'What about building 7'?

[JayUtah]

Seems like that reply by MM was just a cheezy dodge (again).

That's how I and most others seem to be interpreting it. I predict therefore MM's absence from the thread a while longer, followed by a fringe reset.

 

[jaydeehess]

Originally Posted by Miragememories View Post
.

Had there been a progressive total vertical failure, the building would have tilted and fallen towards the side that initially started failing (presumably the east side).

Clearly this did not happen

!



The first visible result of the collapse is a failure that results in the EPH falling in. This very much suggests that column 79 failed.
What happens subsequent to that is the development of the 'kink' in the north facade and the tilting of the sections east and west of that line towards this initial line of failure.
In addition, at about the same time as the tilting towards a column 79 line of failure, the rooftop structures west of the EPH then begin falling in. This highly suggests a progression of core failure. The section of the building west of the kink then falls to the south, suggesting a tilt in that direction, ie. towards the core failure.

There, I removed the part that could have been considered pompous.

Now MM can respond. Perhaps he will agree that the collapse sequence as observed, is in fact consistent with the first vertical, then horizontal, progression postulated by NIST.

I mean, anything is possible, right?

 

[Spanx]

Now MM can respond

If he is lucky enough to be able to log on ?

 

[Miragememories]

I've been away. Time for some catch up.

Jennings at the NE corner?

The video shows people standing at the corner of WTC7 talking to Hess or Jennings.

To the right is another building,, the Verizon.

If the camera were looking south at the NE corner the other building, the P.O., would be on the left.

These people and the camera are also just out from the vehicle ramp which is at the NW of WTC7.

You ask why I showed the SE corner of WTC7.

Standing at the SE corner and looking at #7 you would have the post office to the right but the video of him at the window cannot be at the SE corner because there's no ramp there and it would have the remains of the walkway.

Obviously they werent at the SW corner since that was gouged out.

Now you say they were at the NE corner.

I show thats wrong but.........My whole point is that no one can see the towers from any window on the north face.

I ALWAYS said the NE corner. You are the one living in a confused state.

They were at the NE corner of the 8th floor of WTC7. Michael Hess is calling for help from the 8th floor NE corner room as shown below.

NIST Figure 5-115

As I said, the NE corner.

Obviously WTC1 and WTC2 could not be viewed from north side of WTC7 if a person turned their back to them and looked north.

Since it is a safe assumption that Barry Jennings knew where WTC1 and WTC2 were located, he could have easily confirmed they were standing in a number of ways.

WTC2 can be seen by looking out from any broken window on the east side of WTC7 (Barry broke several windows).

The 8th floor was dark with no lighting making the outside bright and viewable via the surrounding windows.

Both WTC1 and WTC2 could be confirmed to be still standing by simply looking towards any south facing WTC7 window.

Each tower's collapse impacted and shrouded WTC7 with a powerful dust cloud (pics if you need them) which would be impossible to ignore.

When Barry finally got home later that day, he said he remained glued to the TV where he had to have observed repeated coverage of the collapses as well as the later WTC7 collapse.

He observed no timeline contradiction between the documented video of the collapses and what he actually experienced.

"I'd like to say that..um..my mind is still there, you know..that day I'll never forget..and the explanations that were given to me were totally unacceptable.

Totally unacceptable.

Because as I said, I was there. I lived it.

I lived through it.

Actually, I thought I was going to die that day...

And at that time, I told Mike "Mike, you better get under the desk and pray to who you gonna pray to, because I'm gonna pray to who I'm gonna pray to, because it doesn't look like we're gonna make it."

If WTC1 and WTC2 had supposedly already collapsed, what further event would drive someone under a desk and pray?

 

[carlitos]

Though MM didn't bother to include a link, the Jennings interview can be found here.

 

[DGM]

Barry Jennings was consumed by such limited activity and that at no time was he informed by police or security about the second impact and the obvious WTC7 early evacuations.

He was a ID carrying official along with another (Hess). Has it ever occurred to you these people assumed he already knew? I can picture them flashing ID and telling security what they want them to do. Security was probably hoping they would tell them what's going on.

After the "explosion", why would he look outside to see if the towers were still there? Why would he think they wouldn't be?

His time-line is wrong. None of your twisting can change that.

 

[jaydeehess]

Did MM ever address the fact that WTC7 did behave as he says it should have?

MM?

The video contains many stop/start of recording ( perhaps edits in post but it looks like raw video). Yes, the Fitterman is seen in one of these clips but starting at about 1:50 we see Hess at the window, camera pans fast down to street level and we see the vehicle ramp and, still with no cut in the video, we then see the corner of WTC7 in such location as to indicate that this is at the NW corner, not the NE.

That is consistent with Hess saying he was looking north and west. It is consistent with the two of them being in the west stairwell, near the location of the SW corner destruction.
Hess says no explosion. He says the stairwell was dusty/smokey THEN the lights went out and the building shook for about ten seconds and the stairwell filled with a great deal more dust and or smoke, all of which I indicates that this problem in the stairwell occurred when WTC1 fell. Of course in the video the street is full of dust and papers, cars are on fire in the clips preceding the final one Hess at the window at 1:50.

I've been away. Time for some catch up.



I ALWAYS said the NE corner. You are the one living in a confused state.

They were at the NE corner of the 8th floor of WTC7. Michael Hess is calling for help from the 8th floor NE corner room as shown below.

[qimg]http://i1265.photobucket.com/albums/jj515/Miragememories/HessatNECornerWTC7_zps4034ca11.png[/qimg]

[qimg]http://i1265.photobucket.com/albums/jj515/Miragememories/Picture1-EastSideviewedfromNEcorner_zps8d2bd2df.png[/qimg]
NIST Figure 5-115

As I said, the NE corner.

What in that picture indicates NE corner? I included my reasoning for NW corner taking the nonstop video clip beginning at about 1:50 in the raw video.
Facing south and looking at the north side of the building, west is to the right. When the camera pans down and to the right we see the corner of WTC7 and another building to the right - west of WTC 7.
In addition, before it pans to the corner of the building we see quite plainly, the vehicle ramp, which was located in the NW of the building.

 

[Africanus]

Not in the interview I watched;

Well, it seems that you watches a different video, as the jennings interview conducted at 9/11/2001 is a part of the LC-Interview. And he states, that he broke out one window, in this interview.

 

[Africanus]

Obviously WTC1 and WTC2 could not be viewed from north side of WTC7 if a person turned their back to them and looked north.

Since it is a safe assumption that Barry Jennings knew where WTC1 and WTC2 were located, he could have easily confirmed they were standing in a number of ways.

WTC2 can be seen by looking out from any broken window on the east side of WTC7 (Barry broke several windows).

There was only one window broken out, the window in the NE corner, where Hess was calling for help.

Both WTC1 and WTC2 could be confirmed to be still standing by simply looking towards any south facing WTC7 window.

Barry Jennings stated in the Loose Change interview that he was trapped at the north side of WTC 7:

I said "I'm on the north side of the building." Because when I was on the stairs I saw "NORTH SIDE".

He also says, that he didn't know when the towers fell:

"When they started running the first tower was coming down. I had no I had no way of knowing that. Then I saw them come back. Now I saw them come back with more concern on their faces."

Each tower's collapse impacted and shrouded WTC7 with a powerful dust cloud (pics if you need them) which would be impossible to ignore.

It is quite interesting, that Jennings didn't mention a dust cloud in the LC interview!

 

[Africanus]

What in that picture indicates NE corner? I included my reasoning for NW corner taking the nonstop video clip beginning at about 1:50 in the raw video.
Facing south and looking at the north side of the building, west is to the right. When the camera pans down and to the right we see the corner of WTC7 and another building to the right - west of WTC 7.
In addition, before it pans to the corner of the building we see quite plainly, the vehicle ramp, which was located in the NW of the building.

jaydeehess, MM is right, the picture shows the NE corner of WTC 7! This is proven by figure 5-143 of the NCSTAR 1-9, which shows the NE corner of WTC 7. I think it can easily be seen that this picture matches figure 5-115 that was referenced by MM.

 

[jaydeehess]

jaydeehess, MM is right, the picture shows the NE corner of WTC 7! This is proven by figure 5-143 of the NCSTAR 1-9, which shows the NE corner of WTC 7. I think it can easily be seen that this picture matches figure 5-115 that was referenced by MM.

I am going by the video of Hess at the window. In that video the camera is at the NW corner beginning at about 1:50. It shows him at the window then pans down and right to show the vehicle ramp and NW corner. It also shows men shouting up to Hess from just in front of the camera. There ia no suggestion that Hess is a couple hundred feet away at the east end of the building.

 

[TJM]

WTC2 can be seen by looking out from any broken window on the east side of WTC7 (Barry broke several windows).

Yeah, looks like ol' Barry went to town on that east side. I mean lookit all them smashed windows. He had to have some kind of help, I think. That pole that saved his life? I wonder if he took it with him and used it to bust all that glass.

 

[Miragememories]

jaydeehess, MM is right, the picture shows the NE corner of WTC 7! This is proven by figure 5-143 of the NCSTAR 1-9, which shows the NE corner of WTC 7. I think it can easily be seen that this picture matches figure 5-115 that was referenced by MM.

I am going by the video of Hess at the window.

In that video the camera is at the NW corner beginning at about 1:50.

It shows him at the window then pans down and right to show the vehicle ramp and NW corner.

It also shows men shouting up to Hess from just in front of the camera.

There ia no suggestion that Hess is a couple hundred feet away at the east end of the building.

Time to man up and admit you are wrong jaydeehess!

The camera angle is totally wrong to place Hess's location at the NW corner of WTC7.

The shot you are using is initially looking south at the base of the WTC7 NE corner. If it was the SW corner as you stubbornly insist, the corner would have been on the right.

The camera tilts up and starts a zoom in on Hess in the 8th floor window.

The camera operator then does an in camera edit to a close up of Hess.

 

[TJM]

Time to man up and admit you are wrong <snip>

:facepalm:

Nothing to say about the smashed glass? If you look at the fourth broken window it looks like you get a glimpse of Barry's cape.

 

[Miragememories]

Obviously WTC1 and WTC2 could not be viewed from north side of WTC7 if a person turned their back to them and looked north.

Since it is a safe assumption that Barry Jennings knew where WTC1 and WTC2 were located, he could have easily confirmed they were standing in a number of ways.

WTC2 can be seen by looking out from any broken window on the east side of WTC7 (Barry broke several windows).

The 8th floor was dark with no lighting making the outside bright and viewable via the surrounding windows.

There was only one window broken out, the window in the NE corner, where Hess was calling for help.

In an earlier quick News interview, Barry said he busted out a window. He did not say that he busted only one window. The LC interview with Barry Jennings, from which I quoted, was longer and allowed for more details.

There are only photos showing the broken window from which Hess was calling for help.

The lack of complete photo coverage of the 8th floor windows means you have no evidence that disproves what Barry Jennings claimed he did. There was no obvious motive for Barry to lie about his actions.

"I asked Mr. Hess to test the phones as I took a fire extinguisher and broke out the windows.
Once I broke out the windows, ..."

Barry Jennings stated in the Loose Change interview that he was trapped at the north side of WTC 7:

No that is not what he said.

When their exit was aborted by the demolished 6th floor stairwell landing, they retreated to the 8th floor.

They were trapped in WTC7 as a result. They made their way from the stairwell. Obviously they were not confined to that NE corner office.

N
W+E
S

He also says, that he didn't know when the towers fell:

When?

He didn't give a time from his watch but he clearly understood when each collapse occurred.

"I was trapped in there for several hours.
I was trapped in there when both buildings came down.
um.
The firefighters came.
They came to the window.
And they..
Because I was going to come out on the firehose.
I didn't want to stay any longer
It was too hot.
I was gonna come out on the firehose.
They came--to the window and they said
They started yelling "do not do that..it won't hold you."
And then they ran away.
See, I didn't know what was going on.
That's when one..the first tower fell.
"When they started running..the first tower was coming down.
I had no..I had no way of knowing that.
Then I saw them come back.
Now I saw them come back with more concern on their faces.
And then they ran away again.
The second tower fell.
So as they turned and ran the second time,
the guy said "don't worry we'll be back for you.
And they did come back.
This time they came back with 10 firefighters."

It is quite interesting, that Jennings didn't mention a dust cloud in the LC interview!

Should he have?

Stating the obvious I guess never occurred to him. People in the vicinity of the WTC collapses kinda just knew when those 110 storey towers collapsed.

 

[swright777]

Thank you Miragememories for your well researched knowledge.

I wasn't allowed to add any more dogs. The limit for images in a post is 30. There should be many more.

 

[Spanx]

where is this thread headed ?

Is MM going to provide any evidence of the inside job or is this just a distraction to help us forget that realtruthseeker is going to prove 911 was an inside job ?

 

[DGM]

In an earlier quick News interview,

"I was trapped in there for several hours. I was trapped in there when both buildings came down. um.The firefighters came.
They came to the window.
And they..
Because I was going to come out on the firehose.
I didn't want to stay any longer
It was too hot.
I was gonna come out on the firehose.
They came--to the window and they said
They started yelling "do not do that..it won't hold you."
And then they ran away.
See, I didn't know what was going on.
That's when one..the first tower fell.
"When they started running..the first tower was coming down. I had no..I had no way of knowing that.Then I saw them come back.
Now I saw them come back with more concern on their faces.
And then they ran away again.
The second tower fell.So as they turned and ran the second time,
the guy said "don't worry we'll be back for you.
And they did come back.
This time they came back with 10 firefighters."

Using this testimony. What time did he arrive and what time did the "explosion" take out the stairway?

This should be fun watching you try to make it fit.

 

[LSSBB]

where is this thread headed ?

Is MM going to provide any evidence of the inside job or is this just a distraction to help us forget that realtruthseeker is going to prove 911 was an inside job ?

He's busy running away from his free fall fail by dwelling in Barry Jennings minutae. He can get more mileage out of interview finger pointing and drag things on a while.

You know how it is. No progress...

 

[Spanx]

He's busy running away from his free fall fail by dwelling in Barry Jennings minutae. He can get more mileage out of interview finger pointing and drag things on a while.

You know how it is. No progress...

Yep, it's just like looking for loose change down the back of your sofa, you hope you will find a big fat wallet full of fresh notes but you know you haven't lost one.