-Pasquali-rock-throwing.mp4 ...
 
Methos said:
Try this one, it's from the case files:
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.c...os/misc/2009-05-13-Pasquali-rock-throwing.mp4 ...
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Interesting.

Do you know the dimensions of the floor tiles? I estimate that each is a square with side length of about 1/3 meter.

For the first trial, I see the hand of the person throwing the rock, and it seems to me that the person may be only about 1 meter from the window. The rock is delivered by an underhand toss. From Marshal Pasquali's testimony, I had believed that the rock was thrown in each case from 3 meters away, to simulate a throw from the rampart. I don't see the hand in the 2nd and 3rd trials, so perhaps they were from 3 meters away. Is there any additional information about the method and distance used for the rock throws? Were there any additional videos in the record for the rock throws?
 
LondonJohn said:
Cheeky side question for Vixen: if a ball is thrown horizontally, how many forces are acting on that ball which are different from the forces that would be acting on the same ball thrown vertically upwards?
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Horizontal velocity is taken to be something moving along the ground, with fewer forces than something flying through the air. To fly through the air you need a force of take off or lift off, and you need adequate speed and height to keep going.

If you are a batsman and you hit the ball straight up in the air, it is extremely easy for a five year old to catch it, as it lacks the power of something whacked at a 45 degree angle, say.

A javelin, hammer or shot put thrown straight up in the air will have a pathetic outcome.
 
Vixen said:
Try it for yourself. A ball thrown straight up into the air has little power, little distance and the only force acting on it is gravity, which is why we can use the law of gravity to calculate its pound-force.
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Your physics discussion raises many questions.

Could you explain in some detail, showing the calculations, what amount of power a ball thrown up (only vertically) in the air has? How does that power compare, quantitatively, to that of a ball thrown at an angle or one thrown only horizontally? And what is the "little distance" that the ball has that you refer to, in terms of direction and quantitative value? And what is the "pound-force" of this ball, quantitatively (please show how you calculate it), and what does it do? Is it something that the ball acquires permanently or only at some point in its travel?
 
Methos said:
And the source for this is?
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Vixen is offering an opinion and an assertion based on nothing else than that she can type letters into the ISF editor from her remote keyboard.

As usual there is no citation to back up her opinion. This has been the problem from the beginning, started by the Perugian cops in 2007 who made similar assertions about other things - the break in by Rudy through Filomena's window being one.

They simply asserted that the break in had to have been staged, offering no evidence other than their opinion.

It has been this 'method' which has been the PGP's downfall...... summarized best in 2015 by the Italian Supreme Court itself, which acquitted the pair partly on the problem of even convicting judges substituting their own opinions and hunches for facts: or worse still, substituting their own hunches and guesses where no evidence existed.

However, once enshrined as a "judicial fact" officials down the line in the judicial system found themselves hampered.

All of this is now part of the record/history as to how the Italian courts persecuted innocents for 7 years before finally righting itself.

Vixen is simply trying to continue things from 2008 when citationless opinion carried the day.
 
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Vixen said:
Horizontal velocity is taken to be something moving along the ground, with fewer forces than something flying through the air. To fly through the air you need a force of take off or lift off, and you need adequate speed and height to keep going.
If you are a batsman and you hit the ball straight up in the air, it is extremely easy for a five year old to catch it, as it lacks the power of something whacked at a 45 degree angle, say.

A javelin, hammer or shot put thrown straight up in the air will have a pathetic outcome.
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Another unique discussion of physics.

Could you provide some more detail about your first statement? For example, suppose twins, "A" and "B", of the same height, throw a ball to each other. "A" throws the ball underhanded at a height of 1 meter to "B", and "B" catches the ball in her hand at a height of 1 meter. The ball does not touch the ground in its travel between "A" and "B". Could you detail all the forces and velocities, in terms of magnitudes and direction, that are involved in the throwing and travel of this ball? What keeps the ball up in the air?
 
LondonJohn said:
Second cheeky side question for Vixen: are you sure that the only force acting on a ball thrown vertically upwards is the force of gravity?
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It might just as well be.

The pound force will be distance (in feet*/inches) x its weight in pounds, divided by the distance it comes to a stop. (A heavier object will have a shorter distance than a lightweight.) This reflects the pound-force.

*We use feet because gravity is measured in feet per second and the pound (weight) is the other imperial unit. This is because, happily, the pound per sec in gravity equals per pound in weight.
 
Vixen said:
You simply draw up a diagram of all the forces acting on the body.


F = Force.
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Very amusing.

You have copied a diagram seemingly illustrating the vector, F_R, which is the result of the vector addition of two vectors F_1 and F_2, and a vector F_R (dotted line) opposite and equal to the vector sum.

What are the magnitudes and directions of the forces? What causes the forces? And what are these forces?

By magnitude, people who have studied physics mean: the quantitative value (a number with units; for example, 5.3 litres).

Directions must be given with respect to a "frame of reference" to be meaningful, for those who have studied physics. For example, are the force vectors in a plane locally tangent with the surface of the earth, with north and east designated, for example, on a playing field? Or is there some other alignment?
 
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Numbers said:
Your physics discussion raises many questions.

Could you explain in some detail, showing the calculations, what amount of power a ball thrown up (only vertically) in the air has? How does that power compare, quantitatively, to that of a ball thrown at an angle or one thrown only horizontally? And what is the "little distance" that the ball has that you refer to, in terms of direction and quantitative value? And what is the "pound-force" of this ball, quantitatively (please show how you calculate it), and what does it do? Is it something that the ball acquires permanently or only at some point in its travel?
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It depends on its weight and the height from which it is dropped, hence, these are factored into the formula.

Drop a heavy object from a tall building together with a light object, and you'll find (Gallileo) the heavy object lands nearer to the point from which it is dropped than the lighter object. this is the stop distance that helps you have a picture of the force of its impact. A lead weight will come down harder than a feather.

You would need calculus for different speeds but there's no harm using short cuts, such as pythagoras theorem or the parallogram, on the principle the direction of the forces can be represented abstractly as equal on their opposite sides.
 
Vixen said:
Horizontal velocity is taken to be something moving along the ground, with fewer forces than something flying through the air. To fly through the air you need a force of take off or lift off, and you need adequate speed and height to keep going.

If you are a batsman and you hit the ball straight up in the air, it is extremely easy for a five year old to catch it, as it lacks the power of something whacked at a 45 degree angle, say.

A javelin, hammer or shot put thrown straight up in the air will have a pathetic outcome.
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Are you sure there are fewer forces acting on a ball being rolled along the ground than one thrown through the air? Care to articulate, precisely, the various forces acting on a ball rolling along the ground vs those acting on a ball being thrown through the air?

(Hint 1: you couldn't be more wrong)

(Hint 2: you have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about in the entire realm of physical forces, the physics of motion and ballistics theory. No idea at all. At all. It's very entertaining though).
 
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