What's so bad about capitalism?

[corplinx]

So many people act like the smelled a bad fart in an elevator when you mention capitalism. It's like they imagine a million Gordon Geckos trying to rob them blind when they imagine free markets.

I say its time to give capitalism a second chance in the industrialized west. We have come a long way since the robber barons, Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle", and other early aberrations. We live in the information age. People can make more informed buying decisions than ever before.

While socialism seems to work best under artifical controls (limited immigration, low birth rate), capitalism seems to work well even with a huge immigrant influx like we have in America.

How about it folks?

 

[baldrick]

Correct me if I'm worng, but people end up living on the streets in Capitalist Societies, whereas they don't in a Communist Society

 

[corplinx]

Correct me if I'm worng, but people end up living on the streets in Capitalist Societies, whereas they don't in a Communist Society

Kidding, seriously though your person on the street in a capitalist society is most likely suffering from mental or dependency problems. Usually the don't want help either. In the old Soviet Union, such people were simply eliminated.

In San Francisco much has been done to deal with this problem through government programs but nothing has been successful.

 

[dsm]

I say its time to give capitalism a second chance in the industrialized west. We have come a long way since the robber barons, Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle", and other early aberrations. We live in the information age. People can make more informed buying decisions than ever before.

It's not the quantity of information that is the issue, but rather the quality of information. It doesn't matter if there are several hundred newspaper, television, and radio outlets if they are all controlled by a few major corporations.

 

[Jedi Knight]

Correct me if I'm worng, but people end up living on the streets in Capitalist Societies, whereas they don't in a Communist Society

Oh gosh, and what about the 150,000,000 that died under communism in the last century alone? Was communism concerned if they were homeless or not?

Do you consider 15 families squatting in your home 'living'? That is what happens under communism.

Oh, you are thinking of it as a 'roof over their heads', right? Is working for the 'state', receiving a wage of 10 dollars per month worth the 15 family (packed in like a meat locker) house? Ever try using the bathroom with 60 people waiting in line?

Then you have the block commanders every third house or so writing down everything you are doing and saying and turning it into the KGB. Is that worth keeping idle people 'of the streets'?

Golly, communism is such a pathetic ideology, I can't believe you even brought that nasty ideology up as a resolution to homelessness.

But look, if homeless people are really bothering you, pack them all into your house. Implement your own personal form of communism.

JK

 

[corplinx]

Re: Re: What's so bad about capitalism?

It's not the quantity of information that is the issue, but rather the quality of information. It doesn't matter if there are several hundred newspaper, television, and radio outlets if they are all controlled by a few major corporations.

I think you have reality confused with the Max Headroom scifi drama. In it a few corporations controlled all information.

However, there was no source of independent media in that future. There will be always be alternative news sources because there will always be demand.

 

[dsm]

Re: Re: Re: What's so bad about capitalism?

I think you have reality confused with the Max Headroom scifi drama. In it a few corporations controlled all information.

However, there was no source of independent media in that future. There will be always be alternative news sources because there will always be demand.

Yeah, right...

 

[Dancing David]

I haven't got a problem with capitalism perse, the evils of any econmic system equal each other out.

My objections are more theoretical:
A. Valuing humans only for thier economic value.
B. The association of capitalism with things like 'liberty'.

Capitalism is a great motivator in theory, our current practise is a bit off the mark. Perhaps profiteering?

I like the idea of a mixed system , competition and social concern.

 

[dsm]

Oh gosh, and what about the 150,000,000 that died under communism in the last century alone? Was communism concerned if they were homeless or not?

Reference, please? I'm curious where you came up with such a number.

p.s. While you're at it, how many Americans died in the last century?

Do you consider 15 families squatting in your home 'living'? That is what happens under communism.

Sadly, it also happens under capitalism...

 

[Frostbite]

I like capitalism. I like the idea that if you have a great idea you can go out there and start your own company, get public, get rich, etc. But what I really hate is materialism. As a consumer, I'm not always looking for the cheapest deal and the best bargain. Sometimes, I like to pay a little more and know that what I have is quality. And I wish big corporations wouldn't be so god damn cheap and hire kids in sweatshops or cheap labors in poor countries. That doesn't appeal to me. Whenever I buy something I so a little background study to know if whatever corporations I'll be buying products from are morally adequate, at least to my minimal standards.

 

[corplinx]

I like capitalism. I like the idea that if you have a great idea you can go out there and start your own company, get public, get rich, etc. But what I really hate is materialism. As a consumer, I'm not always looking for the cheapest deal and the best bargain. Sometimes, I like to pay a little more and know that what I have is quality. And I wish big corporations wouldn't be so god damn cheap and hire kids in sweatshops or cheap labors in poor countries. That doesn't appeal to me. Whenever I buy something I so a little background study to know if whatever corporations I'll be buying products from are morally adequate, at least to my minimal standards.

Sentiments most people agree with. You can buy toys that aren't made in sweatshops. They sell them at specialty toy stores and have weird norwegian sounding names. The reason we buy low commodity goods is because the marginal utility of the finnish toy isn't high enough to pay the price.

We all hate materialism. But I support anyone's right to be shallow and consumed with material desires.

 

[corplinx]

I think one of the great myths of a capitalist federal republic is that one or two corps could take over.

However, I think if any entity threatened the sovereignty of the host country that it could be dealt with.

Would there still be an FCC or FTC? Of course!

 

[dsm]

I think one of the great myths of a capitalist federal republic is that one or two corps could take over.

Why would international corporations think as small as taking over one federal republic.

Remember, they don't have to be declared "ruler" to "take it over".

However, I think if any entity threatened the sovereignty of the host country that it could be dealt with.

By who? Those that were elected with corporation money?

Would there still be an FCC or FTC? Of course!

I repeat -- yeah, right...

 

[corplinx]

I repeat -- yeah, right...

Gnutellanews, thats rich. Is every article there plagiarized in keeping with the spirit of gnutella?

 

[Jedi Knight]

Originally posted by dsm
Reference, please? I'm curious where you came up with such a number.

"The Black Book of Communism": ISBN: 0-674-07608-7; Harvard University Press; 1999; Courtois, Werth, Panne, Paczkowski, et all.

Sadly, it also happens under capitalism...

You're nuts. The communist state used institutions of the state to genocide 150,000,000 people last century. That never happens under capitalism.

Answer me this--why do seemingly intelligent people gravitate to an ideological perversion like communism? Communism is ten-fold worse than Nazism.

Is it because people do not understand what communism is? I think that is the case. It all boils down to the talking points of what some communists say like stealing property from the wealthy, stealing corporate power, stealing income from the producers to give to non-producers..so yes, there is an incentive there in mysticism that people will benefit. That said, it seems logical to me that stealing never benefits anyone and I don't know why communist advancement of theft from other humans is looked upon as credible.

Communism is evil and must be destroyed using any means necessary wherever and whenever it is encountered.

JK

 

[Jedi Knight]

Communism = slavery.

JK

 

[corplinx]

Communism is evil and must be destroyed using any means necessary wherever and whenever it is encountered.

Stalinism should be eradicated. Freely elected communists in India who enact quasi-communist policies should be left alone.

 

[Dancing David]

Communism is evil and must be destroyed using any means necessary wherever and whenever it is encountered.

JK [/B]

I hope not by using communism to defeat communism, or by saying that it's ten times more evil than nazism.

Please using evil to defeat evil is still evil.

 

[Jedi Knight]

I hope not by using communism to defeat communism, or by saying that it's ten times more evil than nazism.

Please using evil to defeat evil is still evil.

No, ask someone what I meant. That is not it.

JK

 

[dsm]

Gnutellanews, thats rich. Is every article there plagiarized in keeping with the spirit of gnutella?

That's a "rich" reply.

Since the article is a simple copy of the statement that Ted Turner put out, show me where GnuTella "plagiarized" anything he said?

Although it says exactly the same thing, perhaps you'd prefer a pointer to the Washington Post?