The Jenny McCarthy Body Count Is Now Online

[derekcbart]

Hello.

I wanted to let you know about the launch of the Jenny McCarthy Body Count website at http://www.jennymccarthybodycount.com

In June 2007 Jenny McCarthy began promoting anti-vaccination rhetoric. Because of her celebrity status she has appeared on several television shows and has published multiple books advising parents not to vaccinate their children. This has led to a dramatic increase in the number of vaccine preventable illnesses as well as an increase in the number of vaccine preventable deaths.

During 2008 many people have said that Jenny McCarthy has a body count attached to her name due to her anti-vaccination rhetoric. I wanted to find out what that body count was. Using the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Reports I was able to do so: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/

Is Jenny McCarthy directly responsible for every vaccine preventable illness and every vaccine preventable death listed on the website? No. However, as the unofficial spokesperson for the United States anti-vaccination movement she may be indirectly responsible for at least some of these illnesses and deaths and even one vaccine preventable illness or vaccine preventable death is too many.

Thank you.

-Derek

 

[fls]

During 2008 many people have said that Jenny McCarthy has a body count attached to her name due to her anti-vaccination rhetoric. I wanted to find out what that body count was. Using the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Reports I was able to do so: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/

What are you counting from the MMWR reports to get the numbers?

Linda

 

[Deetee]

Hello.

I wanted to let you know about the launch of the Jenny McCarthy Body Count website at http://www.jennymccarthybodycount.com

Nice presentation and idea.

Questions:
1. Which cases are you regarding as preventable- Just the vaccinatable childhood diseases?
2. Maybe I am missing something, but my addition of cases does not add up to the number you give.
3. Have you included pertussis? These numbers do not appear in the table, but do in the rolling 4-weekly graph.
4. Where do you get the stats on deaths from?

Corrections of fact/clarifications:
1. Thimerosal has never been used in MMR vaccine. It would kill the virus and inactivate the vaccine.
2. I understand Jenny is not blaming just thimerosal, but the whole vaccine kaboodle ("too many, too soon" & immune overload, other "toxins" etc)
3. Perhaps you should clarify and say "USA" somewhere in the title?
4. You/we cannot make the assumption that a fully-vaccinated population would have no cases at all of these diseases, something you might mention somehow (eg some types of meningo are not preventable currently; some of the meningococcal cases were due to types not covered by the vaccines)
5. You might want to post this over in the science/medicine forum also.

 

[SirPhilip]

Like Totally Eh!?

I always knew she'd have a body count one day. It's ironic they would be retarded.

 

[derekcbart]

What are you counting from the MMWR reports to get the numbers?

Linda

The CDC MMWR website is rather hard to navigate. After much searching I found two sections that contain the useful information.

The first is a summary of information that also includes information about MMR outbreaks and deaths, if any: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5811a4.htm I have to change the number after the "a" and then increase the four digit number "5811" to see the next week's reports.

The second is the Notifiable Diseases/Deaths: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5811md.htm#tab1 I use the list of the number of cases reported for the week. Like the other report I need to increase the four digit number "5811" in order to see the next week's report.

These are the diseases that I count for the website:
Diphtheria
Haemophitus Influenzae Serotype B
Influenza-Associated Pediatric Mortality
Measles
Meningococcal Disease A, C, Y, & W-135
Mumps
Poliomyelitis
Rubella
Tetanus

There are other diseases that children are vaccinated for, but I could not find statistics on those. In fact, as high as the numbers on the website may seem to be there is definitely a cautious undercount.

-Derek

 

[fls]

These are the diseases that I count for the website:
Diphtheria
Haemophitus Influenzae Serotype B
Influenza-Associated Pediatric Mortality
Measles
Meningococcal Disease A, C, Y, & W-135
Mumps
Poliomyelitis
Rubella
Tetanus

Thank you. I couldn't get the numbers to add up, but I did not consider Meningococcal Disease. As far as I know, it is not recommended for routine use in infants/children.

Do you know whether any of these deaths have occurred in children who should have been vaccinated since June 2007? The Influenza-Associated Pediatric Mortality seems a good bet, since each death will be related to a current vaccine, and it specifically relates to children. HIB will also be a pretty good bet just because of the age group in which it usually occurs. The rest seem kind of questionable - i.e. can they really be attributed to the lack of a recent vaccination?

Linda

 

[derekcbart]

Thank you. I couldn't get the numbers to add up, but I did not consider Meningococcal Disease. As far as I know, it is not recommended for routine use in infants/children.

Do you know whether any of these deaths have occurred in children who should have been vaccinated since June 2007? The Influenza-Associated Pediatric Mortality seems a good bet, since each death will be related to a current vaccine, and it specifically relates to children. HIB will also be a pretty good bet just because of the age group in which it usually occurs. The rest seem kind of questionable - i.e. can they really be attributed to the lack of a recent vaccination?

Linda

99% of the deaths listed on the website are from Influenza-Associated Pediatric Mortality. It is rare to actually die from one of the other diseases nowadays, but the outbreaks are attributed to people who were not vaccinated or their vaccine status was not known.

-Derek

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

What's the objective of the website?

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/...nel.Pubmed_DefaultReportPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

OBJECTIVES: The goals were (1) to obtain national estimates of the proportions of parents with indicators of vaccine doubt, (2) to identify factors associated with those parents, compared with parents reporting no vaccine doubt indicators, (3) to identify the specific vaccines that prompted doubt and the reasons why, and (4) to describe the main reasons parents changed their minds about delaying or refusing a vaccine for their child. METHODS: Data were from the National Immunization Survey (2003-2004). Groups included parents who ever got a vaccination for their child although they were not sure it was the best thing to do ("unsure"), delayed a vaccination for their child ("delayed"), or decided not to have their child get a vaccination ("refused"). RESULTS: A total of 3924 interviews were completed. Response rates were 57.9% in 2003 and 65.0% in 2004. Twenty-eight percent of parents responded yes to ever experiencing >or=1 of the outcome measures listed above. In separate analyses for each outcome measure, vaccine safety concern was a predictor for unsure, refused, and delayed parents. The largest proportions of unsure and refused parents chose varicella vaccine as the vaccine prompting their concern, whereas delayed parents most often reported "not a specific vaccine" as the vaccine prompting their concern. Most parents who delayed vaccines for their child did so for reasons related to their child's illness, unlike the unsure and refused parents. The largest proportion of parents who changed their minds about delaying or not getting a vaccination for their child listed "information or assurances from health care provider" as the main reason. CONCLUSIONS: Parents who exhibit doubts about immunizations are not all the same. This research suggests encouraging children's health care providers to solicit questions about vaccines, to establish a trusting relationship, and to provide appropriate educational materials to parents.

 

[paximperium]

Ivor come into a medical thread and uses this opportunity to attack doctors by throwing irrelevant studies around. What a surprise.

Ivor, why don't you do the decent thing and go start your own thread instead of derailing this one?

 

[fls]

99% of the deaths listed on the website are from Influenza-Associated Pediatric Mortality. It is rare to actually die from one of the other diseases nowadays, but the outbreaks are attributed to people who were not vaccinated or their vaccine status was not known.

-Derek

Okay. I was concerned about criticisms that the numbers may be inflated by including cases unrelated to recent (i.e. since June 2007) vaccinations. I second Deetee's point about trying to include Pertussis, as that one will also be reasonably related to recent vaccinations.

I think any concerns about over-counting can be countered by the likely under-reporting anyway.

Linda

 

[Steelmage]

I am still trying to remember when she was a playmate and very hot (now she is hot going on warm with this nonsense).

 

[derekcbart]

Okay. I was concerned about criticisms that the numbers may be inflated by including cases unrelated to recent (i.e. since June 2007) vaccinations. I second Deetee's point about trying to include Pertussis, as that one will also be reasonably related to recent vaccinations.

I think any concerns about over-counting can be countered by the likely under-reporting anyway.

Linda

I would like to include Pertussis, but unfortunately it is not included in the list of reportable diseases on the CDC Weekly Reports.

-Derek

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

Ivor come into a medical thread and uses this opportunity to attack doctors by throwing irrelevant studies around. What a surprise.

Ivor, why don't you do the decent thing and go start your own thread instead of derailing this one?

I just can't resist the opportunity you provide to demonstrate how poor a user interface for medical technology some doctors can be.

Perhaps this is why some parents get their trusted medical advice from C-list celebrities rather than medical professionals?

Rather than creating websites which simply polarise opinion, how about creating some which aim to educate those not fortunate enough to have a medical education on the risks and benefits of vaccination, in ways they can understand? E.g., using pictures rather than words or numbers to convey risk information.

 

[paximperium]

I just can't resist the opportunity you provide to demonstrate how poor a user interface for medical technology some doctors can be.

Perhaps this is why some parents get their trusted medical advice from C-list celebrities rather than medical professionals?

Rather than creating websites which simply polarise opinion, how about creating some which aim to educate those not fortunate enough to have a medical education on the risks and benefits of vaccination, in ways they can understand? E.g., using pictures rather than words or numbers to convey risk information.

Well looks like calling for decency from Ivor failed as I expected it to.

 

[Niggle]

I just can't resist the opportunity you provide to demonstrate how poor a user interface for medical technology some doctors can be.

Perhaps this is why some parents get their trusted medical advice from C-list celebrities rather than medical professionals?

Rather than creating websites which simply polarise opinion, how about creating some which aim to educate those not fortunate enough to have a medical education on the risks and benefits of vaccination, in ways they can understand? E.g., using pictures rather than words or numbers to convey risk information.

From the article you quoted:

"information or assurances from health care provider"

Note that the term "health care provide" these days includes such as chiropractors, homeopaths, naturopaths, and other non-scientific woo-masters. These are not what I would call "medical professionals" and are all more likely to advise their patients against conventional treatment, including vaccines. When you start your own thread on this, be sure to cite some statistics for the percentage of regular MDs who are advising against vaccinating children to prove your point here.

 

[Slayhamlet]

From the article you quoted:

"information or assurances from health care provider"

Note that the term "health care provide" these days includes such as chiropractors, homeopaths, naturopaths, and other non-scientific woo-masters. These are not what I would call "medical professionals" and are all more likely to advise their patients against conventional treatment, including vaccines. When you start your own thread on this, be sure to cite some statistics for the percentage of regular MDs who are advising against vaccinating children to prove your point here.

I think you misunderstood the abstract. It's about real medical professionals providing information to parents and assuring them about getting their children vaccinated.

 

[Chris Haynes]

I would like to include Pertussis, but unfortunately it is not included in the list of reportable diseases on the CDC Weekly Reports.

-Derek

Possibly because they depend on county and state reports. Try this:
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/appendices/G/cases&deaths.pdf

I have also found more information in the slide sets:
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/pink-slides.htm

By the way, the list is not made for cut and paste, so I hand keyed in some of the numbers (50 years apart). Here is a cut and paste of my text file (I dump it on certain blog posts, which is why the underscores, which are easier than nbsp!):

This is for pertussis:
Year___Cases__Deaths__Year___Cases__Deaths
2000____7867____ 12___1950__120718__1118
2001____7580____ 17___1951___68687___951
2002____9771____ 18___1952___45030___402
2003___11647____ 11___1953___37129___270
2004___25827____ 27___1954___60886___373
2005___25616____ 39___1955___62786___467
2006___15632____ 16___1956___31732___266
Total__03940____140_________426968__3847
The death figures for 2004 through 2006 are from this slide set:
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/Slides/Pertussis10.ppt#9 ... Slide 9. Of the 82 deaths from pertussis during 2004 through 2006, 69 were of infants under the age of three months, while the remaining 13 were older than three months.

It may need to be updated, since I did it about a year or so ago.

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

Wow! My second post misread and twisted to attempt to make me look like an idiot. That must be some kind of record.

You will of course note that the results say:

"The largest proportion of parents who changed their minds about delaying or not getting a vaccination for their child listed "information or assurances from health care provider" as the main reason."

I.e., what got parents to change their minds from not vaccinating or delaying vaccination of their children to having their children vaccinated was "information or assurances from health care provider".

Nothing about Jenny McCarthy there. Has she ever played (or dressed up as) a doctor or nurse ))?

What else can the lack of parents to vaccinate their children be but a failure to comprehend the risks and benefits of vaccination?

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

I leave criticism of the details to people more qualified than I am, but as for the overall idea: well done, Derek!

It's a point that needs to be made.