• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

My Ghost Story

See, this conversation has embodied why I don't waste my time actively pursing this subject any more.

Going back to the original post, he gave a solid description, and stated it unnerved him. He thought it was weird, but didn't go as far to say it was paranormal in nature. A few of us suggested likely explanations.

That's how it's supposed to work.

The idea that we have to entertain extraordinary explanations is ridiculous. This is especially true with this particular stated event. While Packer states that this freaked him out, his post is almost devoid of woo. There is none of the usual ramblings about how this changed his life, or had bad dreams, or what not. There is no back story about the janitor/teacher/despondent student who committed suicide up on that floor, and the initial post is straight forward.

There is nothing fantastic in his statement, just a rare phenomenon involving old wooden floors.
 
Let me dig out my "Ghost Hunter" hat and do this right:



OK, to begin with, I am an extremely skeptical person. I do not believe in ghosts, EVPs, or any of that nonsense.

Nevertheless, I had an experience not to long ago, that I am struggling to come up with a rational explanation for.

Okay, I'll take you at your word, but trying to establish credibility is often a red flag.

I am a consultant by trade, I specialize in building inspections for environmental, Health and Safety issues. Last year, I had a project that involved an inspection and inventory of all the different ceilings in a large, high school building where portions of the buildings were built in various phases from the late 1800's on.

Okay, goes to credibility, but no geographic location is provided, and how long you have done this work (that's important).

Even though it was summer, we had to do the work from 3:00 to 11:00 in the evening. With the exception of a few people in the admin wing, the building essentially emptied out at 5:00.

The first two nights, I had an assistant with me and we got about 90% of the work done. The third night I was by myself and trying to finish up some minor areas that we had trouble accessing the first two nights. My client contact had mentioned that the building could sometimes get creepy late at night, but I didn't really pay any attention to that. I'm used to how old masonry and wood framed buildings shift and creak as they cool down in the evening.

Okay, good description of the hows, whens, and whys, but not where this place is located. Still workable though...

Back in the early 20th century it was common to build schools with an auditorium on the 1st and 2nd floor, and the gym on the third floor above the auditorium. This was a 4 story building so they even had a nice balcony on the gym accessible from the 4th floor. It was getting late, and I was on the fourth floor by the gym balcony when I noticed a set of stairs leading up.

Curious, I went up them to see if there was an accessible attic. there was. there was a large space that had at one time served as the school locker room. there was a long gallery with a tongue and groove wood floor and hard plaster walls about 18 feet wide running about 60 feet long with a shower room at the other end. The lights worked, so I went down across the room and inspected the showers, no issues for me to deal with. there was another set of stairs leading down from that end, and something about that area was making me a bit edgy.

Okay, another red flag. It's a reasonable human response, being in an area that makes you uncomfortable for reasons not immediately clear. Taking you at your word, this is where you're mind set you up.


Maybe it was just the thought that "If there is a rotted floorboard up here, and I get hurt, it's going to be a while before they find me."

If this is what was making you uncomfortable then this is all you needed to say, and the fact you added the other suggests susceptibility at this point in your narrative. Not saying this is bad, just explaining why I see it as a problem.

I was planning to just head down the other set of stairs, but there was a problem, the light switches were at the end I came from

So, I reluctantly turned around and began walking back across the old locker room to the other stairwell so I could turn off the lights behind me.

Okay, this is the part where you went into "Ghost Story"-mode.

See, you just explained you were afraid the floor could give out on you, and yet there you go returning to the other side, putting yourself in danger. Why not go down the other end and return up the other side to kill the lights. Safety first, right?

Man that was one creaky floor. Funny, it didn't seem that noisy when I walked across it the first time. I get to the other end and at the top of the stairs and I stop to turn off the lights.

Full Ghost-Story Mode now.

I stopped. However, the floorboards did not stop creaking. For about 6-7 seconds, the creaking sound came towards me as if someone was walking across the floor, following me.

I didn't run, but I got the hell out of there as fast as I could, thoroughly creeped out. Now logically I could attribute this simply to the old floors and joists settling back into place after I walked over them.

This is where you start to back out of Ghost-Story Mode while keeping the option open. You admit to being creeped out, while stating the obvious - the floor boards were just setting back into place.

But I have never heard that happen that loudly or for that long after you stopped moving.

First time for everything.

Structurally, the joists should have been running across the locker room from side to side, not lengthwise, so I doubt that me standing at one spot would have affected the floor 15 feet further down the room.

Begs the question: How familiar were you with the physical construction of this floor? You state this was the first time you had ventured up there, you suggest the floor could have been dangerous from age. How much advance research had you done before that night and how much after?

The floor plans have to be somewhere, and they would clear this up quickly.

I found out later that the Engineer was very familiar with the "Ghost." According to him, he has heard footsteps in the building when he knows he is alone.

Not helping the case.

This was the only weird event you experienced in this building, at least the only one you've told us about. Has this engineer heard footsteps on the same location, or just in the building?

As for me, it was just plain creepy, and I keep telling myself that it was just a structural issue. . . .

And you should. You already know - deep down - it was just old wood acting like old wood. You should be asking why, as a skeptical person, you want to believe it was something supernatural.

Buildings can be new, old, big, small, but they can't be creepy. Creepy is a subjective word. When I was young I worked as a janitor on an old movie theater built in 1928. It was one of those show place theaters that has a functioning stage, dressing rooms, and held 1,500 people. I loved the place, and while some nights I got creeped out I understood that was all me, and not the building.

What you've described is an event where you were working late in an old building, and went up to an area you were unfamiliar with. You experienced a rare, but not unheard of phenomenon and was freaked out by it.

It is an honest, human reaction that anybody could have in those identical conditions.

I'm not reading anything paranormal at all.
 
Back to the original post. Why does Alferd_Packer (Hi, there!) not give us more detail. We find it interesting, although I am the only one who seems to think that there is a slim possibility of a ghost.

"I stopped. However, the floorboards did not stop creaking. For about 6-7 seconds, the creaking sound came towards me as if someone was walking across the floor, following me."

I asked if there were footsteps as well. Was the creaking continuous, or a series of creaks spaced like a man walking. If intermittent creaks, was the pace the same as yours? Lighter or heavier creaks than yours? Where did the creaks stop? A meter in front of you, or 5 meters, or more?

Six to seven seconds is about 10 paces. Yes?

If ghosts do not exist, then the creaking appears to be the floorboards returning to their unstressed position. Even if ghosts do exist, this could be the explanation.
 
You don't think that dead humans hanging around for eternity to make floorboards creak is reasonable?
:D


This is what I mean about knowing the rationale behind the supernatural. It may be that ghosts do not last very long. From a few weeks to a few years. May some might make a decade or a century. The spirit energy decays and dissipates. Hence the ghostly misty shapes one hears about.

It is the soul that may continue on. Possible re-birth after a while or possible extinction. Ghosts can interact slightly with matter. Souls cannot and use the spirits.
 
This is what I mean about knowing the rationale behind the supernatural. It may be that ghosts do not last very long. From a few weeks to a few years. May some might make a decade or a century. The spirit energy decays and dissipates. Hence the ghostly misty shapes one hears about.

It is the soul that may continue on. Possible re-birth after a while or possible extinction. Ghosts can interact slightly with matter. Souls cannot and use the spirits.

Looks more like making it up as you go along.


It's actually the spirit of the wood protesting being cut down.
 
This is what I mean about knowing the rationale behind the supernatural. It may be that ghosts do not last very long. From a few weeks to a few years. May some might make a decade or a century. The spirit energy decays and dissipates. Hence the ghostly misty shapes one hears about.

It is the soul that may continue on. Possible re-birth after a while or possible extinction. Ghosts can interact slightly with matter. Souls cannot and use the spirits.

The rationale behind the supernatural is easy: it's whatever you like — ex great white cathedra.

It may be that ghosts do not last long, it may also be that I am behind all ghosts. When I sleep, I project myself forward and backward in time to haunt floorboard and doors.

The misty shapes one hears about are my snoozing aura. It's a miasma of z's.

And so on. Words without end. May, maybe, might.
 
The rationale behind the supernatural is easy: it's whatever you like — ex great white cathedra.

It may be that ghosts do not last long, it may also be that I am behind all ghosts. When I sleep, I project myself forward and backward in time to haunt floorboard and doors.

The misty shapes one hears about are my snoozing aura. It's a miasma of z's.

And so on. Words without end. May, maybe, might.


The supernatural is only limited by the imagination while reality is boringly limited to facts.
 
I am curious if you have an example of what you have come across that does have a paranormal reading.

Easy, there is nothing paranormal.

Everything can be explained, it's just that somethings cannot be explained right now.

I have seen things I can't explain, but I'm more interested in WHY I saw them than WHAT I saw. The fact I can't explain them is more about my intellectual and observational skill than other possibilities.

The second he felt that the top floor was "creepy" it weighted his perception skewing it. He then states the root of his fear was falling through the floor due to rot. This is a real fear based on real accidents where people are injured or even killed. The real fear combined with the invented fear, and once the floor started popping off on him he was thinking ghosts.

It happens.
 
Shouldn't they be rattling the cutlery? :D


I have heard one person say that the cupboard door in the bathroom banged open and closed in the haunted house they lived in.

The reason I say that a ghost might be capable of interacting slightly with physical matter is that for 6 weeks on an organic farm I had problem after problem, Every day something went wrong. The electronics on the solar system and the watering system failed, one piece each time on different days.

Birds, bees, hornets, bats, scorpions, spiders, ants and so on hassled me. It was when the Cape cobra slid past me towards the bedroom that I felt I had to take action.

Turned out a guy had committed suicide outside the house recently. A jilted lover. Once I went to his friend who found him dead, and the ex-girl-friend (she was being haunted) to sort things out most of this stopped.

A strange run of bad luck. It is what I thought it was at first. And that may indeed be the explanation. And just coincidence that it stopped when it did.

But given my other experiences, I am not so sure it was not a ghost.
 
The second he felt that the top floor was "creepy" it weighted his perception skewing it. He then states the root of his fear was falling through the floor due to rot. This is a real fear based on real accidents where people are injured or even killed. The real fear combined with the invented fear, and once the floor started popping off on him he was thinking ghosts.

It happens.


I don't disagree. Perfectly reasonable. When I was a child with an over-active imagination, I also had a fear of the dark and what might be lurking there. But I never saw or heard something that was not there.

And when one is camping in the bush in Africa, the sounds outside are not to be ignored. The animal making them is likely to be real.

When an event takes place without the "creepiness", and in "normal" circumstances it is harder to explain.

When I was a teenager reading in bed after everyone else had gone to bed, I heard footsteps from the front door walking down the passage on the wooden floors. No creaking, and positively the footsteps of a man. Can only be a ghost I thought. Then I got scared and hoped it would walk past my bedroom.

When it got to the cement and carpeted dining room floor I could not hear the footsteps. When the footsteps came into my room with its bare wooden floor, there was no mistake.

The sounds stopped when a siren sounded. A man had been killed at the intersection.

Not so easy to explain, except to say it was long ago and my memory is faulty. Maybe, but one does not easily forget the basic facts.

Assume for arguments sake that ghosts exist. Were the sounds real enough that a recorder could have recorded them? Or were they in my head, and generated by the spirit thoughts of a ghost who perceived himself walking through the house?

Given the fact that video and sound recorders do not pick up sounds or visuals it seems such perceptions are generated inside the brain. Assuming now that ghosts do not exist the question is why.
 
Still determined to keep looking for that volcano god then PartSkeptic?

In what way(s) is "a ghost" a better explanation for your experiences than the obvious one of unremarkable coincidences and an overactive imagination?

If, for the sake of argument, we assume it was a ghost even though plausible mundane explanations are available, you then have the following things to explain:

How exactly does consciousness survive the termination of the brain that generates it?

How exactly does a disembodied consciousness interact with the physical world at all, let alone well enough to arrange for pests to annoy you and for you to hear (or think you hear) floorboards creak?

If a consciousness can do such things after death why not before?

Why on earth would a disembodied consciousness bother to do any of these things to a complete stranger?

Why, indeed, would it hang around at all when it could presumably be seeing (despite having no eyes) the world? And any other world in the universe it fancied visiting?
 

Back
Top Bottom