• Security incident: ISF was recently accessed by intruders. Please change your password, and change it anywhere else you used it. Read more

If You Were Scottish How Would You Vote?

How would you vote re Scottish Independence?

  • Yes - Break the shackles of English opression

    Votes: 30 43.5%

  • No - I kinda like things the way they are

    Votes: 32 46.4%

  • Meh - I clicked this option just for something to do

    Votes: 6 8.7%

  • I should really have only chosen 3 poll options

    Votes: 1 1.4%
  • Total voters
    69
andyandy said:
you need to take things a bit less seriously. It's a light-hearted forum poll. I guess there's always someone desperate to take offense online.
Click to expand...


The OP is absolutely fine, it's just the wording of the poll options. Which is OK if you want light-hearted, it's just that from where I'm sitting it is a very serious matter.

I'm sick and bloody tired of being called a Nazi, a blood-and-soil nationalist, a Death Eater (that was Rowling herself), a virus, and all the other insults hurled at the Yes campaign by the Labour party and its fellow-travellers. There was huge offence last night when a Labour PPC compared a group of children at the Pacific Quay protest to Hitler Youth. I understand she has now resigned, but the authors of the rest of the smears I quoted haven't. The other day someone on the Labour side siggested that "cybernats" should be thrown under the back wheels of the Nomobile to give them more traction. "They're only slippery when squished." They're not joking. They really do think we're some sort of subhuman life form.

It gets a bit wearing. I'm going to the opening night of the Yestival in Melrose tonight just to raise my spirits, even though I think Dick Gaughan is a terrible singer.

Also, I do want to start a serious poll and may start it soon, I've got the questions drafted already. I don't want a joke poll to lead to that being disallowed as a duplicate thread.

Rolfe.
 
Craig B said:
Problem is, if you vote No, hoping that nonetheless Scottish concerns will be effectively addressed, even when the threat of dissolution of the union no longer hangs over the head of the Westminster establishment, history teaches that you will be disappointed.
Click to expand...


Exactly so. Anyone who thinks that throwing away your only bargaining chip is the way to be granted a raft of concessions your adversary is bitterly opposed to granting, is delusional. That's Rowling again, apparently.

I'm also not into the suicide pact argument for maintaining the union. I don't care about the strength of the British state. In fact I think it would be a damn good thing for many ordinary people around the world if it stopped trying to "punch above its weight".

I want to live in a medium-sized northern European democracy which administers its substantial wealth for the benefit of its own people and to act as a force for peace in the world. Not to fund weapons of mass destruction and indulge in regime change for countries where we don't like the leadership this month.

Rolfe.
 
Talking of a serious poll, I think it would be interesting to have one for people whith an actual vote to express their intentions. I'm mindful of the fact that the forum poll in 2011 predicted the actual SNP landslide, when at the time I thought it was wildly unrepresentative.

Rolfe.
 
Where I Scottish (in the sense of living north of the border come referendum time) I would very likely vote yes, partly for sentimental reasons and partly to separate myself from an increasingly right-wing south.
 
I'm Scottish but live in England so don't get to vote (which is fine; that's the logical way to do it). If I did, I'd vote no.

I won't be desperately upset if there's a yes vote, but I certainly wouldn't choose to break up the UK. I don't have any problem reconciling being a Scot within the UK within the EU. I feel Scottish but I also feel British. Don't have any such emotional reaction to the EU but I don't suppose many do.

Speaking of which it's curious how little there seems to be in common between those who want Scotland to be free of the UK and those who want the UK (or indeed England) to be free of the EU.
 
I'm Canadian, and I voted Yes because I believe Scotland has not benefited from being in the Union, especially for the last 50 years or so. And I'm not sure how enthusiastic the Scots were for the original union 300 years ago.

Which is strange, because as a Canadian I was very much on the side of Quebec staying in Canada the couple of times they held a referendum to leave. I suspect the issues Quebec had with the rest of Canada are very similar to the issues Scotland has with the rest of the UK. An exception is that Quebec speaks French instead of English, which only serves to widen the divide. Another interesting point is the Quebec separatists were trounced in the last provincial election, and that seems to have put off any talk of independence for a generation.

Overall I get the impression Quebec today is largely satisfied with its place in Canada. Other Canadians here may disagree, and I would be interested in seeing their comments. But perhaps in a separate thread.
 
MikeG said:
On balance, just, I want Scots independence because I rather dislike the idea of unhappy relationships. If Scots dislike the English so, then its time for a divorce. I suspect that, like me, many English rather like Scots and Scotland, but are sick and tired of all the whingeing.
Click to expand...

I can see this, but all the same I'm always dubious when local politicians stir the pot to break away from another modern democracy. I think there's a lot of self interest in creating a new power vacuum in which they can, conveniently, step in. Not in a dictator sense, but in the usual sense of now they get to hand out favors in exchange for donations, legal and otherwise.

It's the same larger principle, but in reverse, as applied to the European Parliament, where yet another set of politicians seek to grow their power (and grow and grow and grow).

In many ways, the US federal government originally had a lot less power than the EU Parliament does now...and look at the US now! They over there sure as hell won't be taking a slow boat to power shifting.
 
Last edited:
Sir Sean Connery's shexshy voice can make me support any nation's independence.

But seriously, I have always said that the "No" side hasn't had much in the way of convincing arguments. Which may just be the nature of the beast ("Yes" is certainly more commonly associated with positive arguments, and "No" is just the status quo, as devo-max is not possible). But most of the "newsworthy" topics in the discussion have been on relatively small implementation details, IMO. An Independent Scotland has more room to breath and grow into a modern EU social democracy, instead of being stuck as a ride along in the UK. It always makes me laugh when people point to the UK international "power" as a reason for Union. Iraq and Trident. Enough said, IMO.
 
MikeG said:
Do you think there might be a reason why this is all you hear of the Better Together campaign in Osaka?

-

All I hear of the "Yes" campaign is virulent anti-English sentiment dressed up in the language of oppression. You'd think we were talking about 1960s South Africa. I (marginally) want them to win, but I'll laugh like hell if they don't. One of the bloggers posters on here in particular has such a one-eyed view of the world that the immediate post-no-vote period will be one of the highlights of the forum year.
Click to expand...

And they say Scots have a chip on their shoulders................
 
MikeG said:
On balance, just, I want Scots independence because I rather dislike the idea of unhappy relationships. If Scots dislike the English so, then its time for a divorce. I suspect that, like me, many English rather like Scots and Scotland, but are sick and tired of all the whingeing.
Click to expand...

One eyed.....we dont dislike the English.
 
Two of my brothers live in Scotland; one will be voting yes and one will be voting no. Both have good reasoning behind their choices, though I did point out to them that they are effectively cancelling out each other's votes.
 
This "cancelling out each other's votes" thing is silly. To a large extent all our votes will be "cancelled out" by someone else's. That's hardly a reason for not voting, or for voting the other way. And knowing someone who will vote the other way doesn't change that.

The only time that made sense that I remember was in the final of "Maestro". I was going to vote for Sue Perkins and my mother was going to vote for Goldie. We decided to save the price of two phone calls.

Rolfe.
 
I'd also like to hear a rational reason for voting No other than that the voter believes "Britain" is a unitary nation-state and doesn't want it to fragment even though Scotland and the Scots would be better off with independence, or that the person peddling the scare stories is in line for a sinecure in Westminster and a £300-a-day seat in the Lords.

Rolfe.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

ISF - Join now!

Every member here is approved by hand. No bots, no spam, just people who care about evidence and honest debate.

Membership is free!

Create your free account

Back
Top Bottom