Continuation Part 14: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

[Kauffer]

I presume they must have done, to be able to report, none found.

You presume?! There are two things that are certain. Death and don't presume. Never ever do that!

 

[Vixen]

1)The shutters were closed per Filomena, yet its that window Rudy supposedly looked out and saw the Amanda Silhouette leaving. (Nov 19,2009) What other window would he view the driveway exit?

2)Rudy contradicts himself, saying there was no break in, inside or out, that he and Meredith had looked in all the rooms. (German Diary).
So he contradicts himself in being able to see Amandas silhouette leaving the driveway through the window, due to the shutters being closed as Filomena said.

Some have said Rudys a great liar, but hes not really very good. Rudy is a failure, in about everything he does including lying.

The only people Rudy really fooled was Migninni and his system loyalists.

They obviously didn't consider Rudy capable of "the perfect crime".

 

[Vixen]

Well I guess this is simply where we disagree. I personally find it striking that Rudy Guede is linked by significant criminal evidence to two separate break-ins within walking distance of his house that both involve very difficult climbs up high walls to rock smashed second floor windows, in the time span of two weeks, and that the common factor could be something other than him participating in both break-ins.

The evidence at the cottage clearly demonstrates Rudy Guede killed and sexually assaulted Meredith Kercher. The most reasonable method of entry is the apparent break-in in Filomena's room. The corroborative value of the law office crime establishing Rudy's break-in MO is simply icing on the cake IMO. In fact I would say its main value is demonstrating the unreasonableness of PGP who discount it instantly as totally irrelevant while they go on about Amanda's April Fools prank, noise ticket, or creative writing exercises etc.

Yes, but if Rudy "lived within walking distance of two other high rise burglaries within two weeks", then the same could be said of Raf, who lived close by to Rudy.

I hear what you're saying, but you have to be careful not to make causal links that have no logical basis on closer examination.

 

[Bill Williams]

There is proof others were there that night. Amanda herself confirmed they were her footprints,as highlighted by luminol, on Diane (?) Sawyer show. There's the Raf footprint on the bathmat, there's the mixed Amanda/Mez DNA. Both would need to have been bleeding within twenty minutes of each other for the blood DNA to mix and set in such a fashion.

The rock would have been thrown - whether from the inside or the outside - by whoever had the idea.

Vixen. Your thought processes are betrayed as incredibly weak.

1) "There is proof there were others there that night." (Fact: 8 of 9 experts who testified at the Massei trial said that a lone-attacker could not be ruled out.)

2) "Amanda herself confirmed they were her footprints,as highlighted by luminol" (Fact: these were non-blood footprints which could have been left at any time.)​

Your posts are the Wrong-Way Corrigan of how to solve a crime.

3) "There's the Raf footprint on the bathmat" (Fact: no there's not. This is a tired guilter-cliche. The Italian courts obviously do not support your specious claim. I'd ask you for a cite, but you do not prove things, you only assert as-if true.)

4) "there's the mixed Amanda/Mez DNA." (Fact: so? This was found in a bathroom they'd shared for weeks. Also, did you see the video the police took of themselves collecting the samples? Obviously not.)

5) "Both would need to have been bleeding within twenty minutes of each other for the blood DNA to mix and set in such a fashion." (Fact: there never was any evidence of this, much less any evidence entered by a prosecutor in court. Also, upon her arrest, Amanda was inspected from head to toe, and no source of bleeding was found.)​

I'd ask for cites for the claims you make above. You will steadfastly ignore the request.

Why are you doing this?

 

[Vixen]

This is very familiar behaviour to anyone who's spent any time on the 9/11 sub-forum. It's known there as JAQing off.

Speak for yourself.

 

[Antony]

There is proof others were there that night. Amanda herself confirmed they were her footprints,as highlighted by luminol, on Diane (?) Sawyer show. There's the Raf footprint on the bathmat, there's the mixed Amanda/Mez DNA. Both would need to have been bleeding within twenty minutes of each other for the blood DNA to mix and set in such a fashion.

The rock would have been thrown - whether from the inside or the outside - by whoever had the idea.

a) Amanda's footprints in the flat don't mean anything because she lived there;

b) the bathmat footprint is not Raffaele. The "evidence" that was is based on fraudulent pseudo-science. The images are in the public domain and the shape of the big toe is quite unlike Raff's but could easily match Guede;

c) the "mixed DNA" of Amanda in Meredith's blood is from the faulty collection techniques, when spots of blood were scrubbed off surfaces that previously had Amanda's DNA. Your conclusion of "bleeding within 20 minutes of each other" is simply wrong. In any case Amanda had no recent wounds at the time of her arrest, 4 days after the murder - unlike Rudy Guede, who had cuts on his hands consistent with the use of a knife in a struggle.

All of this is widely-known and available. You keep coming back to discredited and irrelevant evidence to prop up an illusion of doubt over the students' innocence. What is your agenda?

 

[Vixen]

Or even easier, use the old mop that's sticking out of the bucket right there on the porch.

Exactly. Why the need to send a very strong signal to the cops, "this is the instrument that smashed the window and it comes from outside".

 

[Bill Williams]

a) Amanda's footprints in the flat don't mean anything because she lived there;

b) the bathmat footprint is not Raffaele. The "evidence" that was is based on fraudulent pseudo-science. The images are in the public domain and the shape of the big toe is quite unlike Raff's but could easily match Guede;

c) the "mixed DNA" of Amanda in Meredith's blood is from the faulty collection techniques, when spots of blood were scrubbed off surfaces that previously had Amanda's DNA. Your conclusion of "bleeding within 20 minutes of each other" is simply wrong. In any case Amanda had no recent wounds at the time of her arrest, 4 days after the murder - unlike Rudy Guede, who had cuts on his hands consistent with the use of a knife in a struggle.

All of this is widely-known and available. You keep coming back to discredited and irrelevant evidence to prop up an illusion of doubt over the students' innocence. What is your agenda?

Vixen posted that he'd read "all the books". When asked to list them, he ignored the request.

To me is looks like he's read the PMF sites, and the fake-Wiki by Edward McCall.

 

[Vixen]

Vixen

You mentioned the 43 injuries upthread. Some PGP think this number is too many to have been inflicted by a single assailant. Well, I give you Joanne Yeates who was killed by Vincent Tabak single-handedly and guess what? He inflicted 43 injuries. Yes, that's right. 43.

You have overlooked the fact that all but one of the experts who testified before Massei found nothing inconsistent with a sole attacker being responsible.

How many of those were self-defence injuries?

 

[Vixen]

You obviously don't understand what this article actually says.

Look: if a handset is switched off, nothing is capable of communicating with that handset, that handset is incapable of communicating with anything else, and that handset is incapable of reading or storing data (eg GPS location data).

The article you've quoted is about handset registration overseas, coupled with the delivery of voicemail and text messages when the phone is actually switched on. It most assuredly doesn't say what you appear to think it says.

Incidentally, as others have also already pointed out, it's moot to be even talking about GPS in the context of the Knox/Sollecito trials, since none of the handsets involved had GPS capabilitiies anyhow. Given that, the only means of location tracking was via the crude method of base station triangulation (I'm guessing you don't know what that means, but I cannot be bothered to explain it), or the even cruder method (cf the prosecution in this case) of knowing which base station a phone was communicating with, and figuring that the phone must be within the coverage area for that base station.

And it all feeds back to the central point here: if Sollecito (and, by extension Knox) wanted to create a false alibi for their location, the totally obvious thing for them to have done would have been to leave their phones inside Sollecito's apartment, switched on and with signal coverage. That way, the network would have continued their connection with the same base station. If anyone had called or texted them, they could plausibly have said that they were dozing or having sex (or whatever), and hadn't noticed the incoming call/text.

You think Raf's Italian papa would be satisfied with Raf turning off his phone to avoid his calls.

Why is Dad keeping Raf on such a short lead, anyway? Does he not trust his wayward son one little bit?

 

[Vixen]

Having just scrolled through the last couple of days posts, which have been quite amusing. Could I get in line to ask Vixen a question?

Do you know of any evidence that proves Amanda and Raff were at the cottage at the time of the murder?

If so, would you be kind enough to share it. Previous posters such as Mach and platanov often claimed there was such evidence but never produced it. You would think that if these people were so convinced of the guilt of Amanda and Raff they would have shared all this secret evidence with the prosecution so that it could have been presented in court.

Please see my response re footprints and mixed DNA.

 

[Kauffer]

There is proof others were there that night. Amanda herself confirmed they were her footprints,as highlighted by luminol, on Diane (?) Sawyer show. There's the Raf footprint on the bathmat, there's the mixed Amanda/Mez DNA. Both would need to have been bleeding within twenty minutes of each other for the blood DNA to mix and set in such a fashion.

The rock would have been thrown - whether from the inside or the outside - by whoever had the idea.

And we have a winner!

These are the fallacies many of us suspected that you embraced.

 

[Vixen]

Vixen, you have an answer for everything, don't you, except the evidence raised on this board? If Amanda was working on beginning Italian and Rudi spoke/understood almost no English (phrases from songs and movies don't count), you suggest "the language of lur-ve" suffices to instruct Rudi to participate in a gruesome murder in a small room where only Rudi left evidence of the attack on the victim. Time out for you! If you gave an answer like that in kindergarten, teacher would have made you sit under the piano with me. ;

And if you tried to explain in kindergarten what you exactly meant by "the language of lur-ve" to control a man, Sister Napoleoni would have washed out your mouth with soap.

I don't see how Rudy not speaking English and Amanda not speaking Italian prevents drugs, sex and crime sharing?

Have you never been in a loud club or disco, where, despite not being able to hear a word, couples manage to get off with each other. Where there's a will...

 

[Vixen]

Way before this, Amanda's diary in the first couple of weeks of her incarceration, heartbreakingly reveals a complete confidence that all the "misunderstandings" that put her in prison will be readily resolved and that the first event of substance to happen (and happen very soon) is going to be her release from prison to home confinement.

Kauffer, speaking of Amanda's diary, what is your theory as to why she tore out the pages in October leading up to the murder? Enquiring minds need to know.

 

[Kauffer]

You think Raf's Italian papa would be satisfied with Raf turning off his phone to avoid his calls.

Why is Dad keeping Raf on such a short lead, anyway? Does he not trust his wayward son one little bit?

? He didn't turn off his phone, according to him.

Have you now dumped your argument about the discoverability of a phone's location.

 

[Kauffer]

Kauffer, speaking of Amanda's diary, what is your theory as to why she tore out the pages in October leading up to the murder? Enquiring minds need to know.

I know nothing about it or even that it's true. I go looking for relevant evidence in connection with the commission of the murder.

Perhaps you would like to write more about this alleged activity and explain how it is probative.

 

[Grinder]

I know nothing about it or even that it's true. I go looking for relevant evidence in connection with the commission of the murder.

Perhaps you would like to write more about this alleged activity and explain how it is probative.

No mensa member are you Obviously she written her plans to murder Mez in her diary so she needed to tear out the pages but keep the book because it would draw suspicion which would help her control the investigation. Why didn't they dump it with the bloody clothes and knives etc.

This is along the lines of her forgetting to coordinate their alibis. Now since they didn't have exactly the same stories that would be circumstantial evidence they are innocent.

Do you remember Amanda admitting the footprints not in blood were hers? I don't.

 

[Vixen]

a) Amanda's footprints in the flat don't mean anything because she lived there;

b) the bathmat footprint is not Raffaele. The "evidence" that was is based on fraudulent pseudo-science. The images are in the public domain and the shape of the big toe is quite unlike Raff's but could easily match Guede;

c) the "mixed DNA" of Amanda in Meredith's blood is from the faulty collection techniques, when spots of blood were scrubbed off surfaces that previously had Amanda's DNA. Your conclusion of "bleeding within 20 minutes of each other" is simply wrong. In any case Amanda had no recent wounds at the time of her arrest, 4 days after the murder - unlike Rudy Guede, who had cuts on his hands consistent with the use of a knife in a struggle. All of this is widely-known and available. You keep coming back to discredited and irrelevant evidence to prop up an illusion of doubt over the students' innocence. What is your agenda?

So why did Amanda claim her ears were bleeding? (Ew.)

There's the photo of the neck scratch. Who scratched Amanda's neck?

 

[MichaelB]

Vixen. Your thought processes are betrayed as incredibly weak.

1) "There is proof there were others there that night." (Fact: 8 of 9 experts who testified at the Massei trial said that a lone-attacker could not be ruled out.)

2) "Amanda herself confirmed they were her footprints,as highlighted by luminol" (Fact: these were non-blood footprints which could have been left at any time.)​

Your posts are the Wrong-Way Corrigan of how to solve a crime.

3) "There's the Raf footprint on the bathmat" (Fact: no there's not. This is a tired guilter-cliche. The Italian courts obviously do not support your specious claim. I'd ask you for a cite, but you do not prove things, you only assert as-if true.)

4) "there's the mixed Amanda/Mez DNA." (Fact: so? This was found in a bathroom they'd shared for weeks. Also, did you see the video the police took of themselves collecting the samples? Obviously not.)

5) "Both would need to have been bleeding within twenty minutes of each other for the blood DNA to mix and set in such a fashion." (Fact: there never was any evidence of this, much less any evidence entered by a prosecutor in court. Also, upon her arrest, Amanda was inspected from head to toe, and no source of bleeding was found.)​

I'd ask for cites for the claims you make above. You will steadfastly ignore the request.

Why are you doing this?

This is Nicks idea of 'research' for his book. Read the old tabloid articles and conspiracy theory blogs then join a forum and see which factoids work and which ones don't. He's tweeting the same crap as well.

 

[carbonjam72]

Originally Posted by bagels
Well I guess this is simply where we disagree. I personally find it striking that Rudy Guede is linked by significant criminal evidence to two separate break-ins within walking distance of his house that both involve very difficult climbs up high walls to rock smashed second floor windows, in the time span of two weeks, and that the common factor could be something other than him participating in both break-ins.

The evidence at the cottage clearly demonstrates Rudy Guede killed and sexually assaulted Meredith Kercher. The most reasonable method of entry is the apparent break-in in Filomena's room. The corroborative value of the law office crime establishing Rudy's break-in MO is simply icing on the cake IMO. In fact I would say its main value is demonstrating the unreasonableness of PGP who discount it instantly as totally irrelevant while they go on about Amanda's April Fools prank, noise ticket, or creative writing exercises etc.

Yes, but if Rudy "lived within walking distance of two other high rise burglaries within two weeks", then the same could be said of Raf, who lived close by to Rudy.
I hear what you're saying, but you have to be careful not to make causal links that have no logical basis on closer examination.

Rudy was also caught with items stolen from the law office, a phone and computer, and caught while in the act of an unauthorized entry in a nursery school in Milan, not in Perugia.

In addition, the nursery school owner and workers who came upon Rudy, all thought he was dangerous, and in fact, Rudy had 'borrowed' a large knife from the nursery school kitchen - which he claimed to need for self-defense.

So Rudy has a history of:
- burglaries with 2nd floor entry and use of a rock thrown through a window - likely as an alert system in case anyone is home,
- carrying a knife during unauthorized entry and brandishing it in at least one burglary,
- a history of petty theft and harassing women especially when drunk,
- A life-long record as a habitual liar and layabout, no visible means of support and his apartment paid for by his adoptive family and had lived there only a short time.
- But most importantly, only evidence of Rudy Guede that can be dated to the time the Kercher assault was committed was in the room where the murder occurred

There is no history for Raf or Amanda that could reasonably be construed as acts or behaviors that grew into the Kercher crime.

But that won't stop the reckless and malicious speculation of unscrupulous self-published amateurs, fraudulently passing themselves off as journalists while hoping to make a quick buck off a miscarriage of justice by pretending to sew "doubt". Well I wish them their just deserts; slim sales and a big fat law suit.