Continuation Part 14: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

[Bill Williams]

This is a great article. Hellmann was amazingly brave to do what he did. He essentially bucked the entire system at his own peril. He knew they were innocent and honestly came to that judgement regardless of the consequences that were in store for him. He lost the chance of the promotion. He was essentially forced into retirement. Yet through it all, he stuck to his ideals and did the right thing. The guy is a hero and an honest man. I hope he comes to be recognized as such in a broader sense.

He is yet another victim in this 8 year fiasco.

I dunno. You're never the "victim" when you do the right thing. Just because there are consequences (unfair as they may be) to doing the right thing, doesn't make one a victim.

Seems that doing the right thing regardless is the way to avoid being a victim. The consequences can be harsh and unfair, but the way to avoid being a victim is to say, "screw the consequences".

Read Raffaele's book, and the riff he has on "turning the other cheek." He rejected that "turning the other cheek" was passive acceptance of one's lot. For him he realized it was the purest form of resistance to the evil being done to him. He said with no words, "You will not define me."

 

[katy_did]

I believe that if the CSC panel thought there was the possibility of a finding of guilt on the evidence, they would have sent the case back for a 3rd 2nd-level trial.

Yes, they obviously believed that there was never going to be enough evidence to convict, even if they sent the case back yet again.

 

[katy_did]

The Kerchers lost their wrongful death claim on the merits. That claim is res judicata. It's done.

I suppose they could collaterally attack the judgment for "fraud," but that would be a colossal waste of time and money, and would fail. No Italian court is going to adjudicate the ISC guilty of "fraud".

I think there's about as much chance of the Kerchers taking this any further through the courts as there is of Rudy Guede demanding his case be reopened, i.e. none. My guess is they just want to finally move on (regardless of what the PGP might like to happen!).

 

[sept79]

Posted by "Yummi":


"Sources confirm that the has been a direct intervention from political forces. The ploy was Bruno within the panel, while Marasca tried to resist for several hours.

The interference came from the American Embassy, and the power who enforced it is the Italian Partito Democratico.

The problem was not to embarrass the Democratic candidate at the next presidential elections.

There are two people, one American and one Italian, who worked to the solution, and they are people related to US intelligence. The political interference is similar under some aspects to the Shalabayeva affair, but more extended and complex."


I'm confused. Does this mean that the Masons are off the hook?

 

[Dan O.]

Man, I hate using this tablet to make comments, the spell correcting changes my words.

You can turn that off but the typos can be worse. I preferred the spellcheck without autocorrect so I can learn from my mistakes instead of the computer learning to repeat them.

 

[Diocletus]

More from the Kerchers:

Including..."Mrs Kercher told Italian media that after "eight years of waiting, we now know that we have waited in vain"."

http://www.independent.ie/world-news/europe/we-waited-eight-years-in-vain-say-kerchers-31104156.html

This whole act is getting tiresome.

"Oh, woe is us, we just can't figure out what happened." It's time for the Kerchers to activate their brains and exercise a little self-help.

I do enjoy Arline's Bob Marley reference, though. Who knew.

 

[carbonjam72]

It is what I mean to imply, but it doesn't have the consequence that you think. The institution has failed. But no foreign institution has the moral standing to take its place, nor any foreign institution, people or government is in a position where they can judge the system.

I felt a blow because it's a catastrophe for justice, a national shame, an injustice and an offence comparable to a coup d'etat, and the triumph of a gang of racist bullys; I described those things at PMF. I felt the feeling of being the victim, or maybe the witness, of a violent crime. A bit like witnessing a Gaza bombing or a mafia murder. But I noted no blow to "my analysis". I only noted a tragic failure of institutions, I only noted the violence.

Breathtaking. Mach is the victim here.

 

[toto]

Yes.
I have to admit that I had lost faith in Italian Justice but have to admit that they got the murder decision right in the end.
I found this interesting article that seems to tread the same path, although not as eloquently as the masterpeice by Frank;
http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/article/opportunity-knox-for-italy-bashing/16827]

I enjoyed reading this. I would always have enjoyed going back to Italy having been to Florence and other places. But I have to say it's still nicer to look forward to visiting Rome and Venice knowing there are at least two people not wrongfully imprisoned in the country. I am sure there are some wrongful incarcerations in the UK too.

On a separate note I see Pro innocence people can't post at PMF.net any more on Tuesdays.

 

[carbonjam72]

Why? Sfarzo called this even against many supporters who feared the worst. You, yourself, described that the fix was in, simply by your post-facto observations that some people, pre-facto, seemed to be calm.

To my knowledge, Sfarzo was the only one on either side of this who saw this coming. You do not need a link, and no one is required to provide you proof.

Tell you what - give a link to Stefanoni's Ph.D. and maybe your request can be taken seriously.

Excuse me?

 

[acbytesla]

I think there's about as much chance of the Kerchers taking this any further through the courts as there is of Rudy Guede demanding his case be reopened, i.e. none. My guess is they just want to finally move on (regardless of what the PGP might like to happen!).

Read what their lawyer told them. "They have no further avenues to pursue" Since when does a lawyer turn down potential new fees? He was firing his clients. My guess is that Maresca was always working on a contingency basis and now the pot of gold he pursued at the end of the rainbow had disappeared. His association with this case provided him with exposure that lasted for 8 years, generating clients and fees. Not to mention the chance of cashing in by seizing Raffaele's inheritance. But now Maresca's lottery ticket has disappeared and there is nothing left to be gained...so, he is "outta here"

 

[Diocletus]

On a separate note I see Pro innocence people can't post at PMF.net any more on Tuesdays.

But wait. I was the only one who ever did that.

Michael wasn't prepared for the heat he knew I would bring. What a wussy.

 

[Desert Fox]

Raffaele has just announced that anybody who refers to him as a murderer or even accused, will be sued. Bongiorno has just announced that Judges at previous trials who were 'wrong' will be investigated. With no haste.

Much in my opinion depends on wording of how the person says something. I don't thing being wrong should be a crime.

 

[acbytesla]

You can turn that off but the typos can be worse. I preferred the spellcheck without autocorrect so I can learn from my mistakes instead of the computer learning to repeat them.

It changes words..doesn't really understand contractions or possessive nouns, and corrects proper names. I try and make sure I'm not making mistakes...but inevitably I read a previous post and see sentences that make no sense at all. I keep expecting someone to mock me...but thankfully, most of you are giving me a break.

 

[lonepinealex]

Another edition of Radio 4's The Report covering the case is due for broadcast on Thursday:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00jkr1q

I think this will be a follow up to the previous episode they did (rather than a repeat with amendments), as I got some insider info on this and know the producer was planning to make another one once the ISC had made a decision. I don't think she was expecting this decision, so it will be interesting to hear the new programme! The last one was pretty pro-innocence.

 

[Sergei Walankov]

Machiavelli is pretty keen on criminal sanctions for defamation, as I recall. Perhaps he imagines there should be some sort of "but I know I'm right" defence.

 

[davefoc]

This is interesting. Does Maresca know about this?[that the Kerchers can now bring a civil suit against AK/RS]

...

I saw a quote from Maresca saying he had to explain to the Kerchers that there was no further course of action.

I saw that as well, but perhaps Maresca has not talked to Machiavelli yet.

 

[Kaosium]

Oh, erm, wow. This just in from "Yummi":


Sources confirm that the has been a direct intervention from political forces. The ploy was Bruno within the panel, while Marasca tried to resist for several hours.

The interference came from the American Embassy, and the power who enforced it is the Italian Partito Democratico.

The problem was not to embarrass the Democratic candidate at the next presidential elections.

There are two people, one American and one Italian, who worked to the solution, and they are people related to US intelligence. The political interference is similar under some aspects to the Shalabayeva affair, but more extended and complex.


All I will say by way of comment is that those look like incredibly serious accusations of massive corruption. Not only is it alleged here that the most senior level of the Italian judiciary was susceptible to extreme corruption from other parts of the Italian Government, but also that the Italian Government and US Government were acting in concert to corrupt the Italian Supreme Court in order to meet US Government demands.

I certainly hope that "Yummi" can support these incredible accusations with reliable evidence. I guess we might soon find out...........

If there is anything to that at all, that 'pressure' probably amounted to little more than 'we'll call fraud.'

I still wanna see those EDFs released, dammit. Now that there could be no possible tactical reason for them to keep them concealed, what is keeping them from being released? If Maresca and the Kerchers are serious about questioning the police and Italy about other attackers wouldn't the obvious first step be demanding the release of the entirety of the DNA work so it could be determined if there were other possible suspects?

I'd love to see just one of those reporters ask the Kerchers or Maresca this, perhaps as a follow-up to the question: 'what exactly is the evidence that leads you to conclude there were any other attackers in the first place?'

 

[Numbers]

It changes words..doesn't really understand contractions or possessive nouns, and corrects proper names. I try and make sure I'm not making mistakes...but inevitably I read a previous post and see sentences that make no sense at all. I keep expecting someone to mock me...but thankfully, most of you are giving me a break.

On the contrary. Please point out the sentences that made no sense.

 

[Bill Williams]

Excuse me.

Ok, I'm sorry..... I should have limited the pool of correct-analyzers to those who are the hero of upcoming mediocre Winterbottom films.

When you can post of picture of yourself between Kate Beckinsale and Cara Delevingne, we will start showing you the respect you (obviously) deserve!!!

 

[anglolawyer]

But wait. I was the only one who ever did that.
Michael wasn't prepared for the heat he knew I would bring. What a wussy.

Ohhhh no you weren't. Long before you showed up, Mr Johnny-come-lately, quite a few of us were over there bright and early of a Tuesday morning to cross swords with the enemy. Let's see: me, Rose, geebee2 and others I momentarily forget.