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Trump runs for POTUS/ Trumped Up! Part VII

trustbutverify said:
If any credible evidence does appear, it's gonna be an interesting day in this thread.
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If any credible evidence appears, I will happily form a judgment.

Until then, both skepticism and decency suggest we ought not speculate so insistently.
 
phiwum said:
If any credible evidence appears, I will happily form a judgment.

Until then, both skepticism and decency suggest we ought not speculate so insistently.
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If Donald wanted people to treat him with "decency" he had the option of not being a sexual predator and not making it clear that he is attracted to his daughter.
 
Ladewig said:
But if he has not committed non-consensual intercourse with his other victims, then there really isn't much to support the speculation that he committed non-consensual intercourse with his daughter.
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The available evidence probably suggests a higher probability of Trump having molested his daughter than outright raped her.

But, honestly, I think dragging Ivanka into this, in this way, is kind of sleazy.
 
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Tony Stark said:
Most people aren't sexual predators who are attracted to their daughters.
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marplots said:
Exactly. That means more evidence is needed, not less.
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Tony Stark said:
Makes no sense.
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Here's my thinking. The set of "most people aren't sexual predators" means we need evidence to put Trump into that camp - we can't just do it by default. But then, the narrower set of "sexual predators who are attracted to their daughters" is even smaller, and the final set "guy had sex with his daughter" is smaller still. As the descriptions get more specific, more (or more targeted) evidence is called for.

It's the same thing that would happen if the chain were: He commits robberies -> he robs banks -> he robs Wells Fargo banks -> he robbed this branch of the Wells Fargo Bank. Allegations earlier in the chain do not constitute strong evidence later in the chain.
 
marplots said:
Here's my thinking. The set of "most people aren't sexual predators" means we need evidence to put Trump into that camp - we can't just do it by default. But then, the narrower set of "sexual predators who are attracted to their daughters" is even smaller, and the final set "guy had sex with his daughter" is smaller still. As the descriptions get more specific, more (or more targeted) evidence is called for.

It's the same thing that would happen if the chain were: He commits robberies -> he robs banks -> he robs Wells Fargo banks -> he robbed this branch of the Wells Fargo Bank. Allegations earlier in the chain do not constitute strong evidence later in the chain.
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I'm not even saying he did it.

I just don't think it is unreasonable to believe he may have.
 
Both daughters have shown evasive body language when he gets physical. But they also give him dazzling smiles. Maybe he's such a caveman that his hands will wander around any young, attractive female.

I don't think he's a child molester. His daughters seem too well-adjusted. That's just a gut feeling, I have no evidence, obviously. I do think he touches them in ways they are not comfortable with and he is too entitled and/or oblivious to see that or respect it.
 
Minoosh said:
Both daughters have shown evasive body language when he gets physical. But they also give him dazzling smiles. Maybe he's such a caveman that his hands will wander around any young, attractive female.

I don't think he's a child molester. His daughters seem too well-adjusted. That's just a gut feeling, I have no evidence, obviously. I do think he touches them in ways they are not comfortable with and he is too entitled and/or oblivious to see that or respect it.
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All his children were almost exclusively raised by their mothers after the divorces. They didn't develop any sort of real relationships with him until after they became adults. This is probably why he has a weird distant but way too sexually attracted interactions with them. There isn't a parent child relationship between them but more people that met as adults that happen to be parent and child. They're attractive young women and that's how he interacts with all attractive young women.
 
Tony Stark said:
I'm not even saying he did it.

I just don't think it is unreasonable to believe he may have.
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That's where I got tripped up last time. On what constitutes unreasonable and what "may have" actually claims, if anything. Combining the two makes for a pseudo-claim: something that sounds like a claim, but really asserts nothing at all.

I don't think it's unreasonable for someone to believe Trump may have had sexual reassignment surgery. I mean, he "may have" right? It's possible. Even I believe it's possible.

My mistake earlier was thinking the pseudo-claim was really a claim. Entirely my fault.
 
I agree that this is totally unfair treatment of a potentially honorable person. Sure, we know that he's bragged about groping women. Well, yeah, we've seen him fondling his daughter, or at least trying to, on national television. Yeah, there's that picture of him at a Beach Boys concert with a post-pubescent Ivanka in hot pants sitting on his lap. And he did say he'd like to, er, date.... her if she wasn't his daughter. And acknowledged, when cornered, that it should be okay for another creepy rich and famous person to call her "a piece of ass"

Well, I just hope no one links to his comment from,.... from..... now what show was that?


Oh, look! Here it is.... I'm sure this is just locker room talk. We all invite our daughter, a female host, a live audience and a half-million home viewers into the locker room, right? Well, I know I sure do.



Yeah, I just hope no one finds that and links to it. Because that would be just speculative pandering. And that's probably not a skeptical way to approach questions. No sir! We're Skeptics, by gawd and we need to give perps people the benefit of the doubt. Innocent until proven guilty. This is still America*, right?


(This was my totally disingenuous version of Trump's "You know, I could've said some bad stuff about Bill but I'm so classy I didn't..." while he had seven spokes-weasels lined up to grab microphones on every network to explain what he meant by that.)

*And, no... I'm in Thailand. We can lock yer ass up and hold you with no evidence of any sort.
 
BTW the Trump star defacer has been arrested, and all it took was him giving his name to passers by while using the pickaxe...

In an interview with the Los Angeles Times, James Otis said he was sick of Trump's "aggressive language toward women" and "his sexual violence with women and against women". He plans to auction chunks of the damaged star...
 
Trump's comments on his daughter (or Paris Hilton as a kid, for that matter), are disturbing enough.

But what really gets me is his inability of him (and many of his supporters) to see them for what they are: a total lack of understanding how they are perceived by the rest of the world: this shows an almost pathological lack of empathy.
 
phiwum said:
It is not well-informed speculation. We don't know much about Trump's relationship with his daughter, aside (of course) from his very creepy comments.

There's no reason at all to keep going on about a mere possibility. It's just salacious wishful thinking. It has not place on a skeptics' forum.
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Agreed. Never let it be said that irrationality, nor lack of self-awareness, is the exclusive domain of the right.
 
Regarding the ongoing reports that Donald Trump is planning to launch his own TV channel, The Don has denied having any interest. However, son-in-law Jared Kushner is supposed to be quietly making contacts with at least one banking group to see if they would be interested in financing it. I think that's the problem.

If he could get financing Trump could conceivably start a cable TV channel. There is no chance, I would think, of him starting a 'fifth TV network' to compete with Fox, I think that is well beyond his means to finance and I doubt (with his track record) he could arrange that kind of mega financing.

If he has any common sense left at all, I don't think Trump will want to get involved in starting a TV channel. Reportedly, his lucrative hotels are beginning to have problems with sinking occupancy rates, fallout from his dismal presidential campaign. After the election he needs to concentrate on trying to jump start his hotels and do some image damage control, not make things worse for his 'brand' by starting some mindless right-wing TV channel.

Nobody really seems to be picking up on this, but the decision by the Trump hotel group to NOT USE the name Trump on new hotels (but use 'Scion') is really startling. I'm sure that is one of The Don's own companies, that he operates, and I am sure he must have approved of the decision. For Trump to agree to remove his name from anything is a surprise, but from hotels is, I think, very revealing.

Trump knows disaster. He crashed and burned with the football team (taking the whole league down with him), with the airline and, most famously, with the Atlantic City casinos. I have a hunch he smells financial disaster lurking after the election.
 
It's just my own personal opinion, but I suspect that Trump hasn't actually had anywhere near the number of successful sexual encounters his constant talk implies. The fact that he grabs women against their will, and abuses his power to creep on them, suggests to me that he's failing to "make the deal" and actually get any sex from women. "Locker room talk", bragging to other men, trying to impress others with talk of his sexual prowess...those are the hallmarks of someone who tries and fails to get laid.

I know he's had several extra-marital affairs, and has offspring, so he's not a virgin. But I'd be willing to bet Trump-level sums of money that he's exaggerating his sexual exploits by as much as he exaggerates estimations of his wealth.

So he's a terrible person for sexual harrassment, and being a creeper, but I doubt he's actually succeeded in banging more than a tiny percentage of the women he's tried to get with.
 
TragicMonkey said:
It's just my own personal opinion, but I suspect that Trump hasn't actually had anywhere near the number of successful sexual encounters his constant talk implies. The fact that he grabs women against their will, and abuses his power to creep on them, suggests to me that he's failing to "make the deal" and actually get any sex from women. "Locker room talk", bragging to other men, trying to impress others with talk of his sexual prowess...those are the hallmarks of someone who tries and fails to get laid.

I know he's had several extra-marital affairs, and has offspring, so he's not a virgin. But I'd be willing to bet Trump-level sums of money that he's exaggerating his sexual exploits by as much as he exaggerates estimations of his wealth.

So he's a terrible person for sexual harrassment, and being a creeper, but I doubt he's actually succeeded in banging more than a tiny percentage of the women he's tried to get with.
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That's not true! Donald has banged the most, and the hottest women of any man ever. Including maybe his daughter. Believe me.
 
Tony Stark said:
That's not true! Donald has banged the most, and the hottest women of any man ever. Including maybe his daughter. Believe me.
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He's 70 years old and fat. Probably has a heart condition, and is on medication for it. His banging days are most likely over. For other people that doesn't necessarily mean an end to sex, but I can't imagine Trump being the sort of man who would even consider any form of sex that required focusing more on the other party's pleasure than his own. He talks and grabs because that's all he can do now.
 
catsmate said:
BTW the Trump star defacer has been arrested, and all it took was him giving his name to passers by while using the pickaxe...

In an interview with the Los Angeles Times, James Otis said he was sick of Trump's "aggressive language toward women" and "his sexual violence with women and against women". He plans to auction chunks of the damaged star...
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He's also an heir to the Otis Elevator fortune which I didn't know was a thing until this happened.
 
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