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Will a Palestinian State Bring Peace?

Jedi Knight

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J
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May 21, 2002
Messages
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If a Palestinian state is created and plants itself right next to Israel, will there be peace?

How would it foster peace? The people killing the Jews will still be the same people running the new Palestinian state. Will those people lose interest in killing Jews just because Israel lets them form a nation-state?

JK
 
Well, I think one intention is that the state will stop the recruitment argument "fight against occupation" and "fight against colonization" type.

But the real question is can Abbas reign in the terror group, and if he can't will he start a civil war?

Gem
 
Gem said:
Well, I think one intention is that the state will stop the recruitment argument "fight against occupation" and "fight against colonization" type.

But the real question is can Abbas reign in the terror group, and if he can't will he start a civil war?

Gem
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Gem, are you easily scared?

JK
 
To sort of quote LBJ, "I come to you with a heavy heart". Alas, I fear that nothing will satisfy the middle east world except totally destroying one another.

Keep that barrel clean, soldier.
 
Gem said:


But the real question is can Abbas reign in the terror group, and if he can't will he start a civil war?

Gem
Click to expand...

A good way to try and help this along would be for Isreal to stop destroying the PA's security network and undermining the PA's authority and legitimacy.

Its so obvious what Sharon has done. Demand that the PA act to stop terrorists while simultaneously bombing and shelling every Palestinian police outpost to make sure this never happens and ensure the rationaal he uses to excuse his bloodthirst remains intact.
 
I invite all Israelis to our beautiful province of Saskatchewan. They thought about it in the 40's; it's never too late to back down. :)
 
Jedi Knight said:


I think the Palestinian/Israeli issue has become a "dance of death".

JK
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JK, though I 'm not really happy that you broke you promise about not returning to the forum :D ,
I'll say that this is a statement of yours I agree with.
The sad truth is, imho, that neither the Israelis nor the Palestinians actually know what peace really is. This region is a violent mess for nearly 60 years now so two generations of people simply don't know any better.

Zee
 
One of the most important reason why there is stalemate in their war is that neither side can gain an advantage. Let me explain.

Palestenian terrorists cannot kill all jews, bomb every bus, etc. IDF, security forces, police are getting very good at stopping them, assasinating their leaders, etc. It has become impossible for Hamas and their like to destroy Isreal.

Yet it is also impossible for Isreal to occupy all of palestine (or whatever you want to call this sandbox) 24/7. Their military strength is in the battlefield, not at keeping peace. This is why you have "raids" and so forth. They also cannot expell all palestenians, or genocide them. It is also very hard to kill the terrorists without civilian "collateral damage," and the fact (I think it's a fact) that for every Hamas leader killed, ten others are ready to take their place.

Because neither side can gain an advantage over the other, you have a stalemate.

Imo, the palestenian state and the road map business is designed to give Isreal an advantage over their war against the terrorists. If Palestinians can be 'used' on their side against the terrorists, then Isreal has the opportunity to clear a lot of terrorists.

The "state" is really just a tool to bring the palestenians who want peace against the terrorists.

The question is not "Does the state bring peace?" but "Can Isreal and the Palestenians who want peace disarm Hamas?"

Gem
 
Gem said:
One of the most important reason why there is stalemate in their war is that neither side can gain an advantage. Let me explain.

Palestenian terrorists cannot kill all jews, bomb every bus, etc. IDF, security forces, police are getting very good at stopping them, assasinating their leaders, etc. It has become impossible for Hamas and their like to destroy Isreal.

Yet it is also impossible for Isreal to occupy all of palestine (or whatever you want to call this sandbox) 24/7. Their military strength is in the battlefield, not at keeping peace. This is why you have "raids" and so forth. They also cannot expell all palestenians, or genocide them. It is also very hard to kill the terrorists without civilian "collateral damage," and the fact (I think it's a fact) that for every Hamas leader killed, ten others are ready to take their place.

Because neither side can gain an advantage over the other, you have a stalemate.

Imo, the palestenian state and the road map business is designed to give Isreal an advantage over their war against the terrorists. If Palestinians can be 'used' on their side against the terrorists, then Isreal has the opportunity to clear a lot of terrorists.

The "state" is really just a tool to bring the palestenians who want peace against the terrorists.

The question is not "Does the state bring peace?" but "Can Isreal and the Palestenians who want peace disarm Hamas?"

Gem
Click to expand...

The whole thing is a dance of death.

The Palestinians are merely a proxy force for affluent arabs and non-arabs (Persians) to kill Jews and destroy the State of Israel.

The United States is pushing the Palestinian State because our country knows of no other way to appease the muslim populations and make them not hate us anymore. Liberal thinkers in this country simply do not understand that creating a Palestinian State will not prevent the cycle of death and destruction in the middle east.

The goal of Arafat and his cronies is to ultimately drive the Jews into the sea. They could care less what the US position is. The muslim populations want the Jews cleansed from the region completely and the muslim populations want complete control over all religious historical sites in the region so that they can be coverted to Islam's interpretation of religious history.

This is a war where Islam seeks to control the world. You could put Denmark where Israel is and the results would be the same. Islam, in its natural intolerance, wants to dismantle all religious history so that global domination can be attainable.

Now, knowing all these facts, I think that it will lead to nuclear war and massive loss of life. I think the Jews are becoming suspicious of the intentions of others and given their treatment in history by the Europeans and Arabs it could lead to the use of weapons of mass destruction.

So the choice is this--do we perpetuate the lie that Islam is a religion of peace, or do we risk nuclear engagement with the State of Israel that may find strategic nuclear weapons falling into the heart of Europe? Right about now it is hard to convince the Jews that another genocide attempt is not working against them. The first genocide attempt made them very suspicious of other foreign powers, so much so they are like a mad dog in the junkyard that is best left alone.

Hard decisions, but avoiding the truth only endangers the world.

For those who are going to call me on Islam not being a religion of peace, name one country where Islam is in the majority that it has tolerance for any other religious expression. Name one.

When Islam is in the minority, it is tolerant. The instant it becomes the majority it kills the leaders of rival religious groups and seizes institutional control over the nation. This will be the fate of France and Britain eventually.

Ignore my accurate assessment and watch as I am right.

JK
 
Jedi Knight said:
For those who are going to call me on Islam not being a religion of peace, name one country where Islam is in the majority that it has tolerance for any other religious expression. Name one.
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Well, there's Indonesia.
 
I know Ethiopia has christians and muslism, but I'm not sure who is the majority.

Besides, JK, replace natural Islam with natural Christianity or natural Juidaism and you have to same problem, a bunch of lunatics who just want to kill the "enemy."

Replace Jihad with Crusade, and what difference does it make?

Gem
 
Tricky said:

Well, there's Indonesia.
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Ah yes, Indonesia.

I especially like this part:

The Bali bombings initially raised concerns that Australia's relations with Indonesia would be damaged by Australians blaming Indonesia for the atrocity. But Megawati's rapid moves in response to pressure from US, Australian and other Western countries has assuaged such fears. In fact, it has been the Australian Government that has been the target of most opprobrium, with accusations that it failed to pass on warnings about terrorist threats in Bali. The rapid formation of the Joint Investigation and Intelligence Team to investigate the Bali bombings, involving law enforcement officials from Australia and Indonesia, was a signal that there could be good cooperation between the two Governments on the issue.

Sound familiar? That is how the west deals with radical Islamic nation-states internationally. It is a condition where "bombings" against the west are viewed as "opportunity".

lol

It is dance of death.

JK
 
Gem said:
I know Ethiopia has christians and muslism, but I'm not sure who is the majority.

Besides, JK, replace natural Islam with natural Christianity or natural Juidaism and you have to same problem, a bunch of lunatics who just want to kill the "enemy."

Replace Jihad with Crusade, and what difference does it make?

Gem
Click to expand...

Not true. The United States has been predominately a Christian nation since its inception and we haven't ever taken over the world or even tried to. Christianity in its roots is not an agressor religion. Islam is.

The "Crusades" killed a handful of people compared to Islam, and the "Crusades" were led by men in a blip in history, where Islam is a perpetual agressor religion that seeks to overwhelm the world with fascism.

JK
 
Tricky said:

Well, there's Indonesia.
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Sorry this report had a different version of Indonesia.

In eastern Indonesia, on the islands of Maluku and Sulawesi, ongoing fighting between Christians and Muslims has left more than 10,000 dead, and up to half a million refugees. Attempts at reconciliation between the communities, which had lived in peace and cooperation for many years, were succeeding until mid 2000, when the Laskar Jihad, a radical Islam militia from the island of Java, intervened.

Using thousands of trained and uniformed militiamen, often armed with automatic rifles, the Jihad transformed local conflict into full-scale religious cleansing. It swept through Maluku, burning villages and killing and driving out Christians (as well as the few Hindus and Buddhists) while Indonesian government security forces stood by.

The Jihad then moved to Sulawesi. In July 2001, thousands of jihadists began arriving, after officially informing the local governor of their coming. They said publicly that their goal was to drive out all Christians and institute an extreme version of Islamic sharia law. Violence is ongoing in Sulawesi, with sniper attacks, bombings and church burnings. On Aug. 12, the village of Sepe, with a population of about 1,250, was totally burned down.
http://www.freedomhouse.org/religion/country/indonesia/Terror's Not New to Indonesia.htm
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