Obamacare 5 years later. Crow, anyone?

[RandFan]

Just for clairification, when you say your sons have Obamacare, do you mean that they have private insurance through an Individual Market exchange, or do you mean they have Medicaid? There's a massive unending pile of differences between the two.

Here is all I know. First off, California has a program called "Medical". AIU, "Medical" is seperated into two primary groups. One for people on disability and/or who are retired. The name for this program is, "Medical".

The other group is for people who cannot pay for insurance on their own and predates Obamacare. It's called, wait for it, "Medical". This group or division was at the time further subdivided in the Los Angeles region into, "L.A. Care", "Healthy Ways LA and ORSA".

Prior to my being put on disability I had "L.A. Care" through Medical (Medicaid). Now, I have Medicare, Medical, "L.A. Care" and Humana. Why Humana? I don't know. I was given a list of health care proiders to choose from.

In short, I don't know, my kids don't know.

 

[Kestrel]

So what would you suggest such a person should do, where if they make more than the medicaid limit, they have to pay, but that payment might cut into their income so much that the amount of money they have left over is less than what they had before the raise?

A 50 year old single person living in my zip code that earns $16,000 a year qualifies for Medicaid. A $500 raise would put them over the limit for Medicaid. The second lowest price Silver plan would cost $580 a year. At this income level, the Silver plan would have a copays similar to Medicaid. Yes, if you pick the numbers just right it can happen. But as you can see from this example, it's not a large drop in take home income. Depending on the local market, there may be no drop if the person chooses the lowest price Silver plan.

Before the ACA, such a person would be on a "pray you don't get sick" plan.

 

[Biscuit]

I have actually helped a few people get their insurance through the exchange. In Arizona we wisely took the medicaid expansion but the governor stubbornly refused to set up a state exchange because "obamacare" so we use the federal exchange healthcare.gov.

I have run across the "I lose money" objections every now and then and when I ask if they have priced any plans they have, at best, contacted a single insurance company directly and at worst never even gone to healthcare.gov to see the prices. I don't buy the "no incentive" arguments.

 

[boooeee]

Here is all I know. First off, California has a program called "Medical". AIU, "Medical" is seperated into two primary groups. One for people on disability and/or who are retired. The name for this program is, "Medical".

The other group is for people who cannot pay for insurance on their own and predates Obamacare. It's called, wait for it, "Medical". This group or division was at the time further subdivided in the Los Angeles region into, "L.A. Care", "Healthy Ways LA and ORSA".

Prior to my being put on disability I had "L.A. Care" through Medical (Medicaid). Now, I have Medicare, Medical, "L.A. Care" and Humana. Why Humana? I don't know. I was given a list of health care proiders to choose from.

In short, I don't know, my kids don't know.

I could be wrong, but I think when you say "Medical" here, it is actually "Medi-Cal" (Cal as in CALifornia). Which is just California's name for Medicaid.

 

[RandFan]

I could be wrong, but I think when you say "Medical" here, it is actually "Medi-Cal" (Cal as in CALifornia).

Yes, I get that the cal in "Medi-Cal" is for California. Thanks.

Which is just California's name for Medicaid.

This is not my understanding. While it's true that "Medi-Cal" is California's version of Medicaid it's not just "Medicaid". For one thing, it's two separate programs running on two different and entirely independent IT systems.

My wife and I have the same social worker. We have met with him together. In order to help me after helping my wife the last time we there the worker said he couldn't locate me in the system. That's because I'm in a different system I reminded him.

I'm not sure how your post helps resolve the problem but I do appreciate it

 

[paulhutch]

It seems like California tries to keep the administration costs down by using the same workers to administer both Medicare and Medicaid. However they have to be careful because the Federal funding portions for both programs are from different sources so they can't mix the two programs. This leads to citizens sometimes getting entered into the wrong program and therefore not actually ending up truly enrolled.

In Massachusetts we use separate agencies for the two programs so that kind of mix-up wouldn't happen. Seniors and the disabled get Medicare via the Group Insurance Commission which also handles retirement benefits for state employees. The poor who receive Medicaid are handled through MassHealth (AKA Romney Care).

 

[Grizzly Bear]

Of course not, the inflation is all good because it comes from free enterprise that are highly profitable. You want the government to start limiting the profits a person can make from their business? What kind of rampant socialist are you?

I am a rampant socialist!?

 

[Nihilianth]

It seems like California tries to keep the administration costs down by using the same workers to administer both Medicare and Medicaid. However they have to be careful because the Federal funding portions for both programs are from different sources so they can't mix the two programs. This leads to citizens sometimes getting entered into the wrong program and therefore not actually ending up truly enrolled.

In Massachusetts we use separate agencies for the two programs so that kind of mix-up wouldn't happen. Seniors and the disabled get Medicare via the Group Insurance Commission which also handles retirement benefits for state employees. The poor who receive Medicaid are handled through MassHealth (AKA Romney Care).

Ya know, I am 31 years old. I have read nad read and read about "Medicare" and "Medicaid." Then all the states (There are 50 of them ya know! FIFTY!) have their own friggin systems, and names. Then you have the FEDERAL system and names......By the time I come back round again, I forget (I am always forgetting) what the hell the difference is between "Medicare" and "Medicaid" is.

And I am an American at the age of 31 who prides himself in "keeping up" on current events and things. I couldn't imagine what a foreigner on these boards would think of this thread....

Probably thinking along the lines of: "Americans are absolutely INSANE!" To which, I couldn't disagree with.

All I know, is that I am a perfectly healthy 31 year old, and that somehow, none of this has anything to do with me......

 

[Planigale]

I can't speak for Canada but I live in the UK and you have most definitely heard wrong.

Here if I get sick I go to the GP and they prescribe medication, I pay a fee for the prescription but the GP visit is free. If I break my arm or do something a bit more serious that needs immediate care then I can go to an A&E dept and be treated within a few hours (or immediately if it's serious enough)

If something really bad happens some nice people in an ambulance will turn up after I call the emergency number and scoop me up and take me to hospital. Usually pretty quickly.

If I discover I have some serious disease that requires lengthy/complicated treatment then I get lengthy and complicated treatment. Sometimes I might have to wait a while before this can happen.

Apart from fees for prescription medication I have to pay exactly £0 for all of this.

If I decide that I don't want treatment via the NHS and want private treatment, which is usually faster, then I can choose to buy health insurance from one of several companies. The health insurance ads show people being cared for by younger prettier nurses than seem typical in the NHS in gleaming private suites, with the latest and greatest snazzy equipment, but the reality of private healthcare here probably isn't quite as polished.

It's not the best system, and the NHS could use a lot more funding, (apparently our government can only find that kind of funding for bankers, but that's a different thread) In recent years A&E departments are getting fewer and further between for example.

It still boggles my mind that a system broadly similar to this whereby if you get sick you get treatment and don't have to pay for it yourself, isn't the norm in every industrialised country.

I pay slightly higher taxes than Americans do, but not having to pay for health insurance means it probably works out about even in the end.

Most doctors seem happy to use the NHS for their care and their families care which suggests it is not terrible. Most doctors I know would consider private care for routine care, as you can usually choose your appt time, but think that any serious illness or emergency is best dealt with in the NHS, the NHS is probably worst for none emergency none life threatening conditions.

For those from the US the best parallel for the NHS is the VA. Both were set up post WW2 to look after the veterans of the war, the difference was that for the UK the whole population were veterans. All had been on the front line.

 

[Architect]

. Most doctors I know would consider private care for routine care, as you can usually choose your appt time, but think that any serious illness or emergency is best dealt with in the NHS, the NHS is probably worst for none emergency none life threatening conditions.

I have been treated privately several times. Same surgeons, same standards, only difference was a little off waiting time, easy appointments, and fancy private room.

 

[Border Reiver]

All I know, is that I am a perfectly healthy 31 year old, and that somehow, none of this has anything to do with me......

Yet.

Although, you're likely aware of that.

 

[Nihilianth]

Yet.

Although, you're likely aware of that.

Oh, I certainly am. Which is why I wish my state (PA) would have expanded Medicare. Alas, the previous governor was a Teapublican freak. Hopefully, the current governor (a conservative Democrat; he is clearly right of center), can put things aright. At least, he's a moderate.

 

[paulhutch]

Oh, I certainly am. Which is why I wish my state (PA) would have expanded Medicare.

This clearly demonstrates what you mentioned in your previous post, it's Medicaid that is expanded to cover more poor people. Until I had to help relatives who were disabled or elderly I could never keep the two program names straight in my head either. They really should have named it Social Security Health instead of Medicare then it would be clear it's for people on Social Security (retired or disabled). For some reason Governments and people in general seem to like to name things in the most confusing way possible. I see this all the time from marketing people at work so I've given up trying to impose any sanity on the way the products I design are named.

 

[Whiplash]

I'm honestly shocked by this OP. Shocked. It demonstrates to me just how badly some people can be in denial and believe what they want to believe. If you told me before this was posted that someone would be stating that Obamacare was a success, I would have chuckled.. then looked at them funny when I realize they were being serious.

I'm not saying it was a failure, or disastrous.. but an unmittigated success worthy of admiration and praise? People eating crow for saying it would be a problem? I'm blown away by the absolutely ideologic insanity of such statements. It immediately makes me question the competence and rationality of the person making said statements.

The sheer number of people who lost insurance, or have been moved into worse plans when it was promised they could keep their own.. the costs associated with it for even the poor and disabled.. I am on disability, and I have to pay $105 of my monthly disability to cover my insurance (Medicare). Social Security takes it right out of my monthly payment.. I thought I'd get insurance for free? It is hurting my ability to pay my bills dramatically. It's a cost I did not expect to have to pay, that came up AFTER I moved and setup a budget. Now each month I can barely buy enough food)

hardly a success. Laughable.

 

[DavidJames]

I'm honestly shocked by this OP. Shocked. It demonstrates to me just how badly some people can be in denial and believe what they want to believe. If you told me before this was posted that someone would be stating that Obamacare was a success, I would have chuckled.. then looked at them funny when I realize they were being serious.

I'm not saying it was a failure, or disastrous.. but an unmittigated success worthy of admiration and praise? People eating crow for saying it would be a problem? I'm blown away by the absolutely ideologic insanity of such statements. It immediately makes me question the competence and rationality of the person making said statements.

The sheer number of people who lost insurance, or have been moved into worse plans when it was promised they could keep their own.. the costs associated with it for even the poor and disabled.. I am on disability, and I have to pay $105 of my monthly disability to cover my insurance (Medicare). Social Security takes it right out of my monthly payment.. I thought I'd get insurance for free? It is hurting my ability to pay my bills dramatically. It's a cost I did not expect to have to pay, that came up AFTER I moved and setup a budget. Now each month I can barely buy enough food)

hardly a success. Laughable.

You're right. That's the way we roll here on this skeptics forum. Some one comes with their anecdote and we all nod in agreement. I'm sure you would bond nicely with Elf. He basis his opinions on things he's heard.

 

[varwoche]

I'm honestly shocked by this OP. Shocked. It demonstrates to me just how badly some people can be in denial and believe what they want to believe. If you told me before this was posted that someone would be stating that Obamacare was a success, I would have chuckled.. then looked at them funny when I realize they were being serious.

I'm not saying it was a failure, or disastrous.. but an unmittigated success worthy of admiration and praise? People eating crow for saying it would be a problem? I'm blown away by the absolutely ideologic insanity of such statements. It immediately makes me question the competence and rationality of the person making said statements.

The sheer number of people who lost insurance, or have been moved into worse plans when it was promised they could keep their own.. the costs associated with it for even the poor and disabled.. I am on disability, and I have to pay $105 of my monthly disability to cover my insurance (Medicare). Social Security takes it right out of my monthly payment.. I thought I'd get insurance for free? It is hurting my ability to pay my bills dramatically. It's a cost I did not expect to have to pay, that came up AFTER I moved and setup a budget. Now each month I can barely buy enough food)

hardly a success. Laughable.

The right wing echo chamber is not your friend. link Shocking?

 

[ponderingturtle]

I'm honestly shocked by this OP. Shocked. It demonstrates to me just how badly some people can be in denial and believe what they want to believe. If you told me before this was posted that someone would be stating that Obamacare was a success, I would have chuckled.. then looked at them funny when I realize they were being serious.

I'm not saying it was a failure, or disastrous.. but an unmittigated success worthy of admiration and praise? People eating crow for saying it would be a problem? I'm blown away by the absolutely ideologic insanity of such statements. It immediately makes me question the competence and rationality of the person making said statements.

The sheer number of people who lost insurance, or have been moved into worse plans when it was promised they could keep their own.. the costs associated with it for even the poor and disabled.. I am on disability, and I have to pay $105 of my monthly disability to cover my insurance (Medicare). Social Security takes it right out of my monthly payment.. I thought I'd get insurance for free? It is hurting my ability to pay my bills dramatically. It's a cost I did not expect to have to pay, that came up AFTER I moved and setup a budget. Now each month I can barely buy enough food)

hardly a success. Laughable.

It is a success by achieving what it intended and confounding the predictions of its naysayers.

Of course it is not ideal, but it is rather better than what existed before that so many want to go back to. You have the lazy layabouts like this guy who are just trying to milk the system.

http://www.nola.com/opinions/index.ssf/2015/05/blindness_obamacare.html

When will conservatives learn some personal responsibility?

 

[RandFan]

The right wing echo chamber is not your friend. link Shocking?

What about the Death Panels?

 

[RandFan]

I'm honestly shocked by this OP. Shocked. It demonstrates to me just how badly some people can be in denial and believe what they want to believe. If you told me before this was posted that someone would be stating that Obamacare was a success, I would have chuckled.. then looked at them funny when I realize they were being serious.

I'm not saying it was a failure, or disastrous.. but an unmittigated success worthy of admiration and praise? People eating crow for saying it would be a problem? I'm blown away by the absolutely ideologic insanity of such statements. It immediately makes me question the competence and rationality of the person making said statements.

The sheer number of people who lost insurance, or have been moved into worse plans when it was promised they could keep their own.. the costs associated with it for even the poor and disabled.. I am on disability, and I have to pay $105 of my monthly disability to cover my insurance (Medicare). Social Security takes it right out of my monthly payment.. I thought I'd get insurance for free? It is hurting my ability to pay my bills dramatically. It's a cost I did not expect to have to pay, that came up AFTER I moved and setup a budget. Now each month I can barely buy enough food)

hardly a success. Laughable.

I'm on disability, I don't pay anything other than co pays on Dr. visits that are not part of my plan and co pays on some prescriptions.

I elected an HMO, did you chose a PPO? I don't even remember now if I was offered a PPO. I've no idea why your insurance is so expensive.

 

[paulhutch]

I am on disability, and I have to pay $105 of my monthly disability to cover my insurance (Medicare). Social Security takes it right out of my monthly payment.. I thought I'd get insurance for free?

That's how it's worked for many decades before the ACA. Neither my disabled brother or sister had any abnormal change in Medicare insurance cost after the ACA although they both did get some extra benefits.