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General Holocaust denial discussion Part III

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Hans said:
Thanks Nick

I have access to JSTOR

[qimg]http://i.imgur.com/D819WTc.jpg[/qimg]

[qimg]http://i.imgur.com/rro2wWm.jpg[/qimg]
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Thanks - it is obvious from this excerpt that Jim Rizoli cherrypicked or utilized the cherrypicking of others. E.g., Jim Rizoli didn’t share with us that Gringauz wrote, “In our opinion survivors of the great catastrophe can make an important contribution to the exploration of the problem” provided that their insights come in alignment with social scientists and that their experiences are evaluated using the methods of the social sciences. The last sentence of the excerpt suggests that Gringauz was focused on the “social organization of the ghetto,” a topic I dare say Jim Rizoli has yet to post on here. Note also that Gringauz describes what happened to Jews during the war as "the great catastrophe."
 
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LemmyCaution said:
Thanks - it is obvious from this excerpt that Jim Rizoli cherrypicked or utilized the cherrypicking of others. E.g., Jim Rizoli didn’t share with us that Gringauz wrote, “In our opinion survivors of the great catastrophe can make an important contribution to the exploration of the problem” provided that their insights come in alignment with social scientists and that their experiences are evaluated using the methods of the social sciences. The last sentence of the excerpt suggests that Gringauz was focused on the “social organization of the ghetto,” a topic I dare say Jim Rizoli has yet to post on here. Note also that Gringauz describes what happened to Jews during the war as "the great catastrophe."
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It's pretty clear from reading the whole thing that Gringauz was not in any way, shape, or form calling the memoirs fictional (as the deniers here are pretending he was), but instead pointing out the difficulties inherent in using those memoirs as part of social science research into specific aspects of the social organization of the ghettoes because those memoirs were not exactly focused on providing a dry objective overview of such things, but instead were attempts by the survivors to grapple with and contextualize the horrors that they lived through.
 
CORed said:
You do know that it is possible to build a gas tight window? Don't you? Aw, who am I kidding, of course you don't.
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Interesting point. My home is not airtight (like most peoples) and it has windows (like most peoples).

It also has a CO monitor (like most peoples I hope).

In Rizoli world, one cannot be subject to CO poisoning if one dwells in a home which has windows and is not airtight.
 
Hans said:
Sorry no Jimmie but thanks for stating it was made up. However, I suspect instead that it is only taken out of context by his copying it without ever checking on its context. You quy's constantly copy stuff from other haters without checking it causing comedic errors one after another.

lol
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It's funny because it shows the true Rizoli ethos. Make **** up and keep quoting it.
 
Nick Terry said:
The Gringauz quote is meaningless for the following reasons:

1. There's no evidence he had actually read a representative sample of the memoirs, reports and testimonies written down by Holocaust survivors up to the start of 1950, so his remarks aren't empirically grounded in any way.

2. all memoirs, reports and testimonies written after 1950, when Gringauz's article appeared, cannot be smeared by this quote-mine, since Gringauz couldn't possibly have read them as they didn't exist yet.

3. Gringauz fails to cite a single example of a memoir, report or testimony in his 9 page article.

4. Nor does he actually cite many memoirs etc in his previous article, which seems to be largely based on his own memory of the Kovno ghetto: Samuel Gringauz, 'The Ghetto as an Experiment of Jewish Social Organization (Three Years of Kovno Ghetto)', Jewish Social Studies, Vol. 11, No. 1 (Jan., 1949), pp. 3-20. There's an approving reference to Mark Dworzecki/Dvorzhetskii's "special study" of medical resistance in the Vilna ghetto, otherwise I'm not seeing where Gringauz engages with memoirs at all.
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Additionally, he is speaking on the context of ghetto testimonies. The denier sources that use his quote speak for the most part about testimony from the death camps. I'm not sure if this is ignorance or dishonesty on their part. In Rizzoli's case it is certainly the former.
 
So in amongst all their whining about how it's the "holohoaxers" that are liars, is there anything that the deniers here have cited and/or quoted without making up a whole lot of crap about it?

Or is this the biggest case of projection since the invention of IMAX?
 
Degeneve said:
Thank you. This clearly shows that HDenier has practised quote mining again.
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That was my first suspicion. I am not an expert on the Holocaust like many here but it looked that way.

One of my old professor (Wilhelm Solheim) called such quote mining the work of 'stinky-footed bumpkins' referring to what people were walking in when they would try this 'trick'.
 
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I would suggest that you all study the topic False Memory Syndrome. Elizabeth Lotus has been studying and publishing this topic for over 40 years and guess what she is a Jewish. Now she had a choice at the Zündel trial to give her opinion but chickened out when she realized her views could have blackballed the whole holocaust story and it's uses of witnesses. Her work reverberates the view that witness testimony if absolute, it is not. To see so many of you post witness testimony make me laugh.....Witness testimony is pronounced the least inner of facts in any case be it the holohoax or a traffic accident unless real evidence exist......These stories of gassings are false memories...made-up, rumor or part true and part false. It happens all the time......The gas chambers were misinterpreted from the REAL fumigation FACTS. I'm surprised the Skeptics here can't see that, apparently they aren't real Skeptics, lol.....But I am when it comes to this holohoax..lol....

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
 
A'isha said:
It's pretty clear from reading the whole thing that Gringauz was not in any way, shape, or form calling the memoirs fictional (as the deniers here are pretending he was), but instead pointing out the difficulties inherent in using those memoirs as part of social science research into specific aspects of the social organization of the ghettoes because those memoirs were not exactly focused on providing a dry objective overview of such things, but instead were attempts by the survivors to grapple with and contextualize the horrors that they lived through.
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Thanks, I just got my mitts on the essay, and on his previous article on Kaunas ghetto, and I fully agree with you. There's a bit of what would be Hilberg's methodology in his approach. He positions Jewish reactions as those made in a life/death situation, when their existence was threatened. Jim would not like either piece, both of which deal, as you say, with life in the ghetto during the great catastrophe visited on Lithuania by the Germans. His essay on Kaunas anticipates a lot of later work on the persistence of Jewish cultural life in extreme conditions.
 
A'isha said:
So in amongst all their whining about how it's the "holohoaxers" that are liars, is there anything that the deniers here have cited and/or quoted without making up a whole lot of crap about it?

Or is this the biggest case of projection since the invention of IMAX?
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Corollary: can they point to a single lie any of us has posted?
 
LemmyCaution said:
Thanks - it is obvious from this excerpt that Jim Rizoli cherrypicked or utilized the cherrypicking of others. E.g., Jim Rizoli didn’t share with us that Gringauz wrote, “In our opinion survivors of the great catastrophe can make an important contribution to the exploration of the problem” provided that their insights come in alignment with social scientists and that their experiences are evaluated using the methods of the social sciences. The last sentence of the excerpt suggests that Gringauz was focused on the “social organization of the ghetto,” a topic I dare say Jim Rizoli has yet to post on here. Note also that Gringauz describes what happened to Jews during the war as "the great catastrophe."
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The last paragraph from SG's paper

H9L5nSt.jpg
 
HDenier said:
The gas chambers were misinterpreted from the REAL fumigation FACTS. I'm surprised the Skeptics here can't see that, apparently they aren't real Skeptics, lol.....But I am when it comes to this holohoax..lol....
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Jim Rizoli has yet to provide - he's been asked - "the REAL fumigation FACTS" for the gas chamber shown here.

Can you help him? You can start by telling us about how CO was used by the Germans in fumigating clothes.
 
HDenier said:
I would suggest that you all study the topic False Memory Syndrome. Elizabeth Lotus has been studying and publishing this topic for over 40 years and guess what she is a Jewish. Now she had a choice at the Zündel trial to give her opinion but chickened out when she realized her views could have blackballed the whole holocaust story and it's uses of witnesses. Her work reverberates the view that witness testimony if absolute, it is not. To see so many of you post witness testimony make me laugh.....Witness testimony is pronounced the least inner of facts in any case be it the holohoax or a traffic accident unless real evidence exist......These stories of gassings are false memories...made-up, rumor or part true and part false. It happens all the time......The gas chambers were misinterpreted from the REAL fumigation FACTS. I'm surprised the Skeptics here can't see that, apparently they aren't real Skeptics, lol.....But I am when it comes to this holohoax..lol....
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Yawn, oh and I see you refuse to acknowledge your error in posting the SG quote. Cannot admit mistakes huh? When you make a mistake pretend you didn't and change the subject. Huh?

lol
 
HDenier said:
I would suggest that you all study the topic False Memory Syndrome. Elizabeth Lotus has been studying and publishing this topic for over 40 years and guess what she is a Jewish. Now she had a choice at the Zündel trial to give her opinion but chickened out when she realized her views could have blackballed the whole holocaust story and it's uses of witnesses. Her work reverberates the view that witness testimony if absolute, it is not. To see so many of you post witness testimony make me laugh.....Witness testimony is pronounced the least inner of facts in any case be it the holohoax or a traffic accident unless real evidence exist......These stories of gassings are false memories...made-up, rumor or part true and part false. It happens all the time......The gas chambers were misinterpreted from the REAL fumigation FACTS. I'm surprised the Skeptics here can't see that, apparently they aren't real Skeptics, lol.....But I am when it comes to this holohoax..lol....

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
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Wow! Her testimony plus Zündel's and your opinion could have turned this whole thing around?


Bwaahahahahaha
 
That statement by the Jew Gringuaz reflects ALL the truths about the Holocaust. From the individuals FEW testimonies taken at the Nuremberg trials, to the idiot statements about the Human "fat" soaps, the homicidal gassings, to the many many obvious stories of misinformation, impossibilities, rumor, myths, lies from the holohoaxters and those who keep supporting these fraudsters.. I don't have to defend the holohoax with this nonsense, I just tell the truth, life is good in that case, for you holohoaxers you are always looking for as story to back up your case that as far As I'm concerned out right lies. Go listen to a few of Elizabeth Lotus discussions about false memories and your Holohoax is buried for good. Remember Lotus is a JEW. She is not out to discuss the holocaust but since most of the holohoax depends on MEMORY it fits the discussion....Her problem and ours is she is afraid to defend us revisionist because she knows her business and profession would be in ruins because the Jews being the people they are, lol... would make sure she wouldn't practice anywhere in the country ever again. I actually feel sorry for her. You wonder why Jesus and the Apostle Paul condemned them as a people they truly are, form the synagogue of Satan as the Bible says, Rev 2:9, 3:9

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This Skeptic is extremely skeptical of HDenier's testimony that he had 'spent good money' on many books about the Holocaust.

So far HDenier has not offered any proof or evidence that he did any such thing.
 
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