Continuation Part 16: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

[Numbers]

Actually, Mignini appealed and the appellate court agreed Mignini had been prosecuted in the wrong jurisdiction, and by the time the case was filed in the proper court, time had run out and the case was dismissed, but not on its merits.

Yes. According to Italian procedural law, CPP Art. 531 and Art. 620 para. 1a, this dismissal would appear to be effectively the same as an acquittal.

ETA: I should also have included CPP Art. 129 para. 1.

 

[Vixen]

Please quote the relevant part.

------
precisely on October 30, Meredith, this Amanda, had said that after the bridge of the saints, that is, by 5 November had to pay rent; Meredith replied that the money she had them already and that would have been able to give the two Italian roommates, agreeing then that 4 would put together the sum for the lease; While Amanda said that Lumumba was not paying, Meredith pointed out, always in the presence of Amanda, instead of having the availability of money at that time because he had won a scholarship and had two credit cards The impatience of Meredith to Amanda had become evident at that time, and Amanda could not fail to have noticed, and the rest who harbored no particular affection for Meredith, who was rather envious and tried aversion demonstrates the attitude held after the death of

There is a set of factors that "play" to the tragedy * the condition of all three defendants as consumers of drugs and, therefore, the alteration of the normal standards of behavior, resulting in the need for money (of which Meredith has) * To this is added, for the reconstruction of the personality of the three defendants (of Amanda and Raffaele will return later), the undeniable trend of these subjects (particularly the urge) to read stories particularly violent, especially the manga " Blood The Last Vampire ", comic found in the home of Sollecito, which contains scenes of extreme violence and sex, as well as the strong preference for all kinds of knives

* By Amanda must remember the story written a year before the murder and that was described the omnicide of a student (also subjected to sexual violence) with a kitchen knife in his back then place * Young dies drinking his blood * Del Guede is called a video in which it plays the part of the vampire and the 'habit of circular with a switchblade * This is a bit 'the most striking and impressive of this story: namely the fact that cruel and heinous crimes that were once reserved for very special types of criminals, today, for a form of leveling of crime to the whole community , for the atmosphere saturated with violence and brutality that reigns on television, in film and some publishing (see, precisely, walks leaflets found in this survey that seems photographed the murder of Meredith), of such cruelty become capable young people that some have called, referring especially to Knox and Sollecito, as the "boys next door".

Tavernese Francis, head of the Section dell'ONAOSI university, as we shall see, recalled that Raffaele was a fan of Marilyn Manson and another frequenter of the college had told him that he was troubled by the fact that the same visionava of erotic movies from the content really violent , those so-called "extreme sex" (vds. dich. of 5/22/08) But the reality that emerges from this story is this. It must take note. The night between the first and the two have a feature: Meredith and Amanda were alone in the house, for the first cohabitation their university.

There were boys Italian downstairs and there were no Filomena Romanelli nor Laura Mezzetti. It was the first, only at night when you could drag that girl reserved and in love with the "boyfriend" James Silence, as well as attached to his family and especially to his mother and English girls who were a bit '"world unto itself", in a perverse sexual play group at which one might have also take possession of the money that Meredith, always punctual, should have paid after the "bridge" that is, the next Monday, November 5, still remains that what drives the three organizing the "feast" is a motivation of a sexual, with plausible engage in the comics of which the three possessed '

It should be noted that, in any case, for those morbidly attracted by the mix of sex and violence, is far-fetched to connect the project to the tradition of Halloween, because if it is true that on the night of October 31 and November 1 was passed (and Meredith had spent with her friends countrymen), it is also true that, at 21 about the November 1 and for the next three hours, we were still in the day of All Saints and that what you do not was able to achieve on the night of the eve of the Festival of Saints, one could realize on the night of transition from the latter to the Holiday of the Dead. You could not let this occasion escape.
http://perugiamurderfile.net/viewto...d=25cd59e041f2096466136471356b9553&start=4000

 

[Vixen]

I'm glad you're not a cop. What does Manga have to do with All Saints Day? This is an example of insanity of thought that is pervasive among guilters,

From Wikipedia:
In Japan, people of all ages read manga. The medium includes works in a broad range of genres: action-adventure, romance, sports and games, historical drama, comedy, science fiction and fantasy, mystery, suspense, detective, horror, sexuality, and business/commerce, among others. Although this form of entertainment originated in Japan, many manga are translated into other languages, mainly English.[3] Since the 1950s, manga has steadily become a major part of the Japanese publishing industry,[4] representing a ¥406 billion market in Japan in 2007 (approximately $3.6 billion) and ¥420 billion ($5.5 billion) in 2009.[5] Manga have also gained a significant worldwide audience.[6] In Europe and the Middle East the market is worth $250 million.[7] In 2008, in the U.S. and Canada, the manga market was valued at $175 million. The markets in France and the United States are about the same size. Manga stories are typically printed in black-and-white,[8] although some full-color manga exist (e.g. Colorful). In Japan, manga are usually serialized in large manga magazines, often containing many stories, each presented in a single episode to be continued in the next issue. If the series is successful, collected chapters may be republished in tankōbon volumes, frequently but not exclusively, paperback books.[9] A manga artist (mangaka in Japanese) typically works with a few assistants in a small studio and is associated with a creative editor from a commercial publishing company.[10] If a manga series is popular enough, it may be animated after or even during its run.[11] Sometimes manga are drawn centering on previously existing live-action or animated films.[12]

The manga story cops had in mind was set at halloween.

 

[Vixen]

Beltaine (May 5 this year) is a spring fertility festival. Samhain is the autumn festival falling between the Autumn equinox and Midwinter solstice - November 7. Halloween is all hallows eve - a christian festival.

There are lots of sects. Dianatic witches are moon focussed, but co incidence of the lunar cycles and solar cycles are important. Resolving the Turing-Dee equations with respect to gravitational fields explains why the same face of the moon is always turned to the earth, and predicts the best time for casting.

Interesting, thanks!

 

[Grinder]

------
precisely on October 30, Meredith, this Amanda, had said that after the bridge of the saints, that is, by 5 November had to pay rent; Meredith replied that the money she had them already and that would have been able to give the two Italian roommates, agreeing then that 4 would put together the sum for the lease; While Amanda said that Lumumba was not paying, Meredith pointed out, always in the presence of Amanda, instead of having the availability of money at that time because he had won a scholarship and had two credit cards The impatience of Meredith to Amanda had become evident at that time, and Amanda could not fail to have noticed, and the rest who harbored no particular affection for Meredith, who was rather envious and tried aversion demonstrates the attitude held after the death of

There is a set of factors that "play" to the tragedy * the condition of all three defendants as consumers of drugs and, therefore, the alteration of the normal standards of behavior, resulting in the need for money (of which Meredith has) * To this is added, for the reconstruction of the personality of the three defendants (of Amanda and Raffaele will return later), the undeniable trend of these subjects (particularly the urge) to read stories particularly violent, especially the manga " Blood The Last Vampire ", comic found in the home of Sollecito, which contains scenes of extreme violence and sex, as well as the strong preference for all kinds of knives

* By Amanda must remember the story written a year before the murder and that was described the omnicide of a student (also subjected to sexual violence) with a kitchen knife in his back then place * Young dies drinking his blood * Del Guede is called a video in which it plays the part of the vampire and the 'habit of circular with a switchblade * This is a bit 'the most striking and impressive of this story: namely the fact that cruel and heinous crimes that were once reserved for very special types of criminals, today, for a form of leveling of crime to the whole community , for the atmosphere saturated with violence and brutality that reigns on television, in film and some publishing (see, precisely, walks leaflets found in this survey that seems photographed the murder of Meredith), of such cruelty become capable young people that some have called, referring especially to Knox and Sollecito, as the "boys next door".

Tavernese Francis, head of the Section dell'ONAOSI university, as we shall see, recalled that Raffaele was a fan of Marilyn Manson and another frequenter of the college had told him that he was troubled by the fact that the same visionava of erotic movies from the content really violent , those so-called "extreme sex" (vds. dich. of 5/22/08) But the reality that emerges from this story is this. It must take note. The night between the first and the two have a feature: Meredith and Amanda were alone in the house, for the first cohabitation their university.

There were boys Italian downstairs and there were no Filomena Romanelli nor Laura Mezzetti. It was the first, only at night when you could drag that girl reserved and in love with the "boyfriend" James Silence, as well as attached to his family and especially to his mother and English girls who were a bit '"world unto itself", in a perverse sexual play group at which one might have also take possession of the money that Meredith, always punctual, should have paid after the "bridge" that is, the next Monday, November 5, still remains that what drives the three organizing the "feast" is a motivation of a sexual, with plausible engage in the comics of which the three possessed '

It should be noted that, in any case, for those morbidly attracted by the mix of sex and violence, is far-fetched to connect the project to the tradition of Halloween, because if it is true that on the night of October 31 and November 1 was passed (and Meredith had spent with her friends countrymen), it is also true that, at 21 about the November 1 and for the next three hours, we were still in the day of All Saints and that what you do not was able to achieve on the night of the eve of the Festival of Saints, one could realize on the night of transition from the latter to the Holiday of the Dead. You could not let this occasion escape.
http://perugiamurderfile.net/viewto...d=25cd59e041f2096466136471356b9553&start=4000

So what does a summation from Rudi's trial have to do with the kids?

 

[Vixen]

Astonishingly, exactly that accusation has been made in an Italian court this week by a lawyer called Carlo Pacelli. He used the occasion of an appeal by the American student Amanda Knox against her conviction for the murder of a British student to call her an "enchanting witch" and attack her in terms that would be instantly recognisable to a mediaeval witch-finder.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/sep/27/amanda-knox-witch-hunts-italian-court

One person. That is just one story written by a hack appealing to the reader's basest instincts for salaciousness.

 

[Vixen]

Yes. According to Italian procedural law, CPP Art. 531 and Art. 620 para. 1a, this dismissal would appear to be effectively the same as an acquittal.

Actually, an exoneration. The crime did not happen and Mignini should never have been charged.

 

[Kauffer]

How many murders do you think happen from burglary? Vanishingly small. In fact here in England - and I read of a case in the US - it's been the householder shooting the burglar.

Nobody has said the Kercher murder was a satanic ritual. Nice try with your straw man.

We can't source the use of "satanic" by Mignini in court, but, both I and Tesla have previously posted sources where he claimed (actually in front of Micheli), that the killing was a rite associated with Halloween. The impeccable provenance for them is found here:

La Republica reported October 20, 2008:

http://www.repubblica.it/2008/10/sezioni/cronaca/perugia-uccisa8/guede-difesa/guede-difesa.html

In the reconstruction that the prosecutors presented in the hearing on Friday, the murder of Meredith was premeditated and was a ritual to celebrate the occasion of Halloween night. A sexual ritual in which the British student was stabbed in the throat by Amanda Knox, while Rudy Guede choked and Raffaele Sollecito held her. “They killed her – said the prosecutor – because Meredith refused to participate in specific sexual games of the group.”

This is validated by the Micheli Report:

Excluding the victim, and Mezzetti who was at Montefiascone and Romanelli who spent the night with her boyfriend, the only person who would be interested in that simulation is Knox, although not giving any credence to the inference of a peculiar preparation of the crime or even of hypothetical aggravating circumstances (highlighted somewhat by the PM, though not contesting them, in the, to say the least, fanciful reconstruction of rites, Halloween parties, manga publications and taking advantage of a situation that couldn’t be missed, maybe after a pantomime rehearsal in front of the hapless Kokomani), she was still however the only person that could have known that that evening Meredith would have been on her own in the house.

http://www.amandaknoxcase.com/frequently-asked-questions/

 

[Vixen]

So what does a summation from Rudi's trial have to do with the kids?

The kids are named as accessories to murder.

 

[Vixen]

We can't source the use of "satanic" by Mignini in court, but, both I and Tesla have previously posted sources where he claimed (actually in front of Micheli), that the killing was a rite associated with Halloween. The impeccable provenance for them is found here:

La Republica reported October 20, 2008:

http://www.repubblica.it/2008/10/sezioni/cronaca/perugia-uccisa8/guede-difesa/guede-difesa.html

In the reconstruction that the prosecutors presented in the hearing on Friday, the murder of Meredith was premeditated and was a ritual to celebrate the occasion of Halloween night. A sexual ritual in which the British student was stabbed in the throat by Amanda Knox, while Rudy Guede choked and Raffaele Sollecito held her. “They killed her – said the prosecutor – because Meredith refused to participate in specific sexual games of the group.”

This is validated by the Micheli Report:

Excluding the victim, and Mezzetti who was at Montefiascone and Romanelli who spent the night with her boyfriend, the only person who would be interested in that simulation is Knox, although not giving any credence to the inference of a peculiar preparation of the crime or even of hypothetical aggravating circumstances (highlighted somewhat by the PM, though not contesting them, in the, to say the least, fanciful reconstruction of rites, Halloween parties, manga publications and taking advantage of a situation that couldn’t be missed, maybe after a pantomime rehearsal in front of the hapless Kokomani), she was still however the only person that could have known that that evening Meredith would have been on her own in the house.

http://www.amandaknoxcase.com/frequently-asked-questions/

I thought you did not believe in newspaper reports? In Italy prosecutors have to put forward a possible reconstruction and motive. Seems a good enough submission as any.

 

[Kauffer]

Actually, an exoneration. The crime did not happen and Mignini should never have been charged.

Should never have been charged? It was time barred. That's why he got off. What do you know about the evidence in the case? I'm guessing not much. Am I right?

 

[Kauffer]

I thought you did not believe in newspaper reports? In Italy prosecutors have to put forward a possible reconstruction and motive. Seems a good enough submission as any.

The reports were validated by Micheli - It's in my post!

Even he rubbished the claims. And he's in the same club as mad mig.

 

[Vixen]

Should never have been charged? It was time barred. That's why he got off. What do you know about the evidence in the case? I'm guessing not much. Am I right?

It's to do with wiretapping.

Trying to conflate the MOF case with this one has given rise to all sorts of logic fallacies.

Just because Mignini thought the MOF serial-killer-over-several-years-case may have involved high level masonic network s and satanists, does not logically follow he believes the Kercher case is the same.

 

[Numbers]

Actually, an exoneration. The crime did not happen and Mignini should never have been charged.

Your statement is incorrect.

The English translation of the text of;

CPP Art. 531 para. 1 reads:
...if the offense is extinguished, the judge shall deliver a judgment of non-prosecution, mentioning the cause in the operative part.

CPP Art. 129 para 1 reads:
At any stage and instance of the proceedings, the judge who acknowledges that...the offense is extinguished or a requirement for prosecution is not met, he shall declare it ex officio by issuing a judgment.

The extinguishment does not state that the crime did not occur or that the accused did not commit it, it simply states the prosecution is time-barred by the statute of limitations. It is in that sense an acquittal on a legal technicality.

Source: The Italian Code of Criminal Procedure: Critical essays and English translation, ed, M. Gialuz et al., Walters Kluwer Italia (c) 2014

 

[Grinder]

The kids are named as accessories to murder.

Ahh. Do you have any court records from that trial of the kids' lawyers doing any direct or cross questioning?

ETA - Thanks Vixen for bringing this up. If I were to name the number one thing wrong with the Italian justice system it would be that people can be named as part of a crime in a trial they are not represented and that later other courts refer to rulings in that trial. Bizarre.

Perhaps others could come up with some of the aspects of the IJS that are just plain wrong.

 

[Vixen]

Your statement is incorrect.

The English translation of the text of;

CPP Art. 531 para. 1 reads:
...if the offense is extinguished, the judge shall deliver a judgment of non-prosecution, mentioning the cause in the operative part.

CPP Art. 129 para 1 reads:
At any stage and instance of the proceedings, the judge who acknowledges that...the offense is extinguished or a requirement for prosecution is not met, he shall declare it ex officio by issuing a judgment.

The extinguishment does not state that the crime did not occur or that the accused did not commit it, it simply states the prosecution is time-barred by the statute of limitations. It is in that sense an acquittal on a legal technicality.

Source: The Italian Code of Criminal Procedure: Critical essays and English translation, ed, M. Gialuz et al., Walters Kluwer Italia (c) 2014

OK, thanks.

 

[Grinder]

Astonishingly, exactly that accusation has been made in an Italian court this week by a lawyer called Carlo Pacelli. He used the occasion of an appeal by the American student Amanda Knox against her conviction for the murder of a British student to call her an "enchanting witch" and attack her in terms that would be instantly recognisable to a mediaeval witch-finder.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/sep/27/amanda-knox-witch-hunts-italian-court

One person. That is just one story written by a hack appealing to the reader's basest instincts for salaciousness.

Amanda Knox is at heart a "she-devil" who loved to play dangerous games, the lawyer for a man falsely accused by the American student of killing her roommate told an Italian court on Monday.

"Amanda is one thing and another -- that is, both Saint Maria Goretti and a satanic, diabolic she-devil given to borderline behavior," Carlo Pacelli said, referring to a Catholic saint linked to purity, young women and rape victims.

The student from Seattle initially accused Congolese bar owner Patrick Lumumba of killing Kercher, whose half-naked body was found with a deep stab wound in the throat.

Knox looked gaunt and tense as Lumumba's lawyer Pacelli branded her a "witch of deception" whose lying ways belied her fresh-faced "soap-and-water" looks.
​

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/26/us-italy-knox-idUSTRE78P27Y20110926

"Within her lives a double soul: one which is angelic, good, compassionate ... tender and ingenuous," Carlo Pacelli said.

But she had another side, he said: "A Lucifer-like, demonic, satanic, diabolical one which sometimes leads her to borderline and dissolute behavior," saying that was the Knox who had killed her roommate.​

http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/27/world/europe/italy-knox-appeal/

A lawyer has described Amanda Knox, who is appealing over the murder of Briton Meredith Kercher, as "diabolical" and "a witch of deception".
Carlo Pacelli is representing Patrick Lumumba, a barman seeking damages from Knox as part of a civil case which forms part of her murder appeal.
​

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-15059817

By The Associated Press
PERUGIA, Italy — Italian lawyers described Amanda Knox, the former University of Washington student convicted of killing her British roommate, as a “she-devil” and a “witch” in an appeals court Monday.​

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/italian-lawyer-calls-amanda-knox-a-she-devil/


I'd say allowing civil lawyers to be part of a criminal trial also is bizarre.

 

[Katody Matrass]

------
precisely on October 30, Meredith, this Amanda, had said that after the bridge of the saints, that is, by 5 November had to pay rent; Meredith replied that the money she had them already and that would have been able to give the two Italian roommates, agreeing then that 4 would put together the sum for the lease; While Amanda said that Lumumba was not paying, Meredith pointed out, always in the presence of Amanda, instead of having the availability of money at that time because he had won a scholarship and had two credit cards The impatience of Meredith to Amanda had become evident at that time, and Amanda could not fail to have noticed, and the rest who harbored no particular affection for Meredith, who was rather envious and tried aversion demonstrates the attitude held after the death of

There is a set of factors that "play" to the tragedy * the condition of all three defendants as consumers of drugs and, therefore, the alteration of the normal standards of behavior, resulting in the need for money (of which Meredith has) * To this is added, for the reconstruction of the personality of the three defendants (of Amanda and Raffaele will return later), the undeniable trend of these subjects (particularly the urge) to read stories particularly violent, especially the manga " Blood The Last Vampire ", comic found in the home of Sollecito, which contains scenes of extreme violence and sex, as well as the strong preference for all kinds of knives

* By Amanda must remember the story written a year before the murder and that was described the omnicide of a student (also subjected to sexual violence) with a kitchen knife in his back then place * Young dies drinking his blood * Del Guede is called a video in which it plays the part of the vampire and the 'habit of circular with a switchblade * This is a bit 'the most striking and impressive of this story: namely the fact that cruel and heinous crimes that were once reserved for very special types of criminals, today, for a form of leveling of crime to the whole community , for the atmosphere saturated with violence and brutality that reigns on television, in film and some publishing (see, precisely, walks leaflets found in this survey that seems photographed the murder of Meredith), of such cruelty become capable young people that some have called, referring especially to Knox and Sollecito, as the "boys next door".

Tavernese Francis, head of the Section dell'ONAOSI university, as we shall see, recalled that Raffaele was a fan of Marilyn Manson and another frequenter of the college had told him that he was troubled by the fact that the same visionava of erotic movies from the content really violent , those so-called "extreme sex" (vds. dich. of 5/22/08) But the reality that emerges from this story is this. It must take note. The night between the first and the two have a feature: Meredith and Amanda were alone in the house, for the first cohabitation their university.

There were boys Italian downstairs and there were no Filomena Romanelli nor Laura Mezzetti. It was the first, only at night when you could drag that girl reserved and in love with the "boyfriend" James Silence, as well as attached to his family and especially to his mother and English girls who were a bit '"world unto itself", in a perverse sexual play group at which one might have also take possession of the money that Meredith, always punctual, should have paid after the "bridge" that is, the next Monday, November 5, still remains that what drives the three organizing the "feast" is a motivation of a sexual, with plausible engage in the comics of which the three possessed '

It should be noted that, in any case, for those morbidly attracted by the mix of sex and violence, is far-fetched to connect the project to the tradition of Halloween, because if it is true that on the night of October 31 and November 1 was passed (and Meredith had spent with her friends countrymen), it is also true that, at 21 about the November 1 and for the next three hours, we were still in the day of All Saints and that what you do not was able to achieve on the night of the eve of the Festival of Saints, one could realize on the night of transition from the latter to the Holiday of the Dead. You could not let this occasion escape.
http://perugiamurderfile.net/viewto...d=25cd59e041f2096466136471356b9553&start=4000

As usual, Mignini says nothing that you asserted, but what a remarkable rambling of an obsessed lunatic.
Marilyn Manson would make anyone a murderer, no doubt about it, case solved

 

[Vixen]

Amanda Knox is at heart a "she-devil" who loved to play dangerous games, the lawyer for a man falsely accused by the American student of killing her roommate told an Italian court on Monday.

"Amanda is one thing and another -- that is, both Saint Maria Goretti and a satanic, diabolic she-devil given to borderline behavior," Carlo Pacelli said, referring to a Catholic saint linked to purity, young women and rape victims.

The student from Seattle initially accused Congolese bar owner Patrick Lumumba of killing Kercher, whose half-naked body was found with a deep stab wound in the throat.

Knox looked gaunt and tense as Lumumba's lawyer Pacelli branded her a "witch of deception" whose lying ways belied her fresh-faced "soap-and-water" looks.
​

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/26/us-italy-knox-idUSTRE78P27Y20110926

"Within her lives a double soul: one which is angelic, good, compassionate ... tender and ingenuous," Carlo Pacelli said.

But she had another side, he said: "A Lucifer-like, demonic, satanic, diabolical one which sometimes leads her to borderline and dissolute behavior," saying that was the Knox who had killed her roommate.​

http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/27/world/europe/italy-knox-appeal/

A lawyer has described Amanda Knox, who is appealing over the murder of Briton Meredith Kercher, as "diabolical" and "a witch of deception".
Carlo Pacelli is representing Patrick Lumumba, a barman seeking damages from Knox as part of a civil case which forms part of her murder appeal.
​

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-15059817

By The Associated Press
PERUGIA, Italy — Italian lawyers described Amanda Knox, the former University of Washington student convicted of killing her British roommate, as a “she-devil” and a “witch” in an appeals court Monday.​

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/italian-lawyer-calls-amanda-knox-a-she-devil/


I'd say allowing civil lawyers to be part of a criminal trial also is bizarre.

Barristers have always been allowed poetic licence to ham up. What about Bongiornio flashing a bunch of knives at Nencini? How did she get past security?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-6-votAouc&sns=em

 

[Bill Williams]

Actually, an exoneration. The crime did not happen and Mignini should never have been charged.

Do you then admit the same about Sollecito and Knox?