Corbyn's days (very) numbered?

[Garrison]

In this case the party members are the relevant electorate though. The problem seems to be that the party members and the elected MPs are at odds since nobody actually knows what the wider electorate feels on the issue. Corbyn hasn't yet faced the electorate.

The received wisdom that the country doesn't want Corbyn seems to be based on pretty much nothing more than internal dissent from his MPs. Its entirely possible that these MPs are incorrect.

Not really, his lame performance during the Brexit campaign give plenty of reason to doubt him. There is also the facts of his stance on the IRA and the Falklands that are bound to incense a huge number of voters once the media starts shouting about them during an election campaign.

Also the man is supposed to lead the Labour party in parliament on a day to day basis, that he has lost the confidence of three-quarters of his MPs, and they have actually gone public with their discontent speaks volumes about his leadership skills.

 

[dudalb]

Not really, his lame performance during the Brexit campaign give plenty of reason to doubt him. There is also the facts of his stance on the IRA and the Falklands that are bound to incense a huge number of voters once the media starts shouting about them during an election campaign.

Also the man is supposed to lead the Labour party in parliament on a day to day basis, that he has lost the confidence of three-quarters of his MPs, and they have actually gone public with their discontent speaks volumes about his leadership skills.

Who needs leadership skills if you have the correct ideology?

 

[dudalb]

Seems to be that simple "You have to be a registered member of the Labor Party for a year before you can vote for party officials" would be an easy way to prevent mischief making and put a real damper on the rise of "Personality Cults".

 

[Francesca R]

Who needs leadership skills if you have the correct ideology?

Also the more tory pimps masquerading as labour mps tell you the ideology reeks, the more correct you know it must be.

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

Not really, his lame performance during the Brexit campaign give plenty of reason to doubt him. There is also the facts of his stance on the IRA and the Falklands that are bound to incense a huge number of voters once the media starts shouting about them during an election campaign.

Also the man is supposed to lead the Labour party in parliament on a day to day basis, that he has lost the confidence of three-quarters of his MPs, and they have actually gone public with their discontent speaks volumes about his leadership skills.

None of that really argues against what I said though. It's a restatement of the received wisdom. What it doesn't do is shed any light on the view of the electorate in general or labour voters in general.

 

[MikeG]

Polly Toynbee (Labour Party supporter) in The Graduin the day before yesterday:

Angela Eagle is mounting her challenge to Corbyn’s leadership with the party on a bizarre seesaw: as its membership rises, so its support in the country falls. Labour is seven points lower in its ratings that it has ever been nine months after a new leader has been put in place. ICM puts Labour eight percentage points behind the Tories – before May’s likely bounce. Despite Corbyn’s denials, Labour’s council election results were the worst since 1982, the first time an opposition has had net losses in a non-general election year. No opposition has ever won power without reaching a 20% lead. Corbyn scores “the worst ratings of any opposition leader ever” among swing voters, says Britain Thinks. Nearly a third of Labour supporters who voted Brexit say they will not return.


View in Wallasey: Angela Eagle 'may be right person, but wrong time'. This is a party in freefall, but those facts make no impression on Labour’s new members. Professor Tim Bale has surveyed them and finds 77% who joined after Corbyn became leader believe he will win the next general election. Denial, delusion, magical thinking, call it what you will, they believe it. Worse, I’ve heard many say winning is shoddy Westminster elite stuff: conviction matters more, say some Trots but mainly ardent believers.

 

[Craig B]

Polly Toynbee^WP (Labour Party supporter) ...

She is a social democrat and was a candidate for the Social Democratic Party in the 1983 general election.​

 

[Childlike Empress]

She is a social democrat and was a candidate for the Social Democratic Party in the 1983 general election.​

She's also full of it.

 

[MikeG]

She's also full of it.

Did you bother to read my post? You've just linked to a critique of the exact same article that I did, and that I was quoting from.

Oh, and I see from the quote in your post that some think she isn't a Labour supporter. She spoke at the Labour conference in 2005. She urged a Labour vote through her column during the last election campaign. Wiki says

She now broadly supports the Labour Party.

.

But how about a comment on her assessment of Labour under Corbyn?

 

[Craig B]

But how about a comment on her assessment of Labour under Corbyn?

You got a comment on

... (Labour Party supporter) ...

 

[Archie Gemmill Goal]

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed to comply with Rule 11

 

[Childlike Empress]

Did you bother to read my post? You've just linked to a critique of the exact same article that I did, and that I was quoting from.

Indeed, Sherlock. I linked to a critique of the article you quoted. Well spotted.

 

[ceptimus]

Labour is seven points lower in its ratings since the disloyal MP splitters began their unconstitutional coup

FTFY

 

[jimbob]

From the Badscience forum on this topic:

Subject: And the next Labour leader is...

I've been critical of him in the past, but Jeremy Corbyn has been electric this evening. He's led the charge against the May cabinet, ripped Hammond to shreds, got a few laughs at Osborne and has been relentless in his battering of the ludicrous Johnson appointment.

Either that, or he hasn't said anything at all.

It's a kinder gentler politics, at least as far as the other party is concerned

I hadn't quite apprehended that the actual reason he wanted a 'kinder, gentler politics' was because he isn't clever enough to cope with the back and forth.

 

[dudalb]

Hey,battering the Johnson appointment as Foreign Secratray is what is known as "Shooting Fish in a Barrel", The level of wit required is not high...

 

[jimbob]

Hey,battering the Johnson appointment as Foreign Secratray is what is known as "Shooting Fish in a Barrel", The level of wit required is not high...

However, it seems beyond Corbyn's ability , hence Norbury's comment about it being a kinder gentler politics, at least as far as the other party is concerned

 

[jimbob]

A blog post noting the similarities between some of the true believers and religious true believers

https://afterlabour.org/2016/07/12/corbyn-and-the-new-political-puritans/

I am, in my day job, a sociologist of religion. I have never experienced an atmosphere like that Party meeting anywhere before outside of conservative religious groups who are deeply convinced of the truth of their way of seeing the world. The fact of the growing Party membership was, as in any committed Evangelical group, taken as confirmation of the moral rectitude of the movement, with no interest shown in whether connections with the wider electorate were being made.
Whilst there are individual supporters of Corbyn who remain courteous and thoughtful, the movement forming around him is, at its heart, a form of political puritanism, for which Corbyn is a model puritan leader. It is a movement of moral certainty, largely devoid of policy, fuelled by symbolic struggles against evil, treachery and compromise.

 

[Garrison]

None of that really argues against what I said though. It's a restatement of the received wisdom. What it doesn't do is shed any light on the view of the electorate in general or labour voters in general.

So the man proves he inept in a national campaign but that doesn't prove he's inept at campaigning? And the man advocated joint sovereignty over the Falklands, that is pure political poison with the mainstream electorate. There's a case to be made for moving politics in the UK back towards a more socialist agenda, Corbyn isn't the man to make it.

 

[lionking]

So the man proves he inept in a national campaign but that doesn't prove he's inept at campaigning? And the man advocated joint sovereignty over the Falklands, that is pure political poison with the mainstream electorate. There's a case to be made for moving politics in the UK back towards a more socialist agenda, Corbyn isn't the man to make it.

Not a strong one though.

Corbyn cannot win power and his ideological purity and stubbornness will destroy the party.

 

[MikeG]

........There's a case to be made for moving politics in the UK back towards a more socialist agenda.........

I hope you meant this in the sense of "there being a case for offering a socialist alternative to the Conservatives", because there is no case whatever for moving the entirety of the political system, including the Conservatives, onto a socialist platform. The main case for providing a socialist alternative is so that it can be thoroughly beaten at the ballot box, and the whole silly idea can depart for another 30 years until the next slow-learner in the Foot, Tony Benn, Corbyn sequence attempts to revive it having forgotten all the lessons of history.