What has the Million-Dollar Challenge accomplished?

[Jeff Corkern]

What is the ultimate purpose of the Million-Dollar Challenge? What is it out to prove, in the final analysis?

For years now, NOBODY has successfully passed the criteria of the Million-Dollar Challenge. To be able to reproduce various claims of the paranormal under rigorous laboratory conditions.

And this means---what?

I mean, what's the overall purpose here? A MILLION DOLLARS has been put up for grabs. That's a lotta money, man. Putting THAT much money up for grabs points to some really HUGE, deadly serious purpose.

What is it?

If y'all please, I'd like to hear from the adults on this one, the people who run the JREF forums. From Randi himself, if he's available.

What's it all about?

 

[Czarcasm]

Read this: http://www.randi.org/research/index.html
It explains everything.

 

[Jackalgirl]

...If y'all please, I'd like to hear from the adults on this one, the people who run the JREF forums. From Randi himself, if he's available.

What's it all about?

FWIW, Randi does occassionally read the Forums but that's no guarantee he will see (or respond to) your post. I'd review all of the Challenge documentation that's available online (including Czarcasm's excellent pointer) to make sure that it doesn't answer your question first. Then, if you would like a response from Randi, or would like to suggest that this be reviewed in an upcoming Commentary, send an email to randi@randi.org.

Another avenue would be to email the Challenge Administrator at challenge@randi.org -- that's Jeff Wagg, who's pretty busy, so he might not be able to respond to you right away. But if you post "out in the open" here, you're much less likely to get the from-the-top response for which you're looking.

 

[The Atheist]

What is the ultimate purpose of the Million-Dollar Challenge? What is it out to prove, in the final analysis?

For years now, NOBODY has successfully passed the criteria of the Million-Dollar Challenge. To be able to reproduce various claims of the paranormal under rigorous laboratory conditions.

And this means---what?

I mean, what's the overall purpose here? A MILLION DOLLARS has been put up for grabs. That's a lotta money, man. Putting THAT much money up for grabs points to some really HUGE, deadly serious purpose.

What is it?

If y'all please, I'd like to hear from the adults on this one, the people who run the JREF forums. From Randi himself, if he's available.

What's it all about?

Well, as has been suggested, if you want those people's opinions, posting your questions on a thread is probably the wrong way to go about it. That will get you my views, which is 100% unofficial and strictly my own opinion.

The simple answer is that it has achieved some goals and failed on others.

It has achieved a raising in the profile of scepticism, helped grow JREF and this forum, and has generated publicity. There will be no doubt that many people have changed their views on paranormality as a result of JREF who got there due to publicity about the challenge.

The failure has been in slowing down the drift of people into idiotic stuff like astrology, psychics and mediums. It hasn't harmed Sylvia Browne and even Uri Geller's making a comeback. As has been mentioned right here - who is on national tv more often, Randi or Sylvia?

I'm not sure I agree with the sentiment that $1,000,000 is such a huge amount of money, either. Nowadays, many people have a net worth of more. The other side is that anyone who actually did display a real paranormal ability would make billions, not millions from using their ability, so the million itself is largely meaningless.

When Randi starts chasing the charlatans with it, it may create more interest - we're about to find out.

 

[Cuddles]

What is the ultimate purpose of the Million-Dollar Challenge? What is it out to prove, in the final analysis?

It's a PR tool for Randi and his foundation, plain and simple. Randi knows that most, if not all, people claiming to be psychic, or whatever, are frauds, or at best deluded. Unfortunately many people believe them and so Randi tries to show them the truth. The challenge exsists soley for him to be able to say "You claim you can do things thought to be impossible. Prove it.". And no-one has been able to prove it. These people charge for readings, and yet they either refuse or are simply unable to get a million for a couple of hours work. People are therefore forced to ask why that is. There are endless debates about whether it has been effective and what the best approach is, but that is the idea behind it.

I mean, what's the overall purpose here? A MILLION DOLLARS has been put up for grabs. That's a lotta money, man. Putting THAT much money up for grabs points to some really HUGE, deadly serious purpose.

What is it?

The huge, deadly serious purpose is to educate people. Many people believe in things that don't exist, Randi tries to show them this and the challenge is simply one way of doing so. The amount of money is simply to show how confident Randi is that he is right.

For years now, NOBODY has successfully passed the criteria of the Million-Dollar Challenge. To be able to reproduce various claims of the paranormal under rigorous laboratory conditions.

And this means---what?

It means that Randi really is right. If anyone really did have paranormal powers they could easily have won it. Since they haven't it follows that no-one who has ever heard of the challenge really does have powers.

 

[MRC_Hans]

What is the ultimate purpose of the Million-Dollar Challenge? What is it out to prove, in the final analysis?

It is out to prove that paranormal powers exist. That is, the people putting up the challenge are conviced that they don't exist, but since you can't prove a negative, all you can do is try to make it attractive for paranormal practitioners to come forward.

Of course, there is a secondary motive. That of hitting frauds and chalatans on the head with it .

For years now, NOBODY has successfully passed the criteria of the Million-Dollar Challenge. To be able to reproduce various claims of the paranormal under rigorous laboratory conditions.

And this means---what?

This means that a number of people who thought they had paranormal powers, actually had none.

It also, by counting the non-showers, means that a number of people who claim they have paranormal powers and are making a living by convincing others of the same have decided that trying for the challenge would not boost their economy. You can fill in the blanks on that yourself.

I mean, what's the overall purpose here? A MILLION DOLLARS has been put up for grabs. That's a lotta money, man. Putting THAT much money up for grabs points to some really HUGE, deadly serious purpose.

That's a nice cool sum. Nothing that will change the world, but hard to turn down, if you could get it.

What is it?

Well, it is important that the sum is big enough so the media will bother to write about it, now and then.

If y'all please, I'd like to hear from the adults on this one,

Quite the majority of people here are adults and act it. Insinuating otherwise isn't gonna win you many friends. (Just friendly advice)

the people who run the JREF forums. From Randi himself, if he's available.

What's it all about?

As others have already pointed out, Randi's explanation is already available. What makes you think his answer will be different, just because you ask?

Hans

 

[GzuzKryzt]

It is in fact an educational tool.

In times of growing information availability and less guidelines on how to do so, the JREF Challenge could be viewed as a lighthouse in front of the shores of Irrationality.

For the fence sitters - like I was a decade ago - it should be interesting to know that there is an organization which offers USD 1,000,000 to anyone who "can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event."

And, that this money is still out there. Despite it being considerably less than an eight-hour day's work to claim it. Snag it up. Le prendre en passant.

Like you would pick up a fruit in the store: Because you can.

Isn't it interesting that, at an hourly rate of let's say $125,000, including a guaranteed payoff because they simply have to do what they claim to be able to do, all those "psychics", "mediums", "fortune tellers" and "spiritual teachers" who already claim huge amounts for their "services", don't jump at this even bigger chunk of cheese, munch it delightedly, pity-hug Mr. Randi, burp and laugh all the way to the bank?

If this doesn't make you think, you probably like your bandwagon seat too much.

 

[The Atheist]

Isn't it interesting that, at an hourly rate of let's say $125,000

Or, as I tell the ones who charge $3-99 per minute for telephone psychic-fraud, why spend 250626 minutes on the phone [4177 hours], when they could clean the whole lot up in 10 minutes.

 

[Jeff Corkern]

Thank you all for your responses. They were most informative.

I did not know about the FAQ. I'll certainly check it out. And maybe even try the e-mail thing.

I had no intention to insult anyone. I apologize if I've offended anyone. But I've gotten a lot of what are basically adolescent responses, and I just wanted to draw the attention of the adults for a bit.

 

[The Atheist]

I had no intention to insult anyone. I apologize if I've offended anyone. But I've gotten a lot of what are basically adolescent responses, and I just wanted to draw the attention of the adults for a bit.

What a strange person.

You hadn't insulted anyone as far as I can see, nor had you had adolescent or insulting replies.

Accordingly, I find your attitude, which I can sum up as follows:

I didn't intend to insult anyone, but I will now! Your responses are childish and you're a bunch of juveniles. Please take me to your grown ups.

most peculiar.

Not sure what you're after, but if you want insults and abuse, you definitely have the right person, just the wrong room, but we'll fix that when it gets shifted to AAH.

Your move.

 

[The Atheist]

In fact, I just read all the replies again and I'd say we had all been pretty resonsive in giving honest, adult opinions, all by people who have experience in dealing with claimants attracted by the mio.

It should be pretty obvious, even to a raging noob, that if you want to talk to the organ-grinder, you e mail the boss. If you want to talk to the monkeys [or watchdogs, if you prefer], you come to the forum.

 

[Tricky]

What is the ultimate purpose of the Million-Dollar Challenge? What is it out to prove, in the final analysis?

For years now, NOBODY has successfully passed the criteria of the Million-Dollar Challenge. To be able to reproduce various claims of the paranormal under rigorous laboratory conditions.

And this means---what?

I mean, what's the overall purpose here? A MILLION DOLLARS has been put up for grabs. That's a lotta money, man. Putting THAT much money up for grabs points to some really HUGE, deadly serious purpose.

What is it?

If y'all please, I'd like to hear from the adults on this one, the people who run the JREF forums. From Randi himself, if he's available.

What's it all about?

Speaking only for myself, I find the Randi Challenge to be a remarkable tool. In any discussion of what is real and what is not, it is a simple way to "cut to the chase". Since words will never convince anyone, it is a solid, honest and direct way to evaluate statements of how the world works. It is so simple that anyone can understand it. It is so open that no one can contest its fairness.

Although, as Randi admits, the challenge is not by nature a scientific experiment (though it varies) it is based on the scientific principle of making then testing a hypothesis. This in and of itself would be valuable (as the popularity of such shows as "Mythbusters" demonstrates) but the fact that it does so to keep people from being taken in by charlatans makes it all the more valuable.

If you would like to discuss it more without prying eyes, I invite you to PM me. I certify that I am over (a good bit over) the age of 21.

 

[Moochie]

What a strange person.

You hadn't insulted anyone as far as I can see, nor had you had adolescent or insulting replies.

Accordingly, I find your attitude, which I can sum up as follows:



most peculiar.

Not sure what you're after, but if you want insults and abuse, you definitely have the right person, just the wrong room, but we'll fix that when it gets shifted to AAH.

Your move.

I'm ready!




M.

 

[7th sextile]

What a strange person.

You hadn't insulted anyone as far as I can see, nor had you had adolescent or insulting replies.

Accordingly, I find your attitude, which I can sum up as follows:



most peculiar.

Not sure what you're after, but if you want insults and abuse, you definitely have the right person, just the wrong room, but we'll fix that when it gets shifted to AAH.

Your move.

I don't think Jeff C meant he'd gotten adolescent replies in THIS thread.

 

[hellaeon]

After thinking of the post for a time, I can summize the idea of the challenge in simple laymans terms.

Put up or shut up

Thankyou

 

[maatorc]

What is the ultimate purpose of the Million-Dollar Challenge? What is it out to prove, in the final analysis?
For years now, NOBODY has successfully passed the criteria of the Million-Dollar Challenge. To be able to reproduce various claims of the paranormal under rigorous laboratory conditions. And this means---what?
I mean, what's the overall purpose here? A MILLION DOLLARS has been put up for grabs. That's a lotta money, man. Putting THAT much money up for grabs points to some really HUGE, deadly serious purpose. What is it? If y'all please, I'd like to hear from the adults on this one, the people who run the JREF forums. From Randi himself, if he's available. What's it all about?

If one reads the MDC Rules carefully the requirement is not to demonstrate an actual psychic, supernatural or occult power or event, but rather a power or event currently merely scientifically inexplicable, because if such a power or event were already proven to be, not merely just accepted as what is generally called paranormal, as is the case with list in the Rules, there would be no need for the JREF MDC.

 

[GzuzKryzt]

If one reads the MDC Rules carefully the requirement is not to demonstrate an actual psychic, supernatural or occult power or event, but rather a power or event currently merely scientifically inexplicable, because if such a power or event were already proven to be, not merely just accepted as what is generally called paranormal, as is the case with list in the Rules, there would be no need for the JREF MDC.

Hey maatorc, you're back. And with the same argument. Will you continue to bicker in your usual nitpicky over-semantic way, receive counterargument after counterargument and then leave again?

I'll start: The MDC Rules do require showing "under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event."

We've had this discussion before haven't we?

 

[maatorc]

1... Hey maatorc, you're back. And with the same argument. Will you continue to bicker in your usual nitpicky over-semantic way, receive counterargument after counterargument and then leave again?
2... I'll start: The MDC Rules do require showing "under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event." We've had this discussion before haven't we?

1... You are falsely presuming I am attacking the MDC. The same points are repeatedly raised and there is no reason why the same arguments cannot be put, as you frequently do yourself.
2... What I am saying is that had any so-called "psychic, supernatural or paranormal" power or event been proven to have been scientifically and materially demonstrated then science and presumambly the JREF with the world at large would be privy to this proof: There is none.
It is not an attack on the JREF to say its position is that there are no such things as 'paranormal' events or powers; and to the extent that there is no scientific proof that any of the 'paranormal' events or powers addressed by the JREF MDC are actually paranormal, it is right.
On this basis the MDC cannot be testing for actual psychic, supernatural or paranormal powers or events because scientifically speaking none exist.
The mutually accepted testing protocols will not prove the demonstrated power or event is actually paranormal, only that the parties agree it is something they accept as paranormal.
If anyone ever satisfactorily demonstrates something currently scientifically inexplicable, that in itself will will be a worthy result for the JREF MDC.
The impossibility of the JREF MDC proving a demonstration is actually paranormal has effectively, and in the event generously, lowered the demonstration bar for claimants: They do not have to demonstrate actual paranormal powers, only something currently scientifically inexplicable.

 

[Porterboy]

The simple answer is that it has achieved some goals and failed on others.

It has achieved a raising in the profile of scepticism, helped grow JREF and this forum, and has generated publicity. There will be no doubt that many people have changed their views on paranormality as a result of JREF who got there due to publicity about the challenge.

The failure has been in slowing down the drift of people into idiotic stuff like astrology, psychics and mediums.

It has also achieved something else. It has affirmed the definition of what is and is not proof for Woos like me who do believe in astorlogy, psychics and mediums and who do not consider it idiotic.

In the past more paranormalists were inclined to offer proof of something than they do today, or this is what I have observed, being a regular attendee at a Spiritualist church. The confidence with which so many of them take up the $Million Challenge makes me cringe. At the end of the day, nobody has been able to prove scientifically in psychic abilities, and they probably never will. This then leads Woos like myself to follow one of two routes: You can embrace skepticism and abandon Wooism altogether, or you can develop understanding of reality through nonscientific means.

I fall into the latter category for reasons I've written about before.