Merged Things that Bubba finds interesting or newsworthy

bruto said:
I can imagine unknown forces within a government, but aside, perhaps, from the king of the fairies, what would an unknown government govern?
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per your logic...


I'd speculate the (your) unknown/unseen forces within, controlling a government would be able to be controlling whatever it is the visible govt thinks it is governing.

There are many ways by which your imagined unknown forces within a government could hypothetically control people by controlling their visible govt.


BTW when I said in the OP "Which of the world's known governments.." I was thinking something like covert govts could exist within visible ones.


However not necessarily unseen by, or unknown by by the visible govt.

Example:

a) visible govt controlled by blackmail and the governed dont know about it.


b) visible govt unwittingly drugged (or senile)and manipulated by corrupt staff members.
 
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For some reason, I am ready for Rudders of the Lost Barque.


Though I could live with Raiders of the Misplaced Caravelle !!!
 
HansMustermann said:
IF there had actually been a believable clue to the location of the holy ark, I think it's not too unbelievable that the Nazis could have sent an expedition there too.
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Yes. In that respect, the premise of Spielberg's movie is wholly credible.
 
Bubba said:
Which of the world's known governments (did or would do) today or historically is/was likely to be sending, or have sent, their forces out across the world looking for old stuff whether on land (like antartica) or underwater?

Such as govt forces looking for old stuff mythical or not across world.

As seen in "Raiders of the Lost Ark", for example.

What do historians have to share on this?
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Obviously, governments sponsor archaeologists all the time through universities and musea to look for old stuff. And especially in Egypt and the Middle East, lots of European and American archaeologists are working on digs because there's just too much for the local archaeologists to master. (well, the enthusiasm for digging in Syria or Iraq may be temporarily down a notch or two). As a particular example, I'd like to mention UNICEF's "Nubian Campaign" to rescue the various Egyptian antiquities that would be flooded due to the Aswan Dam. Various countries contributed also, one of the rescued temples now stands in the Dutch National Museum of Antiquities in Leiden.

Mostly, that´s not for mythical stuff, with one exception: the subfield known as "Biblical Archaeology". Until 1980 or so, that subfield was solely concerned with proving the Bible right. In other words, archaeologists went in with the assumption that the Bible was historically 100% accurate and they interpreted their finds in that context. That has now for the most part changed, but there are still lots of people in the field who desperately want the Bible to be true. So you get papers that claim there were pottery finds in Nazareth from "the first century AD" when it's clear all that pottery postdates 70AD and nothing was found from Jesus' times - neither pottery nor other signs of habitation.
 
ddt said:
Obviously, governments sponsor archaeologists all the time through universities and musea to look for old stuff. And especially in Egypt and the Middle East, lots of European and American archaeologists are working on digs because there's just too much for the local archaeologists to master. (well, the enthusiasm for digging in Syria or Iraq may be temporarily down a notch or two). As a particular example, I'd like to mention UNICEF's "Nubian Campaign" to rescue the various Egyptian antiquities that would be flooded due to the Aswan Dam. Various countries contributed also, one of the rescued temples now stands in the Dutch National Museum of Antiquities in Leiden.

Mostly, that´s not for mythical stuff, with one exception: the subfield known as "Biblical Archaeology". Until 1980 or so, that subfield was solely concerned with proving the Bible right. In other words, archaeologists went in with the assumption that the Bible was historically 100% accurate and they interpreted their finds in that context. That has now for the most part changed, but there are still lots of people in the field who desperately want the Bible to be true. So you get papers that claim there were pottery finds in Nazareth from "the first century AD" when it's clear all that pottery postdates 70AD and nothing was found from Jesus' times - neither pottery nor other signs of habitation.
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Such a great breath of fresh air....thanks very much.


Still I wonder if interdepartmentally there could be....degrees of shenanigans around pet projects.
 
ddt said:
Mostly, that´s not for mythical stuff, with one exception: the subfield known as "Biblical Archaeology". Until 1980 or so, that subfield was solely concerned with proving the Bible right. In other words, archaeologists went in with the assumption that the Bible was historically 100% accurate and they interpreted their finds in that context. That has now for the most part changed, but there are still lots of people in the field who desperately want the Bible to be true. So you get papers that claim there were pottery finds in Nazareth from "the first century AD" when it's clear all that pottery postdates 70AD and nothing was found from Jesus' times - neither pottery nor other signs of habitation.
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Well, what annoys me more are more point-blank claims like "this may well be the house where Jesus lived" when they find one random house. Never even mind that two paragraphs later it has a hiding place from the time of the revolt against Rome, but WTH clue does one have that there's any connection to Jesus?

It's like finding a random house in Solin in Dalmatia and claiming this may well be the house where Diocletian was born. WTH?
 
HansMustermann said:
Well, what annoys me more are more point-blank claims like "this may well be the house where Jesus lived" when they find one random house. Never even mind that two paragraphs later it has a hiding place from the time of the revolt against Rome, but WTH clue does one have that there's any connection to Jesus?

It's like finding a random house in Solin in Dalmatia and claiming this may well be the house where Diocletian was born. WTH?
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That [formerly respectable] Scot archaeologist was horrible at that, and he also employed the ever-popular History Channel/Discovery Channel dodge... "Unfortunately our flights were scheduled for departure but we hope that further exploration will tell us in the future if this was really the Missing Dental Floss Dispenser Of The Last Supper". He did a bunch like that and with "well, the dental floss wasn't here, but there are those crosses in the wall and that article we read in Reader's Digest, so the search will continue...."
 
HansMustermann said:
Well, what annoys me more are more point-blank claims like "this may well be the house where Jesus lived" when they find one random house. Never even mind that two paragraphs later it has a hiding place from the time of the revolt against Rome, but WTH clue does one have that there's any connection to Jesus?

It's like finding a random house in Solin in Dalmatia and claiming this may well be the house where Diocletian was born. WTH?
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http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/biblical-sites-places/biblical-archaeology-sites/has-the-childhood-home-of-jesus-been-found/:
The excavation site located beneath the convent has been known since 1880, but it was never professionally excavated until the Nazareth Archaeological Project began its work in 2006. In “Has Jesus’ Nazareth House Been Found?” in the March/April 2015 issue of BAR, Ken Dark, the director of the Nazareth Archaeological Project, not only describes the remains of the home itself, but explores the evidence that suggests that this is the place where Jesus spent his formative years—or at least the place regarded in the Byzantine period as the childhood home of Jesus.
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Ken Dark is an archaeology professor from the public university of Reading, UK. Yep, state-sponsored search for mythical stuff.
 
Foolmewunz said:
That [formerly respectable] Scot archaeologist was horrible at that, and he also employed the ever-popular History Channel/Discovery Channel dodge... "Unfortunately our flights were scheduled for departure but we hope that further exploration will tell us in the future if this was really the Missing Dental Floss Dispenser Of The Last Supper". He did a bunch like that and with "well, the dental floss wasn't here, but there are those crosses in the wall and that article we read in Reader's Digest, so the search will continue...."
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Like that show eith the guy lookng for evidence of the Knights Templar secret treasure everywhere. Each show starts with 'Is this the link we have been looking for?'
Guess the answer.
 
As for the Ark, isn't it supposed to be in that little church in Ethiopia that no one but the Priest is allowed to enter?
 
Beelzebuddy said:
Is there any substantiation to the common SF trope that Hitler was a bit of an occultist and tried to conjure up some magic superweapon in the failing days of WW2?

He did have his fingers in a lot of pies at the time, so I guess it's possible that some of them were digging for woo.
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No. Hitler had very little belief/interest in the occult, Himmler was the believer.

Much of the whole "Nazi Occult" trope was a fabrication, starting with Lewis Spence’s The Occult Causes of the Present War. This continued after the war, e.g. The Morning of the Magicians and The Spear of Destiny.

Anyway, Hitler was not an occultist, he had little patience for Himmler’s obsessions and condemned them publicly and privately on many occasions. He also did not (despite the nonsense in various books) believe in astrology. Hitler's conceptions of race and history were somewhat mystical but it was an
operatic mysticism.
 
Vortigern99 said:
Evidently Scotsman Lewis Spence, my favorite 20th-century occult author, first propounded the notion of Nazi occult obsession in 1940. People have been scrambling to find evidence for it ever since, but it appears to be largely circumstantial and exaggerated.
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Spence was the first to popularise the supposed link, and was used as a propagandist, but he based his claims on Edouard Saby’s Hitler et les Forces Occultes (published in French in 1939) and Hermann Rauschning's Gespräche mit Hitler (aka Hitler Speaks). Both are utter rubbish; Rauschning was a disenchanted conservative German politician and former Nazi ally and Saby was an occultist with fascist leanings.
 
I thought Hitler wanted to weave a modern myth of Germanic knights to replace religion, rather than promote any occult message? It was all about the ideal of the healthy rural worker and virtuous knight?
 
Curses!

I could have conned someone out of their money if were not for those meddleling kids with them thar' facts and logic.
 
Crossbow said:
I know of several secret governments that have done such things.

Send me $100.00 and I will tell you all of the details.
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Will you take a check from The Bank of Brigadoon? It's good once every 100 years and I'm due.
 
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