Continuation Part 14: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

[Bill Williams]

IMV the new motive is not correct in principle, and likely a reason for the annulment.

Which motive? What the 2015 ISC (seemed to have) ruled is that ANY motive applied to AK and /or RS is wrong in principle.

It is one thing not to take a side. It is quite another to post things which make it unclear what is being said.

As per requests upthread - perhaps it would be a good place to restart to come up with a timeline for this crime?

 

[carbonjam72]

Paris is Raging

Not many male vixens, around, carbo.

There is a difference between being guilty in law and guilty in fact.

Bruce Jenner?

And, thanks for coming out in full guilter drag. But if you do have any reason or basis in facts or evidence to suggest Amanda and Raf may not be innocent victims of a miscarriage of justice, I think many here would applaud you for producing it, or at least arguing your point of view in that regard.

Personally, I'd settle for a paragraph from Hellman that you feel is poorly reasoned, regarding the facts of the burglary and assault. But I refuse to wait with anticipation. Even Charlie Brown has to give up hope of kicking the football at some point.

I'll feel silly if you're not a 'she' and just spoofing, but I take you at your word. Bill, take note, I was wrong, and you were right.

 

[Bill Williams]

Bruce Jenner?

And, thanks for coming out in full guilter drag. But if you do have any reason or basis in facts or evidence to suggest Amanda and Raf may not be innocent victims of a miscarriage of justice, I think many here would applaud you for producing it, or at least arguing your point of view in that regard.

Personally, I'd settle for a paragraph from Hellman that you feel is poorly reasoned, regarding the facts of the burglary and assault. But I refuse to wait with anticipation. Even Charlie Brown has to give up hope of kicking the football at some point.

I'll feel silly if you're not a 'she' and just spoofing, but I take you at your word. Bill, take note, I was wrong, and you were right.

I still like Grinder better than you!!!! However, when did I ever venture an opinion on gender? You have me prematurely right! (Which is about as close as I've come, I'll admit!)

 

[anglolawyer]

She is maintaining the view that the trial of the second instance is an appeal in the form of a US trial. It is however clear that the ISC ruling isn't about the Nencini court exceeding it mandate, but rather based on the muddled thinking of the aforementioned court and the Massei court before.

I'm more confused by her statement that she doesn't want to take sides which seems in contradiction to her introduction stating her interest in these types of cases. Is she saying she just likes to read about them without forming an opinion of guilt, innocence or not guilty under the law?

Well, if that's what she means she should be asking why the ISC did not remand the case once again as, we were recently informed, the ISC has been known to do as many as nine times in other cases. It would be very odd indeed for the ISC to treat Nencini's fanciful musings as by themselves sufficient to justify chucking out the whole case. But we will see when the motivations come out. I don't think we will get any clarification from Vixen, though. She keeps dipping her toe in the water here but refusing to take the plunge.

 

[Dan O.]

You will never make it into Mensa if you obsess so much about trifling details

Do you know what is said about Mensa in the 4 sigma society?

 

[Kauffer]

Do you know what is said about Mensa in the 4 sigma society?

I can imagine. Aren't they supposed to regard themselves as 10,000 times brighter?

 

[acbytesla]

Don't be embarrased. A lot of people repeat second grade three times. You don't have to cover up. I've got the file but don't worry, I won't tell anyone. They didn't hear it from me!

OK..Ok...they kicked me out.. ...I forgot that Kipling wrote Gunga Din...they decided that was unforgivable.

 

[anglolawyer]

Do you know what is said about Mensa in the 4 sigma society?

Given that I never heard of the latter before now, no. Is it what Kauffer said?

 

[carbonjam72]

Given that I never heard of the latter before now, no. Is it what Kauffer said?

Does this have anything to do with the masons?

 

[acbytesla]

IMV the new motive is not correct in principle, and likely a reason for the annulment.

You think? Does any motive for either Amanda who had known Mez for 6 weeks or Raffaele who had known her for a week make sense? Keep in mind that the roommates testified that they got along and that they never saw them argue.

 

[Bill Williams]

You think? Does any motive for either Amanda who had known Mez for 6 weeks or Raffaele who had known her for a week make sense? Keep in mind that the roommates testified that they got along and that they never saw them argue.

Keep in mind also that it is an either/or that they did it or didn't do it.

The "they did it" side has had motives by the sack-full. The motives included that they did not have one, something Mr. Mignini mused himself in his ever-changing theory of the crime; he once mused that the very worst reason for killing like this was for no reason at all.

The "they didn't do it" side has only ever ventured one motive, curiously it is a motive included by the "they did it" crowd. But it's a motive that actually matches the non-evidence of their involvement.....

.... there was no motive.

 

[anglolawyer]

Does this have anything to do with the masons?

Let's not bring them into it! What about the girl guides?

 

[carbonjam72]

Let's not bring them into it! What about the girl guides?

Girl guides? Did you mean Girl Scouts?

 

[acbytesla]

Keep in mind also that it is an either/or that they did it or didn't do it.

The "they did it" side has had motives by the sack-full. The motives included that they did not have one, something Mr. Mignini mused himself in his ever-changing theory of the crime; he once mused that the very worst reason for killing like this was for no reason at all.

The "they didn't do it" side has only ever ventured one motive, curiously it is a motive included by the "they did it" crowd. But it's a motive that actually matches the non-evidence of their involvement.....

.... there was no motive.

The truth is that for pretty much every murder, there is a motive, not that the motive makes sense to anyone else.. (the senseless deaths).but there is almost always a reason....usually pathetic. But a reason.

Grinder and I have after much arguing that it's the evidence that is key. That if there was overwhelming evidence that K&S committed the crime that motive would be irrelevant. And even if we could demonstrate overwhelming motive and there was no evidence that the suspect was involved, we would have to acquit.

But the fact is that motive alone has convicted suspects, even when there is substantial evidence that exonerate them. Just take a look at the case against Russian Faria.

But the problem in this case is there really is very little evidence and there is no reasonable honest motives, only nonsense ones.

The one that the guilters for the most part believe is the sex party gone awry and that Amanda used her sexual wiles to get both Rudy and Raffaele to help kill Meredith. They make her out to be a cross between Sharon Stone in Basic Instinct and Charles Manson.
It also transforms two young men into pathetic easily manipulated brainless slaves to their own hormones. Never mind there is no history of Amanda ever acting in such a way or Raffaele being that easily manipulated.

In 7 years, I have never heard a logical argument supported by the evidence for a motive for either Amanda or Raffaele, and I'm convinced that I never will.

 

[Grinder]

You think? Does any motive for either Amanda who had known Mez for 6 weeks or Raffaele who had known her for a week make sense? Keep in mind that the roommates testified that they got along and that they never saw them argue.

Tesla she's saying that the court of the second instance should only review the case and look for mistakes not retry it.

You forgot to acknowledge that giving an example of 20' tunnels is specious in comparing to a 56'er.

 

[Strozzi]

OK..Ok...they kicked me out.. ...I forgot that Kipling wrote Gunga Din...they decided that was unforgivable.

I'm an American. I attended kindergarten in Cambridge, England, but was expelled after six weeks. One day when recess was over I persuaded several other boys that we should continue to play outside. . The teacher came back outside to drag us in and I, the organizer, attempted to negotiate with her - that was a poor decision. I was made to sit under the piano the rest of the afternoon (kind of like solitary). I was charged with rebellion. That was the end of my British education.

 

[Bill Williams]

The one that the guilters for the most part believe is the sex party gone awry and that Amanda used her sexual wiles to get both Rudy and Raffaele to help kill Meredith. They make her out to be a cross between Sharon Stone in Basic Instinct and Charles Manson.
It also transforms two young men into pathetic easily manipulated brainless slaves to their own hormones. Never mind there is no history of Amanda ever acting in such a way or Raffaele being that easily manipulated.

In 7 years, I have never heard a logical argument supported by the evidence for a motive for either Amanda or Raffaele, and I'm convinced that I never will.

Once again, the guilters believe this because (IMO) Andrea Vogt passed same-day reports of the prosecution's 2009 case to Peggy Ganong from the courtroom. Like torch-carrying, pitchforked villagers, the early guilters locked into this because it was one of Mignini's early theories - sex-game gone wrong.

Any vestiges of "Satanic Rite" or "Rite associated with Hallowe'en" petered out at trial, for reasons discussed ad nauseam here.

By the time of Mignini's 2009 closing - Machiavelli summarized this just a month or two ago in this very thread - the motive was more psychological/psychopathological. Judge Massei was so impressed by Mignini's factoid-theorizing that Massei substituted a choice-for-evil.

The real lick-spittle in this is prosecutor Crini in Florence. He phoned-in his prosecution case, hardly letting his feet touch the floor by saying this murder was over toilet-cleanliness. This was more of an insult to Meredith Kercher than anyone else - presumable, acc. to Crini - Meredith became so bitchy in her complaints that it led to her murder!!!!

That one was so bizarre that Nencini (how many subs are allowed in soccer?) substituted his own.... reaching back, wayyyyyyy back beyond even the ISC/2013mandated motive of sex-game to Rudy Guede.....

..... the sole source of the "argument over rent money" motive. (By this time the lick-spittle Crini had cashed his paycheque and went to confession to atone for his spineless sins.)

Nencini's genius was to pull that one claim from Rudy, while ignoring that the basis for Rudy being able to hear Meredith's complaints about Amanda (once again, making Meredith out to be such a badguy that it led to her death!!!) was that Meredith had actually consented to a date with Rudy, and had been the one to grant him consensual entry to the cottage.

No wonder ISC/2015 annuled the whole thing, and exonerated AK and RS.

But why then do the remaining guilters, now mainly hidden behind Peggy's wall with the curtains drawn, maintain sex-game or psychopathology? It's no matter now, really.

I don't even know why I'm commenting like this.

 

[Bill Williams]

I'm an American. I attended kindergarten in Cambridge, England, but was expelled after six weeks. One day when recess was over I persuaded several other boys that we should continue to play outside. . The teacher came back outside to drag us in and I, the organizer, attempted to negotiate with her - that was a poor decision. I was made to sit under the piano the rest of the afternoon (kind of like solitary). I was charged with rebellion. That was the end of my British education.

What the Americans now call PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder, they used to call battle fatigue. General Patton called it cowardice and had the poor bastards shot.

The Brits, in their infinite sense of superiority (!) called it "Lack of Moral Fibre". If an LMF appeared on your service record, you could not get a job once free from service, and had to emigrate to Canada. (No comments, please.)

 

[acbytesla]

Tesla she's saying that the court of the second instance should only review the case and look for mistakes not retry it.

You forgot to acknowledge that giving an example of 20' tunnels is specious in comparing to a 56'er.

But of course we know that she is wrong and that isn't how it works in Italy.

We also know that 34 out of 36 TBMs larger than 14 meters (45.93ft) successfully completed their tunnel drives In the last 20 years. (Bertha and Alice are the only exceptions so far) Alice, a 14.4m TBM completed the first of two 2.4 KM tunnel drives and is just beginning the second. Granted, Bertha is the largest, so maybe there isn't a perfect precedence...Any way, knock on wood.

 

[acbytesla]

What the Americans now call PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder, they used to call battle fatigue. General Patton called it cowardice and had the poor bastards shot.

The Brits, in their infinite sense of superiority (!) called it "Lack of Moral Fibre". If an LMF appeared on your service record, you could not get a job once free from service, and had to emigrate to Canada. (No comments, please.)

No, Patton just slapped them. Only Eddie Slovik was executed for anything close to cowardice. He was executed for desertion. Compare that to the other countries involved in WW2. The Germans and Rusdians were both famous for executing their own soldiers for being unwilling to fight. Not sure about the British or the Canadians .