Who Created God?

[Iacchus]

So, how do we in fact get something from nothing, when in fact nothing is all there is? ... Nay, nor even the slightest potential for something. Wouldn't there at least have to be some sort of basic structure or matrix already there? If so, then how did that get there? Sounds to me like we're speaking about some basic structure which has always been, indeed, a highly intelligent structure. Which is to say, how else could it not be intelligent if, in fact it was the basis for all there is?

Hey, did you know that consciousness is merely the end-result of that which is highly structured? Think about it. How could we possibly do anything, let alone think, without a tremendous amount of structure in our lives? Whereas if these immutable laws that govern this structure have always been, what might it possibly suggest? That the Universe has always been self-aware, and was designed specifically as an outcropping of this?

Well, that certainly dispells any need to ask who created God now doesn't it?

 

[CWL]

When you state that there has always been an intelligent structure what do you mean by intelligent? Please define.

 

[Upchurch]

I'm not sure about most of the opening post, but in answer to the question in the thread title: Man created god(s) in his first attempts to explain the world around him.

 

[Mercutio]

I created god. Last tuesday. Along with the evidence that the world has existed for billions of years...and so far, I have fooled all of you!

*evil laugh*

 

[Lothian]

God was created by the same powerful force that created Allah, Thor, Aphrodite and the tooth fairy.

 

[TragicMonkey]

God was created by the same powerful force that created Allah, Thor, Aphrodite and the tooth fairy.

You're just being silly. Everyone knows that the Tooth Fairy and Aphrodite are the same person. She had to make a career change when western religion got outsourced to the Middle East.

 

[Bikewer]

Upchurch, I agree entirely.

I keep trying to imagine the world that our primitive ancestors found themselves in when sentience first blossomed. Must have been a very confusing place, what with celestial bodies swirling around overhead, water falling from the sky for no apparent reason, lightening setting the woods on fire, the earth trembling, and what all.
Not to mention the bizzare psychological phenomenon that we're just now beginning to get a handle on.
No mystery why our ancestors would have invented a great deal of lore to explain all these things.

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

I created god. Last tuesday. Along with the evidence that the world has existed for billions of years...and so far, I have fooled all of you!

*evil laugh*

That's pretty close, but not quite right. Actually, I created it all last Monday, then instilled the belief in you that you had done it on Tuesday. Mysterious ways, you know.

 

[TragicMonkey]

That's pretty close, but not quite right. Actually, I created it all last Monday, then instilled the belief in you that you had done it on Tuesday. Mysterious ways, you know.

Shows what you know. I created it tomorrow, and then set the time back while deceiving the pair of you.

 

[Gastric ReFlux]

Shows what you know. I created it tomorrow, and then set the time back while deceiving the pair of you.

Well I'm not gonna even try to out-Omphalos either of you two, but just put in a prayer request that whoever done it alter my apparent memories into including a tryst with Salma Hayek. Thanks.

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

Well I'm not gonna even try to out-Omphalos either of you two, but just put in a prayer request that whoever done it alter my apparent memories into including a tryst with Salma Hayek. Thanks.

I'll get right on it, unless TragicMonkey is right, in which case, I just believe that I'll get right on it.

 

[jan]

I think we have to deal with two questions. The first, and far more serious question, is: why is there something and not just nothing?

I really don't know, but I know at least two theories trying to answer this question.

The first theory claims that everything exists, and that it is just not possible not to exist. Besides our universe, there are infinite many other universes, in fact, every other possible universe (I don't know who I shall credit with this theory; Max Tegmark, for example, seems to believe this).

The second theory claims that everything started with absolute nothing. But absolute nothing means the absence of absolute everything, including any rule that could prevent nothingness to become something. A guy called Charles Sanders Peirce claimed that.

The second, and less serious question is: who created god?

God was created by someone named Shlemy Zarathustra, around 6438B.C., on a sunny thursday afternoon. It was an immediate success.

 

[LuxFerum]

God was created by someone named Shlemy Zarathustra, around 6438B.C., on a sunny thursday afternoon. It was an immediate success.

nope, religion and gods are much older than that.

 

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

Jan said:
I think we have to deal with two questions. The first, and far more serious question, is: why is there something and not just nothing?

That is the second question to be asked, conditional on the first question: Is there a reason why there is something rather than nothing?

~~ Paul

 

[TragicMonkey]

That is the second question to be asked, conditional on the first question: Is there a reason why there is something rather than nothing?

At the risk of being tediously pedantic, and brining up the Descartes thread, the first question would be "Is there something? Define it, and how do you know it's there?"

Something to be said for belief in gods--you don't have to have that kind of discussion!

 

[Upchurch]

Along the "Man creates god(s)" topic, I'd like to take a quick aside to highly recommend Neil Gaiman's American Gods. Excellent book by an excellent author.

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

Along the "Man creates god(s)" topic, I'd like to take a quick aside to highly recommend Neil Gaiman's American Gods. Excellent book by an excellent author.

I second. The bit with the Wiccan waitress especially amuses me.

 

[Iacchus]

I think we have to deal with two questions. The first, and far more serious question, is: why is there something and not just nothing?

I really don't know, but I know at least two theories trying to answer this question.

The first theory claims that everything exists, and that it is just not possible not to exist. Besides our universe, there are infinite many other universes, in fact, every other possible universe (I don't know who I shall credit with this theory; Max Tegmark, for example, seems to believe this).

The second theory claims that everything started with absolute nothing. But absolute nothing means the absence of absolute everything, including any rule that could prevent nothingness to become something. A guy called Charles Sanders Peirce claimed that.

The second, and less serious question is: who created god?

God was created by someone named Shlemy Zarathustra, around 6438B.C., on a sunny thursday afternoon. It was an immediate success.

Or, how about a third theory, that energy -- which, by the way is the conveyor of intelligence (and/or information) -- has always existed, except that without the existence of matter, it would appear immaterial. Hence we have our relative sense of nothing -- albeit, highly intelligent -- that is until the Big Bang occurred which, was the conversion of energy into matter.

Thus we have a God which is pure energy, and a God who permeates throughout the whole Universe. Albeit we can only sense that He's there, through the energy aspect in ourselves ... our soul in other words. So, would energy -- again, which is the conveyor of intellingence -- in fact be timeless if it can't be destroyed?

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

Or, how about a third theory, that energy -- which, by the way is the conveyor of intelligence (and/or information) --

Energy conveys information? Or energy is used in the conveyance of information?

has always existed, except that without the existence of matter, it would appear immaterial.

Appear immaterial? To whom?

Hence we have our relative sense of nothing -- albeit, highly intelligent -- that is until the Big Bang occurred which, was the conversion of energy into matter.

What evidence have we that there was energy (or anything) before the Big Bang? What reason do we have to believe "before the Big Bang" is even meaningful?

Thus we have a God which is pure energy,

"Pure" energy? What impurities is it missing that other energy contains?

and a God who permeates throughout the whole Universe. Albeit we can only sense that He's there, through the energy aspect in ourselves ... our soul in other words. So, would energy -- again, which is the conveyor of intellingence -- in fact be timeless if it can't be destroyed?

Energy is just as timeless as time. Anyway, do you have a point in there somewhere?

 

[CWL]

Or, how about a third theory, that energy -- which, by the way is the conveyor of intelligence (and/or information) -- has always existed, except that without the existence of matter, it would appear immaterial. Hence we have our relative sense of nothing -- albeit, highly intelligent -- that is until the Big Bang occurred which, was the conversion of energy into matter.

Thus we have a God which is pure energy, and a God who permeates throughout the whole Universe. Albeit we can only sense that He's there, through the energy aspect in ourselves ... our soul in other words. So, would energy -- again, which is the conveyor of intellingence -- in fact be timeless if it can't be destroyed?

Again, all this sounds spiffing, but without you defining what you mean when you say "intelligence" it sounds to me like you're just throwing words around that sound good.

Thus, please define "intelligence". Thanks in advance.