Continuation Part 18: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

[acbytesla]

You said it was A LIE Amanda repeatedly contacted Mez at Halloween.

You said it was A LIE Mez was enrolled on ERASMUS.

You said it was A LIE Amanda told Mignini Raff was a cocaine/acid user.

You are either ignorant about the case, or more likely, you are trying to gild the lily because you know your idol probably is guilty.

You are possibly a paid shill working for Gogerty Marriott to airbrush your idol's image.

Please provide a single post of mine where I said any of this. Because I'm sure I never posted any of these things. Not one. The closest is the part about Meredith Kercher and whether she was an Erasmus fellow.

I said and I quote "It is also my understanding that Meredith in fact was NOT an Erasmus fellow..but that is irrelevant ."

However It is a lie that you are repeating now for what. How many times? Help me. That Amanda repeatedly contacted Meredith on Halloween evening. You said before that I think it was LJ was lying through omission that he didn't mention the barrage of desperate texts that
Amanda sent. Turned out that was false. There were 2.

Now you are suggesting that I'm a paid shill.

There is no bounds for your deceit.

 

[acbytesla]

Nobody was talking about the moral issues. I made an objective statement of fact about Raff, and LondonJohn and acbytesla went off the deep end, calling me A LIAR.

It's not the deep end. You have posted lie after lie after lie. Guess what that makes you?

 

[Matthew Best]

Together?

No, that would be silly.

 

[Matthew Best]

Did you kill anyone under the influence ?

Well, not that I remember.

 

[Ken Dine]

Hello? Raff and Amanda were arrested 6/7th November. The braclasp and other items, including Rudy DNA were collected circa early Dec.

I never claimed that the defense couldn't have had experts there to observe Stefanoni's later testing, only that it would have been impossible to have defense experts present during the early DNA testing.

I also said that paying to have expensive DNA experts present to observe Stefanoni could be prohibitively expensive for many defendants, and largely unnecessary if the prosecution had turned over the EDFs, as is standard procedure in most civilized countries.

You just make things up, everything with you is conjecture, and usually badly wrong. It's embarrassing.

Ya, it's surely me who has the reputation around here for making stuff up.

 

[acbytesla]

Well, not that I remember.

Now Vixen's gonna say you killed Meredith.

 

[Strozzi]

Mignini stuck rigidly within the confines of his remit.

He had two witnesses who were knobbled by the corrupt, lying defense, Aviello, who claimed Bongiornio offered to pay him off €100K for his sex change, which s/he has now had and is "Lucy" and key witness Kokomani who witnessed the three drugged out of their brains lying in wait behind the bins in front of the cottage with a large kitchen knife, and he, too, claimed to have been paid off €100K by the defense.

Outcome: Aviello refused to testify in his claim he was asked to give false testimony, and likewise Kokomani, who mumbled a load of bollocks.

It is not known if Kokomani was rewarded, but we do know Avvocato Bongiorno hasn't got round to suing the pair for libel.

PM Mignini and his team were and are decent upright citizens desperately fighting to bring justice to the murder victim in a sleazy world of crime, corruption, drug-dealing and organised dark forces.

Vixen, do you really believe these claims or are you taking opposite positions to further energetic debate?

 

[Planigale]

Two material errors, the 1/100,000th of a grain of salt, is Grinder's anecdotal estimate of the Mez DNA, which was LCN.

Raff's was a resounding, unequivocal >1,300RFU's, not LCN.

The other material error is, the other DNA material found, were not DNA profiles, they were random fragments.

If Raff's DNA is contaminated, then why are you not protesting that therefore ipso facto so is Rudy's, as his was collected the same time, in the same manner.

In addition, although not collected for forty-two days, the whole building had been sealed off, and only forensic police in full protective clothing entered the murder room.

To put some facts

1) Sollecito DNA on bra clasp.

Steffanoni failed to properly quantify the DNA so we do not know.
The best estimate is relying on Steffanoni's estimates of 1 ng total DNA. About 1/6 being non Kercher DNA. So the Sollecito DNA is less than 200 pg this falls into the definition of LCN DNA.

2) There is no locus attributable to Sollecito with >1300 RFU. This is a lie. (Not surprising given the source.)

The only locus giving a reading of >1300 RFU is CSF1PO with 12 repeats. Kercher is homozygous for this. Sollecito is heterozygous with one allele being 10, the other being 12. Looking at CSF1PO for 10 repeats we se the RFU is about 50RFU. The contribution from each allele is equal. Therefore we can say that the contribution from Sollecito is about 50 of the 1300 RFU. The rest from Kercher. This really suggests that Sollecito's contribution to the DNA is about 10% putting a value of about 100 pg as his contribution. Even this ignores the other contributors, and assumes Steffanoni's estimate is correct, the latter is somewhat doubtful as she tends to overestimate DNA quantities. So the true quantity of Sollecito DNA is likely to be less than 100 pg.

Refs (because that is how you support statements by pointing to the original data) well presented here.
https://forensicdnaconsulting.wordp...perts’-report-in-the-amanda-knox-case-part-2/

 

[Vixen]

Perhaps you are not aware of the public intoxication citation or the evening/night that one of the british birds couldn't walk and IIRC it was Shaky that gave them a ride. Whereas the british birds said Meredith didn't drink at their pizza dinner Lalli and another lab verified that at TOD she had at least a drink in her system. I think she did drink during the day but some have maintained she had the alcohol left in her system from returning from the Halloween party at 5 am.

I never compared her or the birds to winos in the gutter or even to a heroin addict in the plaza.

You should go back to those early stories you love so much in which a passel of bar tenders spoke of her and her bird friends. One even remarked he had warned her not to stay in the cottage alone.

Yes, it's easy when in a nightclub/bar environment to not realise how drunk you actually are, until you hit the pavement. Alcohol metabolises at apx half a pint per hour (?), so to still be drunk after 16 hours (to 21:00), she must have consumed more than the equivalent of 16 units = 8 pints (lager), or sixteen glasses wine, or 16 shots of spirits. It seems unlikely to me. However, yes, Lalli said she was over the legal limit (>one unit); I think he said two units.

It's possible she had a bevy with her unwelcome guests, to be polite.

 

[Vixen]

Please provide a single post of mine where I said any of this. Because I'm sure I never posted any of these things. Not one. The closest is the part about Meredith Kercher and whether she was an Erasmus fellow.

I said and I quote "It is also my understanding that Meredith in fact was NOT an Erasmus fellow..but that is irrelevant ."

However It is a lie that you are repeating now for what. How many times? Help me. That Amanda repeatedly contacted Meredith on Halloween evening. You said before that I think it was LJ was lying through omission that he didn't mention the barrage of desperate texts that Amanda sent. Turned out that was false. There were 2. Now you are suggesting that I'm a paid shill.

There is no bounds for your deceit.

You have been told, and given a reliable source, Amanda contacted Mez throughout the day, with Mez only bothering to answer once. Did you wilfully disregard this fact?

 

[Vixen]

Now Vixen's gonna say you killed Meredith.

It's one thing for curious teenagers to do drugs, but pretty sad to still be doing them in middle age, ne c'est-pas?

Given Amanda, Rudy and Raff's drug-fuelled "fun" likely led to Mez' murder, I fail to see why you and Mr Best find the idea hilarious.

 

[Vixen]

Vixen, do you really believe these claims or are you taking opposite positions to further energetic debate?

You saw for yourself how Aviello and Kokomani evaded giving serious testimony. Raff actually makes the Aviello claim in his own book.

 

[Grinder]

To put some facts

1) Sollecito DNA on bra clasp.

Steffanoni failed to properly quantify the DNA so we do not know.
The best estimate is relying on Steffanoni's estimates of 1 ng total DNA. About 1/6 being non Kercher DNA. So the Sollecito DNA is less than 200 pg this falls into the definition of LCN DNA.

2) There is no locus attributable to Sollecito with >1300 RFU. This is a lie. (Not surprising given the source.)

The only locus giving a reading of >1300 RFU is CSF1PO with 12 repeats. Kercher is homozygous for this. Sollecito is heterozygous with one allele being 10, the other being 12. Looking at CSF1PO for 10 repeats we se the RFU is about 50RFU. The contribution from each allele is equal. Therefore we can say that the contribution from Sollecito is about 50 of the 1300 RFU. The rest from Kercher. This really suggests that Sollecito's contribution to the DNA is about 10% putting a value of about 100 pg as his contribution. Even this ignores the other contributors, and assumes Steffanoni's estimate is correct, the latter is somewhat doubtful as she tends to overestimate DNA quantities. So the true quantity of Sollecito DNA is likely to be less than 100 pg.

Refs (because that is how you support statements by pointing to the original data) well presented here.
https://forensicdnaconsulting.wordp...perts’-report-in-the-amanda-knox-case-part-2/

Thanks for the facts, always useful. If you would take a minute to look at this - A single grain of salt weighs 100 MILLION picograms. (the best factual weight I can find, Allen Blackman. Chemistry Magazine 10/08/01)) then the material attributed to Raf would be 1/500,000 of a grain of salt.

Would you agree with the above as a way to demonstrate what tiny amounts the PGP have characterized as "abundant" or "large" amounts?

For me this makes perfectly clear that in those amounts DNA can "fly"and it makes clear how easy secondary and tertiary transfer is.

 

[jsfisher]

Some posts have been wandering dangerously away from the topical towards the deeply personal. Nine or so recent posts have been edited to remove content focused on each other rather than Amanda Knox, et al. A few are accented with yellow to highlight the extent of the transgression with respect to the Membership Agreement.

Please stay with the topic. Your continued cooperation is greatly appreciated.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: jsfisher

 

[Grinder]

Yes, it's easy when in a nightclub/bar environment to not realise how drunk you actually are, until you hit the pavement. Alcohol metabolises at apx half a pint per hour (?), so to still be drunk after 16 hours (to 21:00), she must have consumed more than the equivalent of 16 units = 8 pints (lager), or sixteen glasses wine, or 16 shots of spirits. It seems unlikely to me. However, yes, Lalli said she was over the legal limit (>one unit); I think he said two units.

It's possible she had a bevy with her unwelcome guests, to be polite.

Lalli didn't say she was over the legal limit just that she had IIRC .43 g/l
He stated that the results of the toxicological analyses revealed the absence of psychotropic drugs and a blood alcohol level of 0.43 grams/litre. which is about half the legal limit in England.

I don't believe she had enough alcohol in her system at 5 am to still have .43 at 9:30 pm. This means she drank during the day or evening and the birds didn't know or they lied to make Meredith look better.

Btw, do you feel the same way about booze as you do other drugs?

 

[LondonJohn]

You have been told, and given a reliable source, Amanda contacted Mez throughout the day, with Mez only bothering to answer once. Did you wilfully disregard this fact?

No. No he hasn't. Neither have I.

Knox communicated with Kercher precisely twice on 31st October 2007, both times by text message at just before and just after 7pm. To coin a phrase: you have been told.

 

[LondonJohn]

It's one thing for curious teenagers to do drugs, but pretty sad to still be doing them in middle age, ne c'est-pas?

Given Amanda, Rudy and Raff's drug-fuelled "fun" likely led to Mez' Kercher's murder, I fail to see why you and Mr Best find the idea hilarious.

So it's "one thing" for Sollecito (and Knox) to have experimented with drugs at that time in their lives, is it? I thought the party line for the Knox-haters was to demonise them for their indulgences?

And I don't know if you were aware, but Knox and Sollecito were recently definitively acquitted of Kercher's murder, by means of being found innocent. It appears that you might not actually know that. You're welcome

(And it's "n'est-ce pas". If you're going to employ French phrases - and heaven knows why - at least get them right. eh?)

 

[Bill Williams]

ne c'est-pas

(And it's "n'est-ce pas". If you're going to employ French phrases - and heaven knows why - at least get them right. eh?)

V****'s usage means, "It's not that?" IIRC yours means, "Is it not?"

ETA - the covenant with js202 allows for comment on French-language phrases... Section III, sub-section 3:a; right after that part where I'm allowed to comment if there's fear I'll do damage to myself with too vigourous a face-palm.

 

[Planigale]

Thanks for the facts, always useful. If you would take a minute to look at this - A single grain of salt weighs 100 MILLION picograms. (the best factual weight I can find, Allen Blackman. Chemistry Magazine 10/08/01)) then the material attributed to Raf would be 1/500,000 of a grain of salt.

Would you agree with the above as a way to demonstrate what tiny amounts the PGP have characterized as "abundant" or "large" amounts?

For me this makes perfectly clear that in those amounts DNA can "fly"and it makes clear how easy secondary and tertiary transfer is.

Density of common salt is about 2g/cc.

So a grain that was at the limit of (unaided) vision 1/10 mm / side would weigh about 2 microgram, Ten thousand times more than we are talking about. So we need to go down to a grain about 4 microns (4/1,000 mm) on the side. A red blood cell is about 8 micron in diameter. This about ten times the limit of vision with an optical microscope.

 

[Grinder]

Density of common salt is about 2g/cc.

So a grain that was at the limit of (unaided) vision 1/10 mm / side would weigh about 2 microgram, Ten thousand times than we are talking about. So we need to go down to a grain about 4 microns (4/1,000 mm) on the side. A red blood cell is about 8 micron in diameter. This about ten times the limit of vision with an optical microscope.

thanks for the effort. now people can imagine a piece of evidence 1/500,000 the size of a grain of salt or 1/100,000 considering the whole sample with Meredith's included or they can go with it being 1/10 the size needed to be seen by an optical microscope.