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Moderated JFK conspiracy theories: it never ends III

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Howdy, no I went down for a couple of weeks to bring down an inertial land navigation system for use by the 7th SFG. I had been trained on its use at Ft. Sill prior to a rotation to the NTC. It was used to help them understand where the unmarked Honduran Nickie border was.
 
Okay, here's what we know thus far:

They (conspirators) put a Mauser on the sixth floor, apparently by mistake. They forgot to put a paper bag there with Oswald's prints on it. So they had to swap out the Mauser for the Mannlicher Carcano. And of course, there was no clip in the rifle... whichever one it was they are complaining about. So they had to scrounge up one that fit the MC and pretend it was found with the rifle. And then, since it wasn't Oswald's rifle, they had to forge the order form linking him to the rifle. And the money order linking him to paying for the rifle. And the shipment form showing the MC bearing serial number C2766 was shipped to his PO box. And then they had to forge those backyard photos showing him in possession of the rifle. And then they had to plant three shells from the MC C2766 on the sixth floor so it would look like shots came from there. And then they had to get Oswald to deny having a long paper bag that morning and bringing it to the Depository, or get both Wes Frazier and his sister to lie about seeing him that morning with a rifle. And they had to plant a paper bag with his prints on it, made of Depository paper, in the sniper's nest corner as well. And then they had to plant his fingerprints on the rifle's trigger guard, and his palm print under the stock.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

Not satisfied with all that, they planted a bullet on a gurney in Parkland (or swapped out the legit one that was found, or both planted and swapped out a bullet). But they didn't mangle it enough. And wait, they are not done.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And they altered the Zapruder film to conceal evidence of a limo stop, and to conceal evidence that JFK's head had a large exit wound in the back of the head. And Zapruder himself must have been part of the conspiracy because he said on TV shortly after the assassination that the President had damage to the right-top of the head, over the ear.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And the x-rays and autopsy photos were faked or altered.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

They somehow got the President's body and altered his wounds to retrieve bullets (and / or to reverse the bullet tracks), and altered the films and photos.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

A news photographer inadvertently took a photo supposedly showing Oswald in the doorway and those dastardly (and oh, so clever!) conspirators somehow got their hands on it and altered it to show someone who looked almost just like Oswald in the doorway! How brilliant is that? They thought of everything!

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

When the police showed up at the Paine residence, they somehow got Marina (or her double) to admit to the police that yes, Lee owned a rifle, and it was stored in the Paine garage. She led them there and pointed out the blanket she had previously seen it wrapped it. But when a policeman lifted the blanket, the blanket was empty, proving the conspirators had somehow figured out how to manipulate space-time, and could teleport the rifle away (or they hypnotized Marina into believing there was a rifle there that wasn't, or she lied about her husband owning a rifle. Or she was really part of the conspiracy, and although there was no rifle in the garage ever, she claimed there was solely to make her husband look guilty).

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

Wait, there's more! They went around and tried to intimidate witnesses into lying about what they saw. If that didn't work, they killed off hundreds of 'key' witnesses in bizarre ways, like having the cab driver who took him near his rooming house bumped off by a kamikaze driver who drove head long into him, killing both. Or killing off not the witness himself, but a relative of the witness.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

Wait, there's still more! They got the Warren Commissioners themselves to lie up and down about almost everything. And the FBI and the Secret Service and the Dallas Police were all involved somehow, either in the planting of evidence or in the coverup.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And let's not forget the autopsy doctors! They lied left and right as well, and in fact at least one of them may have been part of the pre-autopsy alteration team that altered the President's wounds.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

Or maybe they altered Tippit's body, not JFK's, because it was Tippit who was shot riding in the Presidential limo. Or maybe Tppit was shot because he resembled JFK, and they needed a body to make it look like JFK was shot from behind so they could have autopsy x-rays and photos to show that.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And those dastardly conspirators framed Oswald for shooting the President (or Tippit) from behind by putting anywhere from three to eight shooters all around Dealey Plaza, and they fired anywhere from four to sixteen shots in the assassination. All to frame a lone nut. They thought they were one step ahead of everyone with THAT brilliant plan.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And they put Oswald in the company of anti-Castro Cubans (or someone pretending to be Oswald) to create the image of Oswald as a pro-Castro lone nut. How brilliant these guys were!

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

But wait, there's more!

They had multiple Oswalds roaming Dallas, doing totally innocuous things like getting a haircut or cashing a check, all to frame the real Oswald for the assassination somehow.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And they actually had TWO different dedicated Oswalds, one 'Lee' and one 'Harvey', each with his own mother(!), co-existing in the 1950's as part of some elaborate plot to kill Kennedy although he wasn't even a junior senator from Massachusetts when these two Oswald's were put into action. But the Lee who defected wasn't the Lee who came back, as he was substituted by the KGB, so there's actually three Oswalds (if not more).
These conspirators are brilliant!

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And conspirators framed Oswald for shooting Tippit, planting a bus transfer on him that links him to a bus ride, and faking a cab ride to past the rooming house. Those conspirators got Oswald to admit those things (or they got the interrogators to lie about those things, instead of getting the interrogators to lie about Oswald admitting Oswald owned a rifle, for instance). Brilliant! So the record reflects Oswald's denials, even though the interrogators could have lied and made up admissions! Brilliant!

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And they also planted shells from Oswald's revolver (or swapped the actual shells for Oswald's shells later) to frame Oswald, because the police didn't really want to capture a cop killer, and were content to let the real murderer of one of their own roam free while they just picked up some schmuck who snuck into a theatre. And although Oswald discarded a jacket somewhere between the rooming house and the shoe store on Jefferson, the conspirators must have picked up his jacket and swapped it out for another one that couldn't be traced to Oswald and was a size too large in any case!

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

And somehow this massive plot grew out of David Ferrie, Lee Oswald, and Clay Shaw having what was called a 'BS' session in the trial of Shaw by the supposed witness to this initial plot. And somehow Oswald was involved as a co-conspirator (named as such) in this plot in New Orleans, according to Jim Garrison, although he was actually a patsy and trying to stop the assassination, and might even have been a hero.

But the Conspiracy Theorists figured all that out.

Did I miss anything?

I'm sure I missed plenty!

Conspiracy theorists don't have to make sense. And they don't.

Hank
 
Howdy, no I went down for a couple of weeks to bring down an inertial land navigation system for use by the 7th SFG. I had been trained on its use at Ft. Sill prior to a rotation to the NTC. It was used to help them understand where the unmarked Honduran Nickie border was.

Then you were part of the ebel Project Watchtower plot to support Columbian coke smuggling!

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi/noframes/read/4481

Mike Ruppert was all over it and interviewed Tyree and had the goods on the lot of you!

I was CMA before the name change and after. It was an interesting few years.
 
Then you were part of the ebel Project Watchtower plot to support Columbian coke smuggling!

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi/noframes/read/4481

Mike Ruppert was all over it and interviewed Tyree and had the goods on the lot of you!

I was CMA before the name change and after. It was an interesting few years.

Well that was an interesting mix of nonsense! At that time I was regular army Captain, if there were CIA dudes around they kept a very low profile. lol
 
Well that was an interesting mix of nonsense! At that time I was regular army Captain, if there were CIA dudes around they kept a very low profile. lol

Just about every story that came out of CA back in the day was about 5% fact, 45% speculation and 50% ********.

I'd make a cash money bet that there were more ******** artists involved on the fringes of the activity than anything that had gone down before, including Cuba.

Throw in the outside observers that didn't know if they were on foot or horseback along with all the ******** artists and you end up with quite a mix of imaginative story telling that persists to this day.
 
Just about every story that came out of CA back in the day was about 5% fact, 45% speculation and 50% ********.

I'd make a cash money bet that there were more ******** artists involved on the fringes of the activity than anything that had gone down before, including Cuba.

Throw in the outside observers that didn't know if they were on foot or horseback along with all the ******** artists and you end up with quite a mix of imaginative story telling that persists to this day.

What I found amusing about that link was the writers was telling us about people being killed left and right to 'cover it up' yet didn't seem remotely concerned for his own safety.......
 
What I found amusing about that link was the writers was telling us about people being killed left and right to 'cover it up' yet didn't seem remotely concerned for his own safety.......

It's a familiar thread through most CT's - They™ kill from singles to multiples and nothing stops them™ but some guy on the 'net (before the 'net, a newsletter) has the goods on 'em but never disappears
 
It's a familiar thread through most CT's - They™ kill from singles to multiples and nothing stops them™ but some guy on the 'net (before the 'net, a newsletter) has the goods on 'em but never disappears

It's a miracle I tell you, a miracle!!!
 
Okay, here's what we know thus far:
Nice try. But all you've done is present dozens of different theories from many different people as if all conspiracy theorists (or indeed any single one) believe all of those things.

It's a bit naughty. If you took that approach with any topic it would end up looking confused and contradictory.


Not satisfied with all that, they planted a bullet on a gurney in Parkland (or swapped out the legit one that was found, or both planted and swapped out a bullet). But they didn't mangle it enough. And wait, they are not done.

It's way simpler than that, there's absolutely no reason to think CE399 was ever found at Parkland at all, let alone planted there.


And they altered the Zapruder film to conceal evidence of a limo stop, and to conceal evidence that JFK's head had a large exit wound in the back of the head. And Zapruder himself must have been part of the conspiracy because he said on TV shortly after the assassination that the President had damage to the right-top of the head, over the ear.

Zapruder film alteration is not advocated by most serious lone nut sceptics.


A news photographer inadvertently took a photo supposedly showing Oswald in the doorway and those dastardly (and oh, so clever!) conspirators somehow got their hands on it and altered it to show someone who looked almost just like Oswald in the doorway! How brilliant is that? They thought of everything!

Very very few conspiracy theorists believe this.

When the police showed up at the Paine residence, they somehow got Marina (or her double) to admit to the police that yes, Lee owned a rifle, and it was stored in the Paine garage. She led them there and pointed out the blanket she had previously seen it wrapped it. But when a policeman lifted the blanket, the blanket was empty, proving the conspirators had somehow figured out how to manipulate space-time, and could teleport the rifle away (or they hypnotized Marina into believing there was a rifle there that wasn't, or she lied about her husband owning a rifle. Or she was really part of the conspiracy, and although there was no rifle in the garage ever, she claimed there was solely to make her husband look guilty).

Hang on, if the rifle was in the garage all along how come nobody ever noticed it? That very blanket was handled by the Paines on more than one occasion, including loading and unloading it into their car. Its highly unlikely Ruth Paine would have allowed a rifle in her house.

Even the Warren Commission had trouble with that one. Of course theres the fibre isn't there? But that's not worth much since the Dallas Police ineptly stored all the evidence from the Paine garage together with the rifle.

Wait, there's more! They went around and tried to intimidate witnesses into lying about what they saw. If that didn't work, they killed off hundreds of 'key' witnesses in bizarre ways, like having the cab driver who took him near his rooming house bumped off by a kamikaze driver who drove head long into him, killing both. Or killing off not the witness himself, but a relative of the witness.

You left out the acual important ones. Oswald, Ruby, Ferrie, Eladio del Valle, DeMohrenschildt, Roselli, Giancana, Nagell...all who suffered violent or suspicious deaths right before they were due to talk to official investigations into JFKs death, in some cases hours before.
 
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Hang on, if the rifle was in the garage all along how come nobody ever noticed it? That very blanket was handled by the Paines on more than one occasion, including loading and unloading it into their car. Its highly unlikely Ruth Paine would have allowed a rifle in her house.

snipped...

What evidence do you have for the bolded?

ETA - Johnny Roselli and Sam Giancana died from natural causes...for their line of work...and Carlos Marcello did in fact die of natural causes and he's at the center of many of the JFK CT's
 
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Ruth Paine is a Quaker and inveterate pacifist. Well at least she always claimed to be. Her behavior towards Oswald was never very charitable though.

Giananca and Roselli where both involved with the CIA's attempts to kill Castro.

Giananca was violently killed just before he was due to testify at the Church Committee, which blew the lid off the CIA's illegal activities, their assasination plots against Castro and their alleged involvement with Kennedy's murder. It revelations led directly to formation of the HSCA.

Giancana was shot in a circle around his mouth, eg 'shut up'.

One of the reasons The Church Commitee joined the dots between the Castro plots and Kennedy's murder was Roselli, who had idiotically started to propose the idea that the Castro plots were coopted to assassinate Kennedy, the so called 'turnaround' theory.

Just after he testified to the HSCA, he was chopped into small pieces and stuffed into an oil drum.

It's kind of absurd to suggest Roselli, at least, wasn't killed because he blabbed about the mobs CIA involvement.
 
Ruth Paine is a Quaker and inveterate pacifist. Well at least she always claimed to be. Her behavior towards Oswald was never very charitable though.

Giananca and Roselli where both involved with the CIA's attempts to kill Castro.

Giananca was violently killed just before he was due to testify at the Church Committee, which blew the lid off the CIA's illegal activities, their assasination plots against Castro and their alleged involvement with Kennedy's murder. It revelations led directly to formation of the HSCA.

Giancana was shot in a circle around his mouth, eg 'shut up'.

One of the reasons The Church Commitee joined the dots between the Castro plots and Kennedy's murder was Roselli, who had idiotically started to propose the idea that the Castro plots were coopted to assassinate Kennedy, the so called 'turnaround' theory.

Just after he testified to the HSCA, he was chopped into small pieces and stuffed into an oil drum.

It's kind of absurd to suggest Roselli, at least, wasn't killed because he blabbed about the mobs CIA involvement.

Awesome! So what's your hypothesis for what happened?
 
A debating tactic so hoary and archaic it's got hieroglyphics on.

Not falling for it mate.

Asking a CTist for a coherent theory is always a fun technique. It shows how little substance they bring.

I was hoping there was a CTist somewhere who had integrity, mate.

But you have no coherent hypothesis, correct?
 
You left out the acual important ones. Oswald, Ruby, Ferrie, Eladio del Valle, DeMohrenschildt, Roselli, Giancana, Nagell...all who suffered violent or suspicious deaths right before they were due to talk to official investigations into JFKs death, in some cases hours before.
Ruby, dying a little over three years after the assassination, is "suspicious" to you?
 
Asking a CTist for a coherent theory is always a fun technique. It shows how little substance they bring.

I was hoping there was a CTist somewhere who had integrity, mate.

But you have no coherent hypothesis, correct?

There is no logical requirement on my part to propose a detailed alternative hypothesis to point out the manifest flaws in the official account.

Of course, this is just a scurrilous debating strangely anyway. You're not remotely interested in any alternative hypothesis, you just want shift the debate from scrutiny over the obviously inadequate lone nut story.

Again, I am not falling for it.
 
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