The Wailing Wall and Fort Antonia

GT/CS

Illuminator
GT/CS
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GT/CS said:
Here is a link to a site that claims the Wailing Wall is not part of Solomon's Temple, but instead is a portion of Fort Antonia, built by the Romans.
http://beginningandend.com/secret-of-the-lost-temple-the-real-location-of-solomons-temple-revealed/

It makes sense to me but it's the first article I've read regarding the location of Solomon's Temple, so I haven't yet seen the other side of the argument.

Is the below layout accepted by mainstream Christians or Jews?
Click to expand...

Mainstream Christians probably don't give it much thought. Among those Jews who care, and some of them do, I think they believe that the temple was up there on the hilltop somewhere, and not in the City of David.

I don't know what mainstream archeologists have to say about it. Their opininon might be more respected on this site. I have previously read that the Wailing Wall was of Roman construction, part of the fort, and had nothing to do with the Temple, but I don't know whether they would say that the Temple was in an entirely different location, or somewhere on that same hill where the Dome of the Rock now rests, and which is called Temple Mount.
 
GT/CS said:
Here is a link to a site that claims the Wailing Wall is not part of Solomon's Temple, but instead is a portion of Fort Antonia, built by the Romans.
http://beginningandend.com/secret-of-the-lost-temple-the-real-location-of-solomons-temple-revealed/

It makes sense to me but it's the first article I've read regarding the location of Solomon's Temple, so I haven't yet seen the other side of the argument.

Is the below layout accepted by mainstream Christians or Jews?
Click to expand...

Meadmaker said:
Mainstream Christians probably don't give it much thought. Among those Jews who care, and some of them do, I think they believe that the temple was up there on the hilltop somewhere, and not in the City of David.

I don't know what mainstream archeologists have to say about it. Their opininon might be more respected on this site. I have previously read that the Wailing Wall was of Roman construction, part of the fort, and had nothing to do with the Temple, but I don't know whether they would say that the Temple was in an entirely different location, or somewhere on that same hill where the Dome of the Rock now rests, and which is called Temple Mount.
Click to expand...

I wonder what political effect it would have if it could be proved with certainty that no, it was not part of the temple. Would the Jews and Muslims stop fighting over it?
 
GT/CS said:
It makes sense to me but it's the first article I've read regarding the location of Solomon's Temple, so I haven't yet seen the other side of the argument.
Click to expand...


My dim memory of hebrew school informs me that the wall is generally considered to be the very outermost exterior of the Great Temple area. It wasn't strictly part of the Temple. I wouldn't be surprised, though. All sorts of things in Israel attributed to Solomon were actually built under Romans occupation.

I've been there, if that helps. It was hot.
 
acbytesla said:
I wonder what political effect it would have if it could be proved with certainty that no, it was not part of the temple. Would the Jews and Muslims stop fighting over it?
Click to expand...

The site holds the Masjid al-Aqsa, which is the holy site to Muslims. It's holy because it's mentioned in the Qur'an more than anything else.
 
acbytesla said:
I wonder what political effect it would have if it could be proved with certainty that no, it was not part of the temple. Would the Jews and Muslims stop fighting over it?
Click to expand...

Not likely. The site would still be holy to Muslims.

It would mess up the Jews something fierce, though. Traditional Jewish views, as expressed by the head rabbis, is that Jews should not go up to the Temple Mount anyway. The place where the Ark of the Covenant rested, called the "Holy of Holies" was a forbidden spot. Since no one knows exactly where it was, Jewish teaching is to avoid the whole area, so "mainstream" Jews are perfectly happy to let Muslims tramp around up there. If it were determined that the Temple wasn't there after all, suddenly the place where it actually was would be the new holy ground, and that could just mess things up. If it really were determined to be in the City of David, who knows what would happen?

However, I looked up some web sites, and mainstream archeology seems to believe that the temple was in fact on Temple Mount. As for the Wailing Wall, it is not believed to be part of the Temple, but in fact it hasn't been assumed to be part of the Temple for quite some time. It's unclear whether it was built as part of the Roman fort, or whether it was incorporated into the fort. Whatever it was, it was part of a wall that protected something that was on Temple Mount, and the Temple was up there somewhere, and that's really all that Jews say about it anyway. They don't actually believe it was part of the Temple itself, but rather part of the wall that surrounded the Temple complex.
 
GT/CS said:
Here is a link to a site that claims the Wailing Wall is not part of Solomon's Temple, but instead is a portion of Fort Antonia, built by the Romans.
http://beginningandend.com/secret-of-the-lost-temple-the-real-location-of-solomons-temple-revealed/

It makes sense to me but it's the first article I've read regarding the location of Solomon's Temple, so I haven't yet seen the other side of the argument.

Is the below layout accepted by mainstream Christians or Jews?
Click to expand...
Nobody ever claimed that the Wailing Wall was part of Solomon's Temple, aka the First Temple. That one was destroyed by the Babylonians. After the Babylonian Captivity, Ezra built the Second Temple. Herod the Great built some extensions to the Second Temple, and the Wailing Wall is actually part of those Herodian extensions.

There is no archaeological evidence of Solomon's Temple, especially not on Temple Mount: Israel has given custody of the mount to the Islamic Wafq, and they forbid excavations. Besides that, the general archaeological evidence suggests that Jerusalem in the alleged times of alleged Solomon was only a village and would not have supported a temple. If there was a "first" temple in Jerusalem, it would have been of later date.
 
CORed said:
Nothing. Few, if any religious people really care that their religion is irrational. Some know it, and still don't care.
Click to expand...

It seems a little like all the Trump Nemesis fantasies over the past couple years: If I could just get this One Thing out there, people would understand, and agree, and act with me!
 
TubbaBlubba said:
The site holds the Masjid al-Aqsa, which is the holy site to Muslims. It's holy because it's mentioned in the Qur'an more than anything else.
Click to expand...

I know that. The point being it no longer is part of the Jewish Temple. Couldn't the Jews then stop fighting over this holy site, since it would no longer be holy to the Jews?
 
A documentary producer was making a film about world religions. He was doing filming and interviews as the Wailing Wall. The filmmaker called an old man over as he left his prayers, explained what they were doing, and asked him. "Sir, do you come here a lot?" The man answered, "I come here every day to pray, and I have done so for 50 years." The filmmaker asked, "What sort of prayers do you pray?" and the man replied, "Every day, I pray for peace between the Arabs and the Jews." The filmmaker said, "You must be very disappointed at the recent outbreak of violence on your borders. How does it make you feel?"

The man answered, "It makes me feel like I'm talking to a friggin' wall."



**********************
In all seriousness, the Jews aren't really fighting over the Temple Mount, at least lately. It's forbidden territory to them, religiously. The secular Israeli authorities that exercise security at the place will let anyone up there. However, that might be changing, as some factions have started making noises about making the Temple Mount Jewish again.

The Jews, on the other hand, do want control of the remainder of Jerusalem, and so they want to control access to the Temple Mount. In other words, they want to own it, but they don't want to use it. I guess it's rental property, or something?
 
GT/CS said:
Here is a link to a site that claims the Wailing Wall is not part of Solomon's Temple, but instead is a portion of Fort Antonia, built by the Romans.
Click to expand...

No one has ever claimed that the Western Wall was part of the 2nd Jewish Temple.

The temple itself was rather small and sat ontop of the Temple Mount/Haram Al-Sharif.

The Western Wall, is simply part of the inner retaining wall of the Temple Mount. There are two sections, the most larger being the Western Wall and a smaller section being the "Little Western Wall".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Western_Wall

As to this being part of the Roman Fortress Antolia, this idea is preposterous as the fort itself was on the northeast end of the city, while the Western Wall is on southeast end.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonia_Fortress
 
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The Old City of Jerusalem is holy to Christians, Muslims and Jews.

All three should share in its rule or none should rule it.

Why can't adults in the 21st century learn to share nice things?
 
My post was poorly phrased. I know it isn’t claimed to be part of the actual temple, but part of the temple complex. The author of the article seems to be claiming that it isn’t any portion of any religious complex, it’s just a Roman fort.
I’m guessing that most folks don’t accept this theory because we continually see religious nuts bobbing away at the wall.
 
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