Latest Bigfoot "evidence"

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Even if you have your doubts about Bigfoot, you can get a good grasp of it being an undiscovered primate from the description. You guys are simply nit picking. It's ok, if you need to take my statements apart word by word that's fine, please use a little context when doing so as to avoid confusion though.
Chris B.
Let's clear up the confusion. Undiscovered primate somewhere? Maybe. Undiscovered 9-ft upright primate wandering around NA from sea to shining sea, north to south, undocumented in any sense of that term? No.

And I defy you Chris, or any other knower, habituator, NAWAC-job, urban footie nitwit, or report reader to show otherwise. You cannot, nor can the others.
 
Certainly Bigfoot exists. From infant dragging on their mom's teat to juveniles to full grown adults. I know this because I've seen them. It's not my fault you haven't seen any.

I don't call anyone names for being skeptical, I encourage healthy skepticism. I only disagree with statements such as "impossible".

If you wish to study the psychology of people and Bigfoot perhaps you should start with those individuals who have made up their minds that undiscovered primates are impossible. The ones that believe the reason these creatures are still being sighted must be anything other than the fact that they may actually exist.
Perhaps faulty memory makes those foot prints. Yeah, that's the ticket. :)
Chris B.

1. Based on your past statements, and your interpretations of the pictures that you have presented, I have no reason to believe or disbelieve you. I am not claiming that you are lying by believing that you have seen Bigfoot, but I have no basis of knowing what, in fact, you really did see.

2. I for one am not claiming Bigfoot is impossible. There are scientific reasons to find an existence of Bigfoot difficult to explain. But I am not saying it is impossible. There are a lot of things that are surprising in this world and have been shown to exist. However, Bigfoot has never been shown to exist, despite much effort to do so. So for now I put Bigfoot in the same category as unicorns: difficult to explain scientifically, and without any reason to believe that they exist. But I would be pleasantly excited if either or both were proven. Go to it!
 
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Nothing wrong with being skeptical. Refusing to acknowledge even the possibility of something is not skepticism though, it's denialism.

I acknowledge the possibility for bigfoot to exist (always have). I begin with the premise that there is an extant, continent-wide population of giant, bipedal, intelligent hominins in North America, with additional populations in Asia, Europe, and perhaps even Australia. My premise includes an evolutionary history in which bigfoots and modern humans shared common ancestry more recent than that we share with the extant great apes. Given this starting premise about what bigfoots would most likely be and from whence they came . . .

1)Bigfoot fossils should appear in at least Pleistocene deposits of North America, Asia, Europe, and Australia.

Other than speculation that Gigantopithecus is bigfoot and that its fossils have already been collected and described, #1 = bigfoot fail. Such speculation fails too because no Giganto fossils have been found anywhere but India and Southeast Asia, and not more recent than mid-late-Pleistocene.

2)Unlike other Pleistocene megafauna, bigfoot is supposed to be alive and well right now, in 2015. Thus its remains should appear in Quaternary and even more recent deposits, including to the present day.

No such remains have been found, therefore #2 = bigfoot fail.

3)Bigfoots should have been known to ancient peoples on multiple continents and their parts should have played important roles in religion and mysticism, as other animals did/do.

Not only is there not a single piece of a bigfoot among cultural items of native North Americans, there are no such artifacts among ancient Asians, Europeans, or Australians. The simple fact that Tibetans saw fit to make a shrine to their "yeti" but forge an artifact of it from a takin skin illustrates two important things from the land where bigfoot mythology really got going in the 1950s: a) the ancient cultures would have worshiped such creatures and collected their body parts, and b) there were no such body parts for them to collect. We're now 3 for 3 on bigfoot fails.

4)From the European Colonial Period 'til today (and on three continents), the history of the last several centuries has been one of exploitation of wildlife (and people) at every turn. Bigfoots, yetis, yowies, yeren - all would have been mercilessly hunted for their skins, for sport, or to eradicate something big and scary.

One need look no further than the records of the Hudson's Bay Company to be convinced that there was nothing remotely bigfooty in Canada during this period, and that is just one example. Bigfoot fail #4. No bigfoot has even ever been caught in the crossfire during a war.

5)Human settlement and land use change associated with cutting railroads, logging, mining, agricultural development, etc., was so great during the 19th and 20th centuries, that there was a total flip of forest/open cover in the eastern US from about 70–80% forest to about 20–30%.

Bigfoot fail #5 comes from the fact that habitat changes were so drastic, even deer couldn't survive in the new tamed landscapes. We had to import them from the frontier out West to White-tailed Deer re-established in places like Pennsylvania. Deer couldn't survive this, but bigfoots could?

6)I'm getting tired . . . Scientific collecting - bigfoot fail.
7)Millions of cars, trucks, and railroads but no dead bigfoot - fail.
8)Photography - bigfoot fail.
9)Game camera photography - bigfoot fail.
10) Genomic analysis - bigfoot fail.


Wait wait - hold the phone! Some guy named Chris saw some bigfoots in Kentucky, so 1–10 above are null and void.

Yeah, I know, he claims to see all sorts of crap in some photos that are just pareidolia-infused delusions so he can't provide anything to back up his claims, but he really did super-duper see some bigfoots, mmkay?
 
I acknowledge the possibility for bigfoot to exist (always have). I begin with the premise that there is an extant, continent-wide population of giant, bipedal, intelligent hominins in North America, with additional populations in Asia, Europe, and perhaps even Australia. My premise includes an evolutionary history in which bigfoots and modern humans shared common ancestry more recent than that we share with the extant great apes. Given this starting premise about what bigfoots would most likely be and from whence they came . . .

1)Bigfoot fossils should appear in at least Pleistocene deposits of North America, Asia, Europe, and Australia.

Other than speculation that Gigantopithecus is bigfoot and that its fossils have already been collected and described, #1 = bigfoot fail. Such speculation fails too because no Giganto fossils have been found anywhere but India and Southeast Asia, and not more recent than mid-late-Pleistocene.

2)Unlike other Pleistocene megafauna, bigfoot is supposed to be alive and well right now, in 2015. Thus its remains should appear in Quaternary and even more recent deposits, including to the present day.

No such remains have been found, therefore #2 = bigfoot fail.

3)Bigfoots should have been known to ancient peoples on multiple continents and their parts should have played important roles in religion and mysticism, as other animals did/do.

Not only is there not a single piece of a bigfoot among cultural items of native North Americans, there are no such artifacts among ancient Asians, Europeans, or Australians. The simple fact that Tibetans saw fit to make a shrine to their "yeti" but forge an artifact of it from a takin skin illustrates two important things from the land where bigfoot mythology really got going in the 1950s: a) the ancient cultures would have worshiped such creatures and collected their body parts, and b) there were no such body parts for them to collect. We're now 3 for 3 on bigfoot fails.

4)From the European Colonial Period 'til today (and on three continents), the history of the last several centuries has been one of exploitation of wildlife (and people) at every turn. Bigfoots, yetis, yowies, yeren - all would have been mercilessly hunted for their skins, for sport, or to eradicate something big and scary.

One need look no further than the records of the Hudson's Bay Company to be convinced that there was nothing remotely bigfooty in Canada during this period, and that is just one example. Bigfoot fail #4. No bigfoot has even ever been caught in the crossfire during a war.

5)Human settlement and land use change associated with cutting railroads, logging, mining, agricultural development, etc., was so great during the 19th and 20th centuries, that there was a total flip of forest/open cover in the eastern US from about 70–80% forest to about 20–30%.

Bigfoot fail #5 comes from the fact that habitat changes were so drastic, even deer couldn't survive in the new tamed landscapes. We had to import them from the frontier out West to White-tailed Deer re-established in places like Pennsylvania. Deer couldn't survive this, but bigfoots could?

6)I'm getting tired . . . Scientific collecting - bigfoot fail.
7)Millions of cars, trucks, and railroads but no dead bigfoot - fail.
8)Photography - bigfoot fail.
9)Game camera photography - bigfoot fail.
10) Genomic analysis - bigfoot fail.


Wait wait - hold the phone! Some guy named Chris saw some bigfoots in Kentucky, so 1–10 above are null and void.

Yeah, I know, he claims to see all sorts of crap in some photos that are just pareidolia-infused delusions so he can't provide anything to back up his claims, but he really did super-duper see some bigfoots, mmkay?


Aw heck The Shrike, I got me some HD vidya footage from 15 feet away!! I just aint gonna show it to you! I'll make some some excuse as to why I can't or wont, and it'll never see the like of the skeptics that refuse to be a belieber!!! Trust me. I've seen more Bigfoot creatures than Mountain Lions and Wolves combined here in KY.
 
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Excellent post, as always, Shrike. Too big for a t-shirt, sadly. Those points should be hammered over and over again into the heads of bigfoot enthusiasts. Unfortunately, it would not make much difference probably. With the fence sitters? Possibly.

But for some, " I seen one!!" will always trump any objective observations.
 
I acknowledge the possibility for bigfoot to exist (always have). I begin with the premise that there is an extant, continent-wide population of giant, bipedal, intelligent hominins in North America, with additional populations in Asia, Europe, and perhaps even Australia. My premise includes an evolutionary history in which bigfoots and modern humans shared common ancestry more recent than that we share with the extant great apes. Given this starting premise about what bigfoots would most likely be and from whence they came . . .

This is an excellent way of looking at the Bigfoot mystery. The admission they may possibly exist but a close look by the number at the reasons they shouldn't.

1)Bigfoot fossils should appear in at least Pleistocene deposits of North America, Asia, Europe, and Australia.

Other than speculation that Gigantopithecus is bigfoot and that its fossils have already been collected and described, #1 = bigfoot fail. Such speculation fails too because no Giganto fossils have been found anywhere but India and Southeast Asia, and not more recent than mid-late-Pleistocene.
This is a great argument against Bigfoot. There are no Bigfoot fossils on record. Even if one ties Giganto into the puzzle. Does it stand though? We're not exactly overflowing with Giganto fossils either and we know Giganto existed without doubt. Current count I believe is around 1100 teeth and 3 jaw bones.(last time I checked) Where were the current Giganto fossils on record found? In caves. And not because they lived there. Porcupines seem to get the credit for packing those fossils into these caves to preserve for us. Thank you Mr Porcupine. They couldn't eat the teeth or jaw bones, other than that, they pretty much gobbled up our entire Giganto fossil record. If similar fossils were to be found in North America it's a good bet we'll find them in a cave courtesy of Mr. Porcupine.

Now, location. Giganto seems to be confirmed in India, China and Vietnam. There may be a few other finds since I last looked but basically I agree we have an Asian critter that has yet to be evidenced as moving over to North America. But, just because we haven't got the evidence of the Giganto move to NA, doesn't mean they didn't. I mean heck, we humans made it here from Asia right? Other large animals made it as well. Mr Porcupine seems to be alive and well here.

2)Unlike other Pleistocene megafauna, bigfoot is supposed to be alive and well right now, in 2015. Thus its remains should appear in Quaternary and even more recent deposits, including to the present day.

No such remains have been found, therefore #2 = bigfoot fail.
OK, kinda related to #1. Where are the bones? Again, See Mr Porcupine is one response I can think of. Anything else is also theory and speculation. Bone marrow and calcium content would be major factors considered by other forest animals certainly. It is theorized early man sought out bone marrow in particular. So what do they do with their dead? I wish I knew for certain, but I think the real answer is gonna be considered kinda creepy when we finally have it.

3)Bigfoots should have been known to ancient peoples on multiple continents and their parts should have played important roles in religion and mysticism, as other animals did/do.

Not only is there not a single piece of a bigfoot among cultural items of native North Americans, there are no such artifacts among ancient Asians, Europeans, or Australians. The simple fact that Tibetans saw fit to make a shrine to their "yeti" but forge an artifact of it from a takin skin illustrates two important things from the land where bigfoot mythology really got going in the 1950s: a) the ancient cultures would have worshiped such creatures and collected their body parts, and b) there were no such body parts for them to collect. We're now 3 for 3 on bigfoot fails.

Whoa Nellie. #3 actually argues FOR the presence of Bigfoot in North America. As there are literally bookoo references about creatures fitting the descriptions of Bigfoot in many Native American cultures. Certainly not all match the description of Bigfoot and some of those legends have been stretched to include Bigfoot even when the description is off by leaps and bounds, but there are some that match exactly without doubt.

I think you're taking a view of their beliefs a little far though to include collecting body parts for the sake of worship. I don't think hacking up the hairy man of the forest would have been considered "respectful". And with most of the American Indian legends of similar described creatures the "respect" for them part is usually outlined pretty well.

4)From the European Colonial Period 'til today (and on three continents), the history of the last several centuries has been one of exploitation of wildlife (and people) at every turn. Bigfoots, yetis, yowies, yeren - all would have been mercilessly hunted for their skins, for sport, or to eradicate something big and scary.

One need look no further than the records of the Hudson's Bay Company to be convinced that there was nothing remotely bigfooty in Canada during this period, and that is just one example. Bigfoot fail #4. No bigfoot has even ever been caught in the crossfire during a war.

Early settlers should have bagged old Big and Hairy and brought home a Bigfoot rug. OK, lets explore that. To this day there are numerous accounts of someone shooting Bigfoot. The most common report is they walked or ran away. Let's say just for fun 99% of those stories are made up falsities. What would the early settlers have been using as firearms? I mean there certainly were 50 and larger caliber weapons used for bear and buffalo, but with some research I think you'll find the most common caliber was a .32 round ball. Not exactly a good choice for Bigfoot bagging.

5)Human settlement and land use change associated with cutting railroads, logging, mining, agricultural development, etc., was so great during the 19th and 20th centuries, that there was a total flip of forest/open cover in the eastern US from about 70–80% forest to about 20–30%.

Bigfoot fail #5 comes from the fact that habitat changes were so drastic, even deer couldn't survive in the new tamed landscapes. We had to import them from the frontier out West to White-tailed Deer re-established in places like Pennsylvania. Deer couldn't survive this, but bigfoots could?

Deer are not exactly thinking reasoning beings. I think you'll find there were plenty of animals that escaped this period of taming the land as well, here and in other areas around the World. If we speculate Bigfoot may live a Nomadic existence, the theory of "we should have found them while we were taming the land" goes out the window. There are many reports of these creatures especially by loggers. So undoubtedly we had some impact on their habitat, but not enough to wipe them out.

6)I'm getting tired . . . Scientific collecting - bigfoot fail.
Me too. It is very annoying for example that the recent Ketchum DNA study was flubbed. However, after speaking with Ben Radford on the DNA issue. I'm convinced skeptics would still not accept a good DNA finding without a type subject for comparison. Hurry up and wait seems to be the norm until that day arrives of a Bigfoot body or part being collected.

7)Millions of cars, trucks, and railroads but no dead bigfoot - fail.
Yes, it would appear that even when Bigfoot crosses the road rarely, he looks both ways before crossing. I've never been hit by a car either using this method. I feel if everyone used this method, we wouldn't have pedestrian fatalities.

8)Photography - bigfoot fail.
I agree and with the introduction of photo editing software even a good pic will be suspect of foul play.

9)Game camera photography - bigfoot fail.
Not surprising. Remember , we're dealing with a thinking reasoning creature aware of its surroundings. If someone placed a game cam in your living room, I bet you'd know it was there.

10) Genomic analysis - bigfoot fail.
Well not necessarily. Sykes didn't test any Bigfoot samples, only samples that were thought to have been Bigfoot. Common collection error. Samples were presented that were not valid. I myself posses DNA samples that are possibly collected from a Bigfoot but since I didn't actually see the creature leave the sample, it is still an unknown and therefore unworthy of testing at this time.

Some of Ketchum's samples may be up for another review. I think some of the guys that submitted samples to her were unhappy with her approach and have since started another project. Time will tell.

Wait wait - hold the phone! Some guy named Chris saw some bigfoots in Kentucky, so 1–10 above are null and void.

Yeah, I know, he claims to see all sorts of crap in some photos that are just pareidolia-infused delusions so he can't provide anything to back up his claims, but he really did super-duper see some bigfoots, mmkay?

Well, my claim as a witness has little to do with your personal opinion on whether Bigfoot exists or not. I don't blame you because I was very much of the same opinion. Bigfoot was a curiosity more than anything else up until I had an unexplained happening that preceded a full blown sighting. I don't expect you to feel any differently.

I agree my pics are terrible and should have never been released. I also released the hillside video which is of terrible quality. I maintain there is specific movement that can be seen in the video. Some maintain there is none. Some started out saying the subjects were "boulders", then when they saw movement quickly switched over to the theory of "bears" in the video.
How's that for delusion. It's too ambiguous to tell either way, I agree.
Chris B.
 
Changed my quote.

That's one way of looking at it. Another would be even if we only nick the ball, we win the World Series without any further effort.
Chris B.

This is a perfect example of footer logic.... FOUL BALL!
 
Chris, I know you have trouble with pareidolia. Today, you've provided a textbook example of special pleading.

Of course, I correctly predicted that you would do just that so I've demonstrated clairvoyance!

You made a post, I responded. Now you quickly switch to the need to analyze my psychi? Is that really the best response you can come up with?

How about those porcupines? Maybe they don't exist either?
Chris B.
 
I told you guys months ago, that you are just giving him more gaps to put Bigfoot into.

He is a Bigfoot Gapper, looking to rationalize his belief, if you give him arguments against Bigfoot, it allows him to add attributes to Bigfoot to fill those gaps.

He is playing a game, and the game changes with every argument you put forth.
 
This is a great argument against Bigfoot.

Actually it's a pretty much airtight argument against Figboot.

There are no Bigfoot fossils on record.

Yes. Because animals that don't exist tend not to leave fossils.

Even if one ties Giganto into the puzzle.

Yes even if you associate the creature that doesn't exist with a creature the used to exist places other than where you are claiming the creature that doesn't exist is.

Does it stand though?

Yes. It stands much higher, stronger, and more stable then your argument.

We're not exactly overflowing with Giganto fossils either and we know Giganto existed without doubt.

Well yeah because... well as you said yet completely missed the point of all it takes is one good fossil. One good fossil that we don't have for Figboot. Because Figboot doesn't exist.

Current count I believe is around 1100 teeth and 3 jaw bones.(last time I checked).

Which, let double check my math here, exactly 1103 pieces of evidence more than anything we have for Figboot.

Where were the current Giganto fossils on record found? In caves. And not because they lived there. Porcupines seem to get the credit for packing those fossils into these caves to preserve for us. Thank you Mr Porcupine.

So Porcupines are eating up the Figboots?

They couldn't eat the teeth or jaw bones, other than that, they pretty much gobbled up our entire Giganto fossil record. If similar fossils were to be found in North America it's a good bet we'll find them in a cave courtesy of Mr. Porcupine.

Right. Except for... everything you said sure.

Now, location. Giganto seems to be confirmed in India, China and Vietnam.

Yes. Gigantopithicus has been confirmed in the places where it lived.

But, just because we haven't got the evidence of the Giganto move to NA, doesn't mean they didn't.

Okay even by BLAARGING/Trolling standards this is getting absurd. You can't keep playing the "You can't provide counter evidence to the 0 evidence I have provided" game.

A list of excuses isn't an argument. Or a counter argument. Or anything.

I mean heck, we humans made it here from Asia right? Other large animals made it as well. Mr Porcupine seems to be alive and well here.

Yes and all those animals left evidence that moved here.

OK, kinda related to #1. Where are the bones? Again, See Mr Porcupine is one response I can think of. Anything else is also theory and speculation. Bone marrow and calcium content would be major factors considered by other forest animals certainly. It is theorized early man sought out bone marrow in particular. So what do they do with their dead? I wish I knew for certain, but I think the real answer is gonna be considered kinda creepy when we finally have it.

Or, and stay with me because this gets complicated... they are no bones because they are no flippin' Figboots. That's a much more logical then "Figboots exists, here's 30 gazillion excuses why I can't can give you any evidence at all..."

As there are literally bookoo references about creatures fitting the descriptions of Bigfoot in many Native American cultures. Certainly not all match the description of Bigfoot and some of those legends have been stretched to include Bigfoot even when the description is off by leaps and bounds, but there are some that match exactly without doubt.

There's "bookoo" references to creatures fitting the descriptions of dragons across cultures all over the world.

I think you're taking a view of their beliefs a little far though to include collecting body parts for the sake of worship. I don't think hacking up the hairy man of the forest would have been considered "respectful".

And yet again another wonderfully convenient excuses as to why there is no evidence.
 
You made a post, I responded. Now you quickly switch to the need to analyze my psychi? Is that really the best response you can come up with?

How about those porcupines? Maybe they don't exist either?
Chris B.


I have wintnessed your ability to misintepet what your seeing first hand.
 
Am I understanding this nonsense correctly?
The magic monkey man can't be found because of porcupines?
I don't know the depth of your understanding or study of the subject. If you are inquiring if porcupines ate up almost the entire fossil record for Giganto, then yes that would be correct. The only pieces we have of Giganto are some teeth and 3 jaw bones.

I told you guys months ago, that you are just giving him more gaps to put Bigfoot into.

He is a Bigfoot Gapper, looking to rationalize his belief, if you give him arguments against Bigfoot, it allows him to add attributes to Bigfoot to fill those gaps.

He is playing a game, and the game changes with every argument you put forth.

I'm just pointing out the obvious. There really should be no need for concern if you're looking at the argument against Bigfoot with some common sense.

Where are the Bigfoot bones? Possibly the same place as the Giganto bones. Broken down in the bowel movements of porcupines. Chris B.
 
Oh dear. Should I laugh or cry?
Chris, my depth of understanding?
Study of the subject?

I've opted to laugh.
You can't study something that doesn't exist!
 
How about those porcupines? Maybe they don't exist either?
Chris B.

If I take the time to address your ridiculous porcupine* assertion (a contradiction itself in that you offered porcupines as crucial to us finding Gigantopithecus fossils), I have no assurance that you will do anything with the information I provide other than concoct another special plead.

The issue is not (necessarily) your psychi [sic], it's that you either fall prey to logical fallacies at every turn or you intentionally incorporate them into your BLAARG-time.


*"Porcupines occur today throughout the Canadian and Hudsonian lifezones of North America and their fossil remains are common constituents of Pleistocene cave and fissure deposits in both the eastern (e.g., Guilday et al., 1977, 1978) and western (e.g., Anderson, 1968; Kurten and Anderson, 1972) United States."

Porcupines couldn't even finish all the porcupine bones around them. Certainly a few bigfoot pieces should have been buried before the toothy ones gnawed them away.

Also, if Giganto teeth and jaws survived porcupines, why not bigfoot? Are bigfoots really lampreys now?

C'mon, Chris.
 
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