3point14
Pi
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2005
- Messages
- 23,073
Prince Andrew (Allegations of Famous People Engaged in Bad Sex Part 57)
anglolawyer
Banned
Just combine them.
FromBelgiumWithLove
Unregistered
They already tried that. But Butler and Sloss just couldn't work together.
Such judgement would have to be withdrawn on the occasion of his unmarrying Fergie. So we're back where we started.
Information Analyst
Penultimate Amazing
The British press have now named HRH's accuser, which in the process confirms that she was 17 when they met. Since she is claiming that she had sex with him in London, the US, and the Caribbean, that means that she wasn't underage in at least one jurisdiction.
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But what about the alleged prostitution part? Lets say that, hypothetically, she was paid in cash by someone else to have sex with the Andrew. Would that be legal according to British law?
What if instead of being paid directly in cash she was given a fancy room, a comfy bed, tasty food, any clothes she'd ask for and pocket money implicitly in return for her being available sexually for him and his guests? In a sense that seems close to many types of gold-diggers who are only married to or in a relationship with someone because they can provide for them, although since she was 17 years old and thus legally a minor i guess the situation might be different.
ComfySlippers
Banned
angrysoba
Philosophile
In the video, the woman from the BBC then says that Jane Doe is alleging Dershowitz is trying to silence her. He says, "I'm doing the opposite. I want her to speak. Under oath!"
Time to get some popcorn.
I was aware that prostitution isn't illegal but plenty of countries treat purchasing sex from minors, whether or not they are over the so called "age of consent", as a special case compared to if one purchased sex from legal adults.
Evidently if prostitution is a form of violence against women comparable to sexual abuse then paying someone under the age of 18 is at least doubly abusive/exploitative.
FromBelgiumWithLove
Unregistered
It's completely hopeless. I just noticed that both the Guardian and the Independent refer to Jeffrey Epstein as a "convicted paedophile", I didn't check any other papers. Nevermind that there is no crime of "p(a)edophilia" of which one can be convicted anywhere in the world, AFAIK. Nevermind that the man was convicted on a single charge of sollicitation of prostitution involving someone under 18, but above the age of consent in Britain. According to British newspapers that are considered to be "quality", he's still a pedophile, despite the fact that not even a single accustion linking him with pedophilia has ever been made (again, AFAIK).
I also notice that in a lot of media, "sex offender" and "pedophile" seem to have become completely intertwined, if not synonymous. So that even simply describing someone as a "convicted sex offender" (which Jeffrey Epstein is) will trigger the "pedophile" idea in many readers' minds.
anglolawyer
Banned
World exclusive in the Daily Mail.
Not to mention it was in a plea bargain, something which I find deeply suspicious on principle.
On a skeptically related note, Epstein is also friends with Lawrence Krauss, and some people tried to orchestrate a walk-out at TAM a couple of years back when Krauss was speaking (I didn't notice anyone actually taking part).
These are lurid accusations, but they don't include people being strangled to death in public during gay pedophile orgies in front of casual witnesses in the course of political party conferences, so the allegations are not completely incredible.
As far as I am aware if you are over the age of 16 in the UK* there is no minor/adult** confusion in regards to prostitution.
*Not too sure about NI - their "sex" laws tend to be slightly behind the rest of the UK.
**There is a wrinkle and that is if one of the people concerned is between 16 and 18 and the other is over 18 and in a position of authority/trust/guardianship over the 16-18 year old.
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Carnivore
Salad Dodger
I could well be wrong but I was under the impression that there was an age restriction on "adult work" in the UK, ie that you had to be at least 18 to work in fields like prostitution or porn?
FromBelgiumWithLove
Unregistered
The relevant bit of legislation would appear to be this: section 47 of the Sexual Offences Act 2003.
It's an offence to hire a prostitute under 18 years old, except if the offender had a reasonable belief they were over 18.
ETA: I think the "reasonable belief" condition may have been added to prevent the not at all hypothetical abuse of such an offence for blackmail purposes. There have been documented cases outside the UK I can think of where men were lured to sexual encounters with people they met online, believing them to be just over the magical age, to then become the subject of blackmail or robbery when an underage person pops up when meeting in person (this person not operating on their own, but as part of a scheme, and of course not necessarily the person who was communicating online).
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anglolawyer
Banned
It looks more like standard penal drafting to me. If anything, it's a bit tough on the defendant who honestly but unreasonably believes the victim is of age.
anglolawyer
Banned
Dershowitz
Keep a mental note of this.
Keep a mental note of this.
Information Analyst
Penultimate Amazing
I've often wondered whether Jimmy Savile's personal and work diaries were ever consulted apropos the allegations against him. Certainly in relation to the various reports by hospitals, there's no mention of any corroborately use of them. There are numerous assertions that no record exists of Savile being in specific locations at specfic times as far as the hospitals are concerned, and surely the diaries would clarify whther he was or not.
In the case of the allegations against HRH, I can't help thinking that the accusaions have been specifically constructed around the sole photo of him with his accuser, as well as the third party she also implicates.
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