• Security incident: ISF was recently accessed by intruders. Please change your password, and change it anywhere else you used it. Read more

Continuation Part Nine: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

Status
Not open for further replies.
While I agree with the essence of your post DF. I do tend to think that perspective matters.

For example, my father use to say the difference between a recession and a depression is that it's "a recession" when your neighbor loses his job and "a depression" is when you lose yours!!

The thing is that while the Italian court at least pretends to be in the modern world, Amanda would be executed in Taliban court for being a non believer as well as having sex out of marriage.
 
The thing is that while the Italian court at least pretends to be in the modern world, Amanda would be executed in Taliban court for being a non believer as well as having sex out of marriage.

This is true. I'm not really comparing the two. Just that what Amanda had to endure was not good. If you read her book, she talks about the women who committed suicide at the prison and the different methods they used and how she contemplated committing suicide herself.

I was in jail once from a Thursday afternoon to a Tuesday afternoon. It was one of the worst experiences in my life if not the worst. I don't think I actually slept for the first 3 days I was there. I can't imagine spending 4 years behind bars with the prospect of spending 25 more.
 
This is true. I'm not really comparing the two. Just that what Amanda had to endure was not good. If you read her book, she talks about the women who committed suicide at the prison and the different methods they used and how she contemplated committing suicide herself.

I was in jail once from a Thursday afternoon to a Tuesday afternoon. It was one of the worst experiences in my life if not the worst. I don't think I actually slept for the first 3 days I was there. I can't imagine spending 4 years behind bars with the prospect of spending 25 more.

I may have misunderstood what she wrote in her book but seems like there is a lack of institution in Italian prison. You don't have uniforms but instead are given discarded clothing. As well, sounds like yu have to cook your own food.

I can understand being suicidal in prison. I am a bit of a loner so if I had something to read, I could likely survive. Not as if I would not have thoughts of suicide as well though.
 
I may have misunderstood what she wrote in her book but seems like there is a lack of institution in Italian prison. You don't have uniforms but instead are given discarded clothing. As well, sounds like yu have to cook your own food.

I can understand being suicidal in prison. I am a bit of a loner so if I had something to read, I could likely survive. Not as if I would not have thoughts of suicide as well though.

I can relate DF. I'm the same way. Amanda actually talks about how much she read while she was there. The cooking their own food sound strange and seems as if it introduces potentially more weapons to the prison.
 
Are the 2 Blonde Hairs mentioned in the Crime Scene video?

It was Maresca, the Kercher family's attorney, who showed the victim's body to an unsuspecting audience. He did it to inflame the proceding so as to help obtain a guilty verdict, which is a precondition essential to his suit on behalf of the Kerchers for large monetary damages. Maresca presumably will earn a significant fee from any monetary damages actually collected.

RWVBWL recently used a silhouetted image of the murder victim as an avatar to get us readers to focus on what he believes are two blond human hairs photographed with the body. (He used it as avatar, unpleasant as it is, because he believes it is important evidence that has been overlooked.) The silhouetted image RWVBWL used shows the location of one of the possible hairs near the victim's crotch area. RWVBWL included in his corresponding comment a close-up forensic photo showing the second possible human hair in the victim's grasp.

RWVBWL wants to know what happened to the two possible human hairs. Were they collected as evidence or ignored and lost? If collected, we're they analyzed to determine if they are in fact human hairs and to whom do they belong?

I agree with RWVBWL that they are probably human hair - not because of known analysis, but because of the fact that they were found in two strategic locations (victim's grasp and crotch area), they appear long, somewhat curly, and blond. It is unscientific of me, but I believe that if they were clothing fibers or duvet or pillow fibers the fibers would be shorter - unless her duvet was filled with blond, curly, horsehair (think horse, not camel. :p. )

The hairs were photographed in the initial close-up forensic photos of the victim. I believe they were subsequently overlooked/not collected/lost when the authorities collected the body from the floor hours later. (think " incompetence", not "deliberate scheming")

Remember the video recording which shows and audio-recorded Stefanoni standing outside the cottage talking on her cell phone to Alyssa (sp?), her lab assistant? Stefanoni is heard telling her assistant of the work tasks to be done the next day - she mentioned test for semen. Stefanoni did not mention the need to also test hair collected at the scene. (She overlooked them. It is more evidence of her shoddy work habits; she is unfit to serve as a crime scene lab tech - let alone a forensic scientist.)


Greetings Strozzi,
Nice post! You stated it better than I could.

Thanks folks for the discussion about my avatar, it did what I thought it would, get some folks to discuss the blonde hairs found, without having to upload the image as a larger photo, which was done here before.

That crime scene video seen on YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlXKyMh48KQ&app=desktop
that has Dr. Stefanoni telling her lab assistant Alessa to test the seminal fluid, err presumed seminal fluid, on the 2nd day of the investigation into Miss Kercher's brutal murder, was an eye opener, for it raises some questions.

I have an old copy of Barbie Nadeau's book Angel Face,
and have quoted from it over the years here.

As Nadeau speaks Italian and apparently developed a relationship with PM Mignini's prosecution,
Nadeau states in her Notes on the Sources chapter that she viewed roughly 10 hours of video taken during the crime scene investigation.

10 hours!

Now I can understand how she quoted Dr Stefanoni sometimes in Angel Face.

For watching crime scene footage I too can hear and read the translation of Dr. Stefanoni
discussing testing the seminal fluid found between Miss Kercher's legs and also near her left up-raised arm.

Please allow me to share with you a few interesting passages from this Italian speaking writer
who viewed roughly 10 hours of crime scene video. Pages 46-49 Angel Face:

ERT experts arrived from Rome that afternoon and a still photographer documented their painstaking collection of evidence throughout the house. On the soundtrack to the video, investigators can be heard discussing the evidence and swapping hypotheses about the crime. Patrizia Stefanoni, a biologist with the ERT, personally collected many of the samples she would later test in her pristine lab in Rome. Dressed in a white jumpsuit, she picked up Meredith's bloodied bra from the floor by the tiny elastic band between the cups.

"This was cut right off her body," Stefanoni said, shaking her head.
"Imagine. And look, we're missing a piece of the bra clasp."

The police collected the lacy black underwear that was rolled up at Meredith's feet and checked the button and zipper of her blue jeans, but failed to find any evidence that these had been forcibly stripped off her body. They then lifted the comforter to look at Meredith's slender body, nude except for the blood-soaked long sleeved white t-shirt that was pushed up over her small breasts. Her skin was purple and red with bruises, and her chest showed the outline in small droplets of blood where her bra had been. Meredith's right leg was bent slightly, and her left leg straight. She had recently had a Brazilian - her pubic hair completely waxed. There were more bruises on her hips, knees and thighs. But her face was still beautiful, her lips slightly parted in a Mona Lisa smile.

An examination of her vagina revealed a hair that the police removed and put in a plastic bag.
"It's blonde," Stefanoni said, directing the collection officer to note that the hair was not Meredith's. Police also noted the evidence of recent sexual contact, both vaginal and anal, but no blood or internal tears that would suggest rape - thus the theory of a sex game was formed. Multiple autopsies would later fail to prove sexual assault, while at least one autopsy suggested that the sexual assault took place post mortem.

On a pillow that had been shoved under Meredith's hips, police found both a bloody shoe print
and 2 spots that might have been dried semen.
<snip>
Meredith's left arm was bent and her blood-smeared hand was still suspended in the air near her face. The tip of her long, thin index finger was soaked in blood as if she had touched her neck. But Meredith's right hand showed not even a drop of blood except from tiny cuts on the palm of her hand - it had not been near her face or neck when she was stabbed, but the detectives determined that she had extended it in self defence. The twin bruised and identical pressure points on the insides of her elbows were consistant with her arms being hed back.

"It's blonde," the scientific officer said as he pulled a long hair from Meredith's blood soaked hand.



"She has long fingernails, doesn't she?" asked Stefanoni, examining Meredith's hand.

"She has medium long fingernails," corrected the officer. He found no skin cells under the nails to show that she struggled for her life, but he put plastic bags over both hands to preserve the nails for further analysis.
<snip>
_______________________________________________________________


Hi everyone,
A long post, I know,
but do you see why I have wondered what happened to both of the probable blonde hairs that were found?
Who did they belong to? Dr. Stefanoni is apparently talking about them in the crime scene video, which is in Italian and you nor I have seen, but Barbie Nadeau has. Weird how they are lost.

I wonder too what were the results of the fingernail clippings?
Didn't Amanda Knox ask for these results in her 1st Appeals Trial?

And what were the results from those 2 seminal fluid stains,
that Dr. Stefanoni discusses with her lab assistant Alessa
found on the pillow case between Miss Kercher's legs
and also found with Rudy Guede's shoe imprint near her left, up-raised hand,
which has that blonde hair in her dying grasp?
RW


PS-I'll change my avatar next time I post.
Peace...
 
Last edited:
This is true. I'm not really comparing the two. Just that what Amanda had to endure was not good. If you read her book, she talks about the women who committed suicide at the prison and the different methods they used and how she contemplated committing suicide herself.

I was in jail once from a Thursday afternoon to a Tuesday afternoon. It was one of the worst experiences in my life if not the worst. I don't think I actually slept for the first 3 days I was there. I can't imagine spending 4 years behind bars with the prospect of spending 25 more.

They should be putting Stephony in prison, and likely Migninni in an insane asylum. Napoleoni and the others..... Edgardo Giobbi should be removed just for his stupid video on how he witch-hunts with gut instinct. geeez...what a case.
 
They should be putting Stephony in prison, and likely Migninni in an insane asylum. Napoleoni and the others..... Edgardo Giobbi should be removed just for his stupid video on how he witch-hunts with gut instinct. geeez...what a case.

I don't get it JREF. Are there really this many stupid people in the world? Seriously, are there?? Right now so many of them are frothing at the mouth over what some friend of the Sollecito family is tweeting out there. As if this woman changes the case one iota.

And this story that has hit the tabloids where they are basically accusing Amanda of being a coke head and that is what got her into trouble. They've narrated this entire story based on Amanda spending $ 3,000 in her first month in Italy and her having a phone number of someone they claim is a drug dealer and they never name the guy. Talk about trying to convict someone on innuendo. And the guilters are licking it up like a cat licking up a bowl of milk.

I remember when Machiavelli was pushing this story here at JREF and then all of a sudden it is all over the tabloids

This is what they do when they don't have a case.
 
I have no idea. I could come up with theories.

But one thing for sure IMHO: it's a smear campaign being carried out by the Sollecitos.

Haven't many of the Sollecito family always wanted to throw Amanda under a bus to save Raffaele? I'm not sure why this is causing you such excitement :confused:
 
I don't get it JREF. Are there really this many stupid people in the world? Seriously, are there?? Right now so many of them are frothing at the mouth over what some friend of the Sollecito family is tweeting out there. As if this woman changes the case one iota.

And this story that has hit the tabloids where they are basically accusing Amanda of being a coke head and that is what got her into trouble. They've narrated this entire story based on Amanda spending $ 3,000 in her first month in Italy and her having a phone number of someone they claim is a drug dealer and they never name the guy. Talk about trying to convict someone on innuendo. And the guilters are licking it up like a cat licking up a bowl of milk.

I remember when Machiavelli was pushing this story here at JREF and then all of a sudden it is all over the tabloids

This is what they do when they don't have a case.

This is all such nonsense, doesn't everyone spend more money in their first month. You have to pay out for all sorts of stuff, including deposit and first month rent, bedding, furniture, kitchen stuff, course fees, books etc. etc.

They also seem to forget that Amanda tested negative for drugs and not one person has ever seen her do a line of cocaine - and this is not something you would do alone.
 
I don't get it JREF. Are there really this many stupid people in the world? Seriously, are there?? Right now so many of them are frothing at the mouth over what some friend of the Sollecito family is tweeting out there. As if this woman changes the case one iota.

And this story that has hit the tabloids where they are basically accusing Amanda of being a coke head and that is what got her into trouble. They've narrated this entire story based on Amanda spending $ 3,000 in her first month in Italy and her having a phone number of someone they claim is a drug dealer and they never name the guy. Talk about trying to convict someone on innuendo. And the guilters are licking it up like a cat licking up a bowl of milk.

I remember when Machiavelli was pushing this story here at JREF and then all of a sudden it is all over the tabloids

This is what they do when they don't have a case.

They posted this link on the other site

http://patrishka.wordpress.com/2009/12/18/amanda-knox/

Some interesting stuff over a year including Germany Italy transition, and frankly some very entertaining writing.

4)plane was chill, and the train wasnt hard. in fact, met a guy named frederico on the train to florence from milan, and we ended up hanging out together in florence, where he bought both deanna and i dinner and then, when deanna went to bed, we smoked up together, my first time in italy…. took pictures early the next day of neptune’s fountain and naked david, conveniently located right next to each other.

Considering this was real time reporting, there is little indication of a descent into hard drugs.
 
This is all such nonsense, doesn't everyone spend more money in their first month. You have to pay out for all sorts of stuff, including deposit and first month rent, bedding, furniture, kitchen stuff, course fees, books etc. etc.

They also seem to forget that Amanda tested negative for drugs and not one person has ever seen her do a line of cocaine - and this is not something you would do alone.

Was she tested for drugs Nancy? I actually believe they never even considered it. I really don't think they thought that Amanda was under the influence.

They just created a new story to tell because the tabloid media can't keep running the old ones.
 
Was she tested for drugs Nancy? I actually believe they never even considered it. I really don't think they thought that Amanda was under the influence.

They just created a new story to tell because the tabloid media can't keep running the old ones.

Fling whatever they can against her until something sticks.
 
<snip>

PS-I'll change my avatar next time I post.Peace...


Why would you do that ?

Leave aside my position on the matter (which I doubt carries much weight with you)

& The confused (non – defence) defences of the avatar by various pro Knox posters.

Ignore if you must the First Amendment aspect.

All that aside – Do you really want to miss out on the Pulitzer &/or the big cheque from Life Magazine.

Think hard before doing anything rash.
 
Last edited:
PS-I'll change my avatar next time I post.
Peace...


Good idea. Your avatar is the closest many of the guilters have gotten to seeing the case evidence. Keep changing it and maybe they will absorb some of the facts by osmosis.
 
So why could they obtain samples from thousands of people yet the Perugia police couldn't obtain samples from the roommates and various boyfriends because they needed warrants? Apparently someone was lying about them not being permitted to get reference prints and reference DNA.

Excellent point.

I see Garofano and Novelli are involved in that one too.
 
nonsense about DNA reference profiles

So why could they obtain samples from thousands of people yet the Perugia police couldn't obtain samples from the roommates and various boyfriends because they needed warrants? Apparently someone was lying about them not being permitted to get reference prints and reference DNA.
An excellent point. Besides, why would Giacomo refuse a request? He was hundreds of kilometers away IIUC. Filomena had an alibi, and she was in the legal profession. Why would she refuse? It makes no sense, twice over.
 
So why could they obtain samples from thousands of people yet the Perugia police couldn't obtain samples from the roommates and various boyfriends because they needed warrants? Apparently someone was lying about them not being permitted to get reference prints and reference DNA.


It's quite simple. Roommates and boyfriends are potential suspects so they would need a warrant. Random people with no link to the case are not suspects so they need only to be asked for permission to take a reference sample. Of course, nobody will refuse such a request because refusal is an indication of guilt and with no other suspects they would instantly become number one.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom