Ed Melania Trump was an illegal immigrant?

[ponderingturtle]

She worked illegally. The news has been careful to point that out, not to call her an illegal immigrant.

If she was paid, if she was working for exposure as is not unlikely then not.

 

[ponderingturtle]

Why? Many media organisations have investigative divisions? I know real investigative journalism is dying in the USA but it's not quite dead yet.

But apparently it is all ominous when Hispanics do it.

 

[thaiboxerken]

US xenophobes are evidently much more liberal than their UK counterparts.

The Brexiteers here are enormously exercised about Polish and other E European EU immigrants, and racist attacks on these ethnic groups, white though their skins be, have risen significantly.

Here, it is about white-supremacy and not xenophobia.

 

[Foolmewunz]

That doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. Trump has taken an anti-illegal immigrant stance and one with which I profoundly disagree but what do we expect him to do when he finds out that his wife of 11 years had some photographs taken 21 years ago when she didn't have a suitable work permit ?

If we expect him to suddenly change his policy that would make no sense. Even if he suddenly had a road to Damascus moment, it's still a policy that plays well to the GOP.

Expecting his to disown his wife is equally unrealistic. The events happened 10 years before their wedding and probably well before he knew her. He is not responsible for her actions at the time and IMO it's realistic to assume that he was unaware of them right up until the time when the story broke.

Are we instead just going to brand him a hypocrite because he's anti-illegal immigrant and yet he's married to someone who broke immigration rules ? That would only make sense if he knew at the time of his marriage that this was the case. That's like criticising someone who has a strong anti-drug stance if their spouse had been known to use drugs from time to time at college but had never told the candidate.

No one expects Trump to disown or deport his wife. No one expects him to realize the hypocrisy of his intransigent positions on evil brown immigrants versus lovely trophy-wife-white immigrants.

The entire argument is addressed to the issue of embarrassing.... not Trump, the man hasn't an ounce of actual pride, but embarrassing his supposed "thinking conservative" followers who claim to have a moral compass and a conscience. Trump is incorrigible. Many of his followers are, also. But those "many" are going to say in the mid-thirties as a percentage of the population. The goal is to get all the others to move away from him... and them. Un-elect, e.g. "defeat" the TP bigots. Relegate Trump to the ash heap of history.

Yeah, make America great again by remembering this isn't what we are like.

 

[quadraginta]

<snip>

Are we instead just going to brand him a hypocrite because he's anti-illegal immigrant and yet he's married to someone who broke immigration rules ? That would only make sense if he knew at the time of his marriage that this was the case. That's like criticising someone who has a strong anti-drug stance if their spouse had been known to use drugs from time to time at college but had never told the candidate.

One of the main planks he's been building his own platform with, from the very beginning of his campaign, is that he is going to deport all the illegal immigrants.

If that were to turn out to be almost all of the illegal immigrants, except for the ones he wants to keep around for personal reasons, why wouldn't that be hypocrisy?

 

[quadraginta]

US xenophobes are evidently much more liberal than their UK counterparts.

The Brexiteers here are enormously exercised about Polish and other E European EU immigrants, and racist attacks on these ethnic groups, white though their skins be, have risen significantly.

They have gotten used to the idea that they don't need to single out skin color to be racists. They've had a few centuries of practice with the Irish.

 

[The Don]

No one expects Trump to disown or deport his wife. No one expects him to realize the hypocrisy of his intransigent positions on evil brown immigrants versus lovely trophy-wife-white immigrants.

The entire argument is addressed to the issue of embarrassing.... not Trump, the man hasn't an ounce of actual pride, but embarrassing his supposed "thinking conservative" followers who claim to have a moral compass and a conscience. Trump is incorrigible. Many of his followers are, also. But those "many" are going to say in the mid-thirties as a percentage of the population. The goal is to get all the others to move away from him... and them. Un-elect, e.g. "defeat" the TP bigots. Relegate Trump to the ash heap of history.

Yeah, make America great again by remembering this isn't what we are like.

Then I'm not sure how this is embarrassing to anyone. Trump married someone who once worked illegally but he didn't know it at the time of his marriage and AFAIK there's no suggestion that her current immigration status is irregular or that she should now be deported.

Again IMO it's like an candidate who is running on an anti-drug platform whose spouse is shown to have taken drugs once in college, years before they met the candidate.

 

[Cleon]

Given how skeezy the modeling industry is, it wouldn't surprise me if she wasn't paid or if she didn't know she was breaking the law.

 

[The Don]

One of the main planks he's been building his own platform with, from the very beginning of his campaign, is that he is going to deport all the illegal immigrants.

If that were to turn out to be almost all of the illegal immigrants, except for the ones he wants to keep around for personal reasons, why wouldn't that be hypocrisy?

Is there a suggestion that she is an illegal immigrant.

As I understand it, she had some photos taken more than 20 years ago which may of may not have broken the terms of her then tourist visa (there is some doubt whether she was paid). I presume that her residency in the US is based on her marital status or some other factors. I'm not aware that this can be revoked - it'd be like someone who is currently a legal immigrant being deported from the U.S. because they did one shift of paid bar work when they were over on vacation.

I would certainly fall into that category in the U.S.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Then I'm not sure how this is embarrassing to anyone. Trump married someone who once worked illegally but he didn't know it at the time of his marriage and AFAIK there's no suggestion that her current immigration status is irregular or that she should now be deported.

Again IMO it's like an candidate who is running on an anti-drug platform whose spouse is shown to have taken drugs once in college, years before they met the candidate.

You wouldn't, assuming as I do that you have a conscience and some moral fiber, find it embarrassing to have assiduously and conveniently avoided the uglier side of Trump's appeal to xenophobes and bigots only to have it once again thrown back in your face by the candidate.

He doesn't give a rat's ass about immigration; he's employed illegals both directly and through contractors for decades. He gives a rat's ass about immigrants who are the wrong color or wrong color and ideology. Now, lest we have to defend that idea from people who'll say, "some of his best friends are xxxx", if he's not a racist he's pandering to them and that's a distinction without a difference as far as I'm concerned.

By my patented Foolmewunz estimation, there's probably a hard core Trump vote out there of bigots and miscreants at about thirty per cent of the country. He's got an additional ten per cent of the country supporting their party and their conservative "ideals". Those are the people being addressed. The slough of Republicans who are running away from what he stands for are an indication that they're not all slithering slimeballs. All conservatives aren't bigots, either.

And this is their chance to prove it.

 

[The Don]

You wouldn't, assuming as I do that you have a conscience and some moral fiber, find it embarrassing to have assiduously and conveniently avoided the uglier side of Trump's appeal to xenophobes and bigots only to have it once again thrown back in your face by the candidate.

Maybe this is the thing I don't understand.

How is the candidate's wife perhaps having broken the terms of her tourist visa 20 years ago and without the candidate's prior knowledge in any way having xenophobia and bigotry thrown in the face of non-frothing-at-the-mouth republicans ?

He doesn't give a rat's ass about immigration; he's employed illegals both directly and through contractors for decades.

Then focus on that, not some possible issue dredged up from his wife's past.

He gives a rat's ass about immigrants who are the wrong color or wrong color and ideology. Now, lest we have to defend that idea from people who'll say, "some of his best friends are xxxx", if he's not a racist he's pandering to them and that's a distinction without a difference as far as I'm concerned.

Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?

By my patented Foolmewunz estimation, there's probably a hard core Trump vote out there of bigots and miscreants at about thirty per cent of the country. He's got an additional ten per cent of the country supporting their party and their conservative "ideals". Those are the people being addressed. The slough of Republicans who are running away from what he stands for are an indication that they're not all slithering slimeballs. All conservatives aren't bigots, either.

And this is their chance to prove it.

Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Maybe this is the thing I don't understand.

How is the candidate's wife perhaps having broken the terms of her tourist visa 20 years ago and without the candidate's prior knowledge in any way having xenophobia and bigotry thrown in the face of non-frothing-at-the-mouth republicans ?



Then focus on that, not some possible issue dredged up from his wife's past.




Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?



Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?

Schadenfreude (qv).

Works for me.

 

[quadraginta]

Then I'm not sure how this is embarrassing to anyone. Trump married someone who once worked illegally but he didn't know it at the time of his marriage and AFAIK there's no suggestion that her current immigration status is irregular or that she should now be deported.

Again IMO it's like an candidate who is running on an anti-drug platform whose spouse is shown to have taken drugs once in college, years before they met the candidate.

It would be if one of their core promises was to throw out all of those years ago drug users.

 

[quadraginta]

Is there a suggestion that she is an illegal immigrant.

<snip>

Not relevant, as I was responding to a hypothetical situation where she was an illegal.

A response based on your comment which was positing that hypothetical.

 

[quadraginta]

Maybe this is the thing I don't understand.

How is the candidate's wife perhaps having broken the terms of her tourist visa 20 years ago and without the candidate's prior knowledge in any way having xenophobia and bigotry thrown in the face of non-frothing-at-the-mouth republicans ?



Then focus on that, not some possible issue dredged up from his wife's past.




Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?



Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?

"None so blind ..."

 

[Crossbow]

Given how skeezy the modeling industry is, it wouldn't surprise me if she wasn't paid or if she didn't know she was breaking the law.

Quite true. The modeling industry is quite skeezy and I am sure that they break all sorts of laws when it is convienent for them to do so.

However, Melania has been constantly bragging about how she has always been in the USA legally, therefore she has explaining to do.

 

[The Don]

It would be if one of their core promises was to throw out all of those years ago drug users.

If Melania Trump was shown to currently be an illegal immigrant, they'd have a case but the case as far as I understand it is:

• Photographs appear to have been taken in 1995 when she was in the U.S. on a tourist visa
• There is doubt whether she was paid for those pictures (the photographer says not)
• Regardless, she later came back to the U.S. and obtained residency

She's legally a resident in the United States.


edited to add....

However, Melania has been constantly bragging about how she has always been in the USA legally, therefore she has explaining to do.

That's the dimension that was missing - I didn't know that this was a constant refrain of hers.

 

[Puppycow]

In addition to the nudes that appeared in the New York Post the other day, there's now pics out there of Melania in bed with another woman, both naked.

Myself, the nude photos, her immigration status at the time, I don't care about any of it. Was never going to vote for Trump anyway, and I wouldn't make this a reason to vote against him in any case. I have plenty of other reasons though. We live in an era where the last 3 presidents have essentially admitted to using illegal drugs in their youth. I actually think it would be cool if the first lady had nude photos. It would be a first. It would reduce the stigma maybe. We currently live in a culture that is so uptight about certain things like porn that someone who once appeared in porn cannot work as a teacher, for example. It's even worse than that actually: a teacher can be fired over a single "sexy photo".

I don't believe that nude photos of anyone should be a barrier for them to go on to do other things. So I'm not going to be a hypocrite and hold it against Melania Trump. Her husband is the one who really concerns me. She's mostly harmless and a distraction.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Maybe this is the thing I don't understand.

How is the candidate's wife perhaps having broken the terms of her tourist visa 20 years ago and without the candidate's prior knowledge in any way having xenophobia and bigotry thrown in the face of non-frothing-at-the-mouth republicans ?



Then focus on that, not some possible issue dredged up from his wife's past.




Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?



Fine, but again, why drag his wife's possible illegal working into it ?

Apparently you were unaware that she's selling her story as "the paragon of virtue". She's been giving a stump speech for a number of months and has said it in interviews, too. She/they knew there were sarcastic comments out there about her being a conveniently white and beautiful immigrant, so she's told it with campaign spin, emphasizing that she came to the country legally. She never actually said, "... unlike those bad immigrants..." but it was certainly implied.

And it's not solely a question of whether this was before they met. If she worked illegally, it's something that is subject to legal action. Mr. Law and Order.... "Lock her up".... "send 'em back".... His simplistic slogan-solutions aren't going to apply in all cases - it's nice to see him possibly face these things first-hand.

I believe we're discussing speculation, anyway. There's not enough information available to call it "evidence".

 

[ponderingturtle]

Apparently you were unaware that she's selling her story as "the paragon of virtue". She's been giving a stump speech for a number of months and has said it in interviews, too. She/they knew there were sarcastic comments out there about her being a conveniently white and beautiful immigrant, so she's told it with campaign spin, emphasizing that she came to the country legally. She never actually said, "... unlike those bad immigrants..." but it was certainly implied.

And it's not solely a question of whether this was before they met. If she worked illegally, it's something that is subject to legal action. Mr. Law and Order.... "Lock her up".... "send 'em back".... His simplistic slogan-solutions aren't going to apply in all cases - it's nice to see him possibly face these things first-hand.

I believe we're discussing speculation, anyway. There's not enough information available to call it "evidence".

But she is a Trump no one actually believes anything she says would hold up to fact checking do they? I mean look at the claims of her education that failed to hold up.