UPI: Dalai Lama urges respect

ttch

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According to this news item:

Dalai Lama urges respect

The Dalai Lama believes that respect for other religions trumps proselytizing. There is no need to convert from one religion to another; "all different traditions have (the) same potential to bring inner peace, inner value, and therefore it is important to keep one's own tradition."

Does this mean that he considers that his ancestors' conversion to Buddhism was a mistake? Does he believe it was wrong for Buddhists to proselytize them? Did anyone at the lecture ask him these obvious questions?

Or were all past conversions to Buddhism due to everyone noticing how content the passing Buddhists were and deciding to take it up themselves? Or, now that Buddhism is established, is it just that "the other guy's" religion, or perhaps the "new" religions, that shouldn't proselytize anymore?

Just wonderin'.
 
ttch said:
According to this news item:

Dalai Lama urges respect

The Dalai Lama believes that respect for other religions trumps proselytizing. There is no need to convert from one religion to another; "all different traditions have (the) same potential to bring inner peace, inner value, and therefore it is important to keep one's own tradition."

Does this mean that he considers that his ancestors' conversion to Buddhism was a mistake? Does he believe it was wrong for Buddhists to proselytize them? Did anyone at the lecture ask him these obvious questions?

Or were all past conversions to Buddhism due to everyone noticing how content the passing Buddhists were and deciding to take it up themselves? Or, now that Buddhism is established, is it just that "the other guy's" religion, or perhaps the "new" religions, that shouldn't proselytize anymore?

Just wonderin'.
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It means pushing your views on religion down other people's throats is wrong and people should feel free to choose which religion suits them.
 
He's means that since he's feeling really comfortable in his position as grand mucky-muck of his cult, it would be rude for anyone to try to steal his followers and his power. I doubt that he means that he should behave any differently towards other religions if he decides to go after more recruits.
 
JoeEllison said:
He's means that since he's feeling really comfortable in his position as grand mucky-muck of his cult, it would be rude for anyone to try to steal his followers and his power. I doubt that he means that he should behave any differently towards other religions if he decides to go after more recruits.
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Oh yea, since Buddhism is a racket he just happened to start. We all know about his evil exploitive practices and abuses. Being a religious leader he logically must be a sinister manipulative lowlife. Wouldn't be surprised if he raped children and drowned kittens on his spare time :rolleyes:
 
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AkuManiMani said:
Oh yea, since Buddhism is a racket he just happened to start.
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You don't have to start a scam in order to profit from it.
We all know about his evil exploitive practices and abuses.
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No, only some of us do... other pretend that his position and foolish Hallmark card phrases mean that he's above scrutiny.
Being a religious leader he logically must be a sinister manipulative lowlife.
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No, being a sinister manipulative lowlife, it is no surprise that he's a religious leader.
Wouldn't be surprised if he raped children and drowned kittens on his spare time :rolleyes:
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You said it, not me. I didn't say he was more eviler than Skeletor.
 
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JoeEllison said:
You don't have to start a scam in order to profit from it.
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He ain't get his position from political maneuvering on his part. He was selected as a kid by perverted old monks. I guess they must have a sense for evil :p

JoeEllison said:
No, only some of us do... other pretend that his position and foolish Hallmark card phrases mean that he's above scrutiny.
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Please elaborate on his Machiavellian machinations -- or do they just extend to printing Hallmark cards? :confused:

JoeEllison said:
No, being a sinister manipulative lowlife, it is no surprise that he's a religious leader.
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Like I said before he was chosen to be a Sith Lo-- I mean the Dalai Lama as a child.

JoeEllison said:
You said it, not me. I didn't say he was more eviler than Skeletor.
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This dude makes Skeletor look like Mother Theresa. Oh wait...she was de facto evil incarnate to -- never mind. Can't trust any of them religious leaders. They're all after our monies and children.
 
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Life is a bit too short to deal in silliness and strawmen. If you are interested in real discussion, instead of making up both sides of the discussion so that you can feel superior, let me know.
 
JoeEllison said:
Life is a bit too short to deal in silliness and strawmen. If you are interested in real discussion, instead of making up both sides of the discussion so that you can feel superior, let me know.
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Wait -- you mean I'm not superior?

....

I kid! I kid!

Geeze man, wheres your sense of humor? You could have atleast played along :(

*ahem*

But seriously, aside from being a religious leader, what is he guilty of specifically? You got something on the guy you'd like to share?
 
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AkuManiMani said:
But seriously, aside from being a religious leader, what is he guilty of specifically? You got something on the guy you'd like to share?
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He exploits his position for his own benefit. He's not special amongst religious leaders, since they almost all do it. Like I said, he's comfortable where he is, and there's every motivation in the world for him touse his power and influence to suggest to people that he be allowed to maintain that power and influence.
 
JoeEllison said:
He exploits his position for his own benefit. He's not special amongst religious leaders, since they almost all do it. Like I said, he's comfortable where he is, and there's every motivation in the world for him touse his power and influence to suggest to people that he be allowed to maintain that power and influence.
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I think I get what you're sayin'. The guy's got what you feel is undue clout [base upon his allaged status at the re-incarnation of a long-dead 'holyman'] and you don't like him throwing his weight around. That about the size of it?

While I understand your sentiment your conclusion that his appeal to respect different religions is some kind of cynical attempt to tell people to stay off his turf is a bit unfounded for a number a reasons.

For one thing, the conclusion you've drawn doesn't really follow from his appeal to "respect" the faith of others. While he does wield some influence and respect beyond the circle of Buddhism, due to his celebrity and reputation, it seems more likely that his primary audience is other buddhists. Its more than a bit of a stretch to take his statement as a command to Christians, Muslims, & Co. not to proselytize Buddhists. He has a lot of respect and influence but he doesn't wield the dictatorial powers of a cult leader (as far as I'm aware of) and people are pretty much free to heed his opinions or not. He also doesn't have the religious authority to 'excommunicate' or damn people to eternal hellfire so I don't understand where you get your charge that hes somehow trying to secure his "power".

I'm not arguing that he has some status as a super human being beyond criticism and reproach -- he is just human after all. With that being said, do you have any solid basis for defaming his personal character for reasons other than his religious persuasion or position? Something that you know that hes done or participated in that would cause you to view him as some kind of machiavellian kingpin? I'm not being sarcastic here. I'm genuinely curious.

Not to 'strawman' you but I get the impression that you view all religious figures -- by default -- to be sharks, wolves, and L.Ron Hubbards who are hardcore cynical hypocrites. Could it be possible that hes actually a sincere person despite being a religious figure? If not, could you be specific as to why you think he is not?
 
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ttch said:
According to this news item:

Dalai Lama urges respect

The Dalai Lama believes that respect for other religions trumps proselytizing. There is no need to convert from one religion to another; "all different traditions have (the) same potential to bring inner peace, inner value, and therefore it is important to keep one's own tradition."

Does this mean that he considers that his ancestors' conversion to Buddhism was a mistake? Does he believe it was wrong for Buddhists to proselytize them? Did anyone at the lecture ask him these obvious questions?

Or were all past conversions to Buddhism due to everyone noticing how content the passing Buddhists were and deciding to take it up themselves? Or, now that Buddhism is established, is it just that "the other guy's" religion, or perhaps the "new" religions, that shouldn't proselytize anymore?

Just wonderin'.
Click to expand...

Just wondering, ever read much about buddhism?

The tradition is that a teacher will not speak until a student has asked three times to be instructed.

And when was the last time you saw a buddhist preaching on a college campus, standing on a soap box.

Theoreticaly the choice to follow the buddha's teaching is self determined.
 
JoeEllison said:
He's means that since he's feeling really comfortable in his position as grand mucky-muck of his cult, it would be rude for anyone to try to steal his followers and his power. I doubt that he means that he should behave any differently towards other religions if he decides to go after more recruits.
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Sure, whatever, evidence from his statements?

BTW, did you know what he said when Katie Couric asked him how he wanted to be remembered or what his legacy would be?


Silly Rabbit Kicks are for Trids!
 
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There was a system of feudal serfdom under the rule of the Lama class in old Tibet, prior to the Chinese invasion in 1950. Tibetan serfs (read: slaves) basically lived in squalor and were subject to torture and abuse. Penn & Teller covered this in one of their episodes "Holier Than Thou" but I can't find much information on this that doesn't read like Chinese propaganda. Their argument though, which I agree with, was that the lesser of two evils is still evil, and the enemy of my enemy is not my friend. I don't know how much of this could be legitimately blamed on the current Dalai Lama, since he was only born in 1933. However, in their belief system where he's the reincarnated leader, he certainly enjoys the credit for the actions of his predecessors. Why not the blame then?

A fairly comprehensive article, but I think the writer is a conspiracy theorist, so I'd take it with a grain of salt.
http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html

Two sides of the story from one of those "free Tibet" sites.
http://www.rangzen.com/history/views.htm#liberated

Also, there was the Lama's involvement with the CIA when they were training Tibetan guerrilla fighters at Camp Hale.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Hale
 
Silentknight said:
There was a system of feudal serfdom under the rule of the Lama class in old Tibet, prior to the Chinese invasion in 1950. Tibetan serfs (read: slaves)
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No don't read slaves. British empire invaded in 1904. If they had found slavery they would have stayed rather longer untill it was abolished. The empire may have been fairly relaxed about killing people but slavery was definetly not on.
 
Silentknight said:
There was a system of feudal serfdom under the rule of the Lama class in old Tibet, prior to the Chinese invasion in 1950. Tibetan serfs (read: slaves) basically lived in squalor and were subject to torture and abuse. Penn & Teller covered this in one of their episodes "Holier Than Thou" but I can't find much information on this that doesn't read like Chinese propaganda. Their argument though, which I agree with, was that the lesser of two evils is still evil, and the enemy of my enemy is not my friend. I don't know how much of this could be legitimately blamed on the current Dalai Lama, since he was only born in 1933. However, in their belief system where he's the reincarnated leader, he certainly enjoys the credit for the actions of his predecessors. Why not the blame then?
Click to expand...

Because being as how we're not Buddhist we don't buy into all that reincarnation stuff, do we? We rational atheists judge people as individuals, or so I hear.

Silentknight said:
A fairly comprehensive article, but I think the writer is a conspiracy theorist, so I'd take it with a grain of salt.
http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html
Click to expand...

Best to take what all people say with a grain of salt, whether is Penn & Teller or this CT fellow whom you seem not to trust but cite anyway.

BTW, are the theories of this guy outlandish or plausible? What are they specifically? Conspiracies of all sorts are not exactly in the realm of science fiction -- they're a constant of history, really. I don't consider a person to have less credibility merely by virtue of them suspecting one.

Silentknight said:
Two sides of the story from one of those "free Tibet" sites.
http://www.rangzen.com/history/views.htm#liberated
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Erm...sure. China "liberated" Tibet in much the same way that the US "liberated' Iraq. Except in the case of China they carried out a brutal campaign of cultural genocide. The CCP committed atrocities during their "liberation" that make Abu Ghraib look like mere school yard bullying. It didn't make matters any better that the venerable Chairman Mao was running things at the time -- oh boy...

Silentknight said:
Also, there was the Lama's involvement with the CIA when they were training Tibetan guerrilla fighters at Camp Hale.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camp_Hale
Click to expand...

Well its a relief to know the guy does have some contact with reality and isn't a complete lay-me-down-to-die pacifist.
 
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