What Happened With Dr. Vass

[Major Major]

Well, I found out what happened with Dr. Arpad Vass. As you know, Bob, he is the researcher at the Body Farm in Tennessee who claimed he could dowse for bodies. He was invited to take the Million Dollar Challenge, but it seemed nothing happened.

On Google Books, no less, there is a book titled Behind the Yellow Tape: On the Road with Some of America's Hardest Working Crime Scene Investigators, by Jarrett Hallcox, Amy Welch, and Patricia Cornwell. This gallant trio says: "Some kooks even challenged us and Dr. Vass to take a Million Dollar Challenge" [Page 118].

They said in effect that if you don't believe they're right they'll never be able to prove it to you, declined, blocked the [presumably JREF] email, and went their merry way.

Nice to know how that came out.

 

[dropzone]

Interested too, but with Patricia Cornwell on the team, whose forensic chops stem from six years as as a technical writer and then as a computer analyst for the Office of the Chief Medical Examiner of Virginia with a BA in English, with not even a degree in Forensics from a for-profit school advertised in spam, I tend to not take her "chops" as supportive of squat, outside technical writing, computer analysis (Ca 1990), and writing potboilers.

Just asking questions, but do authors NOT file cease and desist orders when Google Books publish their books because they hope the deleted pages will cause people to buy their books or is it because they can't afford lawyers?

ETA: If The Body Farm is hiring nutcases whose heightened or better-tuned sense of smell means they can mystically detect Stiff Whiff then, despite proximity, I'm offering my body to Goofy Goff, in Hawaii. Assuming he can learn anything from the morbidly obese. Otherwise, I'm off to someplace that would leave me a skeleton in someone's closet.

ETAA: That's the only way I'm getting to Hawaii, especially without losing a lot of weight.

 

[Dumb All Over]

Yesterday, during cross-examination in the Casey Anthony murder trial in Orlando, Defense Counsel Jose Baez asked Dr. Arpad Vass if he had ever been offered one million dollars to prove his claim that he can find buried, dead bodies using only dowsing rods. Prosecutors objected to the question and the objection was sustained by Judge Belvin Perry, Jr.

Thought you'd like to know.

 

[Major Major]

Yesterday, during cross-examination in the Casey Anthony murder trial in Orlando, Defense Counsel Jose Baez asked Dr. Arpad Vass if he had ever been offered one million dollars to prove his claim that he can find buried, dead bodies using only dowsing rods. Prosecutors objected to the question and the objection was sustained by Judge Belvin Perry, Jr.

Thought you'd like to know.

I also noticed that the Defense Counsel's entire line of argument against him was thrown out. I think Baez has an assistant who can search Google, who looked for anything he could use against Dr. Vass.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Yesterday, during cross-examination in the Casey Anthony murder trial in Orlando, Defense Counsel Jose Baez asked Dr. Arpad Vass if he had ever been offered one million dollars to prove his claim that he can find buried, dead bodies using only dowsing rods. Prosecutors objected to the question and the objection was sustained by Judge Belvin Perry, Jr.

Thought you'd like to know.

I haven't been watching it. Is he testifying for the defense? What's his deal?

 

[Aepervius]

I haven't been watching it. Is he testifying for the defense? What's his deal?

I dunno , but I somehow smell a corpse rat.

 

[Dumb All Over]

I haven't been watching it. Is he testifying for the defense? What's his deal?

He is testifying for the prosecution as an expert witness on the decomposition of human bodies.

 

[dropzone]

If he is testifying only on that expertise, which it appears he has or he wouldn't work at the Body Farm, his other odd beliefs should be irrelevant.

 

[Audible Click]

I was fascinated with Dr. Vass' testimony mainly because he has a speech impediment that causes him to sound like Elmer Fudd.

 

[wasapi]

I was fascinated with Dr. Vass' testimony mainly because he has a speech impediment that causes him to sound like Elmer Fudd.

Oh, the first thing I thought of when he began speaking was Donald Duck. Your impression is probably more accurate. I almost expected to hear some stiffled chuckels from the gallary. I didn't realize he had ever asked to be considered for the million dollar challenge. It had to do with dowsing? What type of reputation does he have?

 

[wasapi]

Oh, sorry. I started at the OP and read down, duh, and answered my own questions. It's been a long day.

 

[ForgePoet]

Maybe my google-fu isn't so great, but the only references to the dowsing thing I'm seeing are on this forum and in a single book. Are there any other sources?

From the other thread, did Dr. Vass ever actually publish his findings as promised? Am I the only one who suspects this was a joke blown out of proportion?

I'd rather discuss the validity and future of the mass spec technique. Does anyone have any further details about it?

Or we could make fun of the guy's accent some more, I guess.

 

[edge]

He did get to say it was a hobby he was looking into.

 

[dropzone]

(Oh, I can donate AFTER they have cut off everything still useful? I'm 57, morbidly obese, and nearsighted. On the other hand, there's plenty of skin.)

Though I haven't finished the paperwork, he can still try to find my corpse, but the BIG FREAKING LUMP might give it away.

Note to self: Before the end, try making a shallow grave less of a joke. Dr Vass will appreciate the challenge.

 

[Major Major]

Well, I found out what happened with Dr. Arpad Vass. As you know, Bob, he is the researcher at the Body Farm in Tennessee who claimed he could dowse for bodies. He was invited to take the Million Dollar Challenge, but it seemed nothing happened.

On Google Books, no less, there is a book titled Behind the Yellow Tape: On the Road with Some of America's Hardest Working Crime Scene Investigators, by Jarrett Hallcox, Amy Welch, and Patricia Cornwell. This gallant trio says: "Some kooks even challenged us and Dr. Vass to take a Million Dollar Challenge" [Page 118].

They said in effect that if you don't believe they're right they'll never be able to prove it to you, declined, blocked the [presumably JREF] email, and went their merry way.

Nice to know how that came out.

I noticed the derail. It got into a discussion of Patricia Cornwall, of the Casey Anthony trial, and everything but the relevant issue.

Which is:

The JREF has no credibility among believers in the paranormal.

Google "Randi Million Dollar" -- "Prize" or "Challenge", it doesn't matter which. What you will find is that many of the people who might take the test, like for example Dr. Vass and his associates, won't do so because they do not have any confidence that the JREF will treat them honestly.

They think there will not be an honest judging of a claim. Some do not even believe there is any money behind the prize.

The atmosphere of mockery that pervades the discussion does not help.

And of course, any claimant has one proof: "I always have an out."

In other words -- as they see it, not as you see it -- Randi has said, "I won't pay no matter what."

And the JREF can't get across the contrary. I think it's because of a lack of credibility.

CSI has the same problem. If anyone tries to mention them as an investigative group, "sTARBABY" gets flung in his face. The perception of the Gauquelin case is that CSI [CSICOP, as it was then] was not objective or honest. They can't dispel that perception. They have no credibility.

And similarly, it seems that JREF has no credibility. It's unfortunate.

The people at the JREF saying, "How absurd! Of course we're credible! The Million Dollars is real and will be paid according to the agreement!" misses the point. It's not what you know about yourself; it's how others see you. Perception and reality are far too often opposite.

Other people believe what they believe, not what you find it convenient for them to believe. That they think the same way themselves doesn't make this any less true.

 

[Darth Rotor]

What Happened With Dr. Vass

You should show him more deference.

As to the MDC ... when someone puts up a demonstration that meets the protocol, that will speak with all the volume that is necessary.

And the JREF can't get across the contrary. I think it's because of a lack of credibility.

CSI has the same problem. If anyone tries to mention them as an investigative group, "sTARBABY" gets flung in his face. The perception of the Gauquelin case is that CSI [CSICOP, as it was then] was not objective or honest. They can't dispel that perception. They have no credibility.

And similarly, it seems that JREF has no credibility. It's unfortunate.

The people at the JREF saying, "How absurd! Of course we're credible! The Million Dollars is real and will be paid according to the agreement!" misses the point. It's not what you know about yourself; it's how others see you. Perception and reality are far too often opposite.

 

[Gr8wight]

Google "Randi Million Dollar" -- "Prize" or "Challenge", it doesn't matter which. What you will find is that many of the people who might take the test, like for example Dr. Vass and his associates, won't do so because they do not have any confidence that the JREF will treat them honestly.

They think there will not be an honest judging of a claim. Some do not even believe there is any money behind the prize.

Well that's what they claim. They won't take the challenge because they know they are unable to win it. The accusations that Randi will cheat, or that the money isn't real are simply the smokescreen they use to obfuscate the fact that they can't really do what they claim, and the challenge would reveal them for the charlatans that they are.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Well that's what they claim. They won't take the challenge because they know they are unable to win it. The accusations that Randi will cheat, or that the money isn't real are simply the smokescreen they use to obfuscate the fact that they can't really do what they claim, and the challenge would reveal them for the charlatans that they are.

Plus as is usually pointed out by the ebil skeptricks, take a test, pass it (as determined by in dependant observers) and prove Randi a liar for not paying up.

 

[Major Major]

You should show him more deference.

As to the MDC ... when someone puts up a demonstration that meets the protocol, that will speak with all the volume that is necessary.

Well that's what they claim. They won't take the challenge because they know they are unable to win it. The accusations that Randi will cheat, or that the money isn't real are simply the smokescreen they use to obfuscate the fact that they can't really do what they claim, and the challenge would reveal them for the charlatans that they are.

Plus as is usually pointed out by the ebil skeptricks, take a test, pass it (as determined by in dependant observers) and prove Randi a liar for not paying up.

Thank you all for proving my point.

That is how you think they think.

And in turn they think you all know perfectly well that the paranormal powers exist, but acknowledging them would be inconvenient, or painful, or shattering to your world-view, so you deny them.

Thus Dr. Vass's people's observation that they can't prove the existence of dowsing to people who don't think it's possible.

 

[Pixel42]

And in turn they think you all know perfectly well that the paranormal powers exist, but acknowledging them would be inconvenient, or painful, or shattering to your world-view, so you deny them.

I'm quite sure there are, indeed, people who think that. But there are plenty of con artists who know they'd never fool Randi too.

Thus Dr. Vass's people's observation that they can't prove the existence of dowsing to people who don't think it's possible.

But all they need do to prove the existence of dowsing is to publicly demonstrate it using the same kind of rigorous test protocol that JREF would use.

Yet they don't.