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Singapore hangs drug trafficker

Roadtoad

Bufo Caminus Inedibilis
Roadtoad
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Nov 27, 2002
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Yahoo ran this story.

SINGAPORE - Singapore executed a 25-year-old Australian on Friday for drug trafficking, despite numerous appeals from the Australian government and hours after the condemned man had a "beautiful last visit" with his family.

Nguyen Tuong Van was hanged before dawn as a dozen friends and supporters, dressed in black, kept an overnight vigil outside the maximum-security prison. His twin brother, Nguyen Khoa, was dressed in white.

Vigils were also held in cities around Australia, with bells and gongs sounding 25 times at the hour of his execution.

"The sentence was carried out this morning at Changi Prison," the Home Affairs Ministry said in an e-mailed statement.
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It's easy to sit over here and say, "Yeah, he had it coming. He was carrying dope, and he knew better." Problem is, for a similar crime in the states, he'd have been out in five years. Granted, we've got problems here, but there's something about this story that just grates on me, and I'm not sure I can put my finger on it.
 
Roadtoad said:
Yahoo ran this story.



It's easy to sit over here and say, "Yeah, he had it coming. He was carrying dope, and he knew better." Problem is, for a similar crime in the states, he'd have been out in five years. Granted, we've got problems here, but there's something about this story that just grates on me, and I'm not sure I can put my finger on it.
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One should remember that in Singapore you are fined, maybe jailed, for spitting (gross), throwing chewing gum, cigarette butts, not flushing a public toilet, and who knows what else. Compassion has little weight over principles when running a city state; but one has to concede that they are extremely successful at what they do.
 
Roadtoad said:
Problem is, for a similar crime in the states, he'd have been out in five years.
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Since he wasn't in the United States, I don't see why that's a problem. The citizens of Singapore have decided they will not tolerate drug trafficking. Sometimes I wish citizens of the United States felt the same.

Who knows though, if this cases gets enough media coverage, it might even save some other dumb Australians from the same fate.
 
On the other hand, there and here, it is a gross violation of free people to contract between each other, and pursue pleasures, without busybodies backed with armed police sticking their nose into it.

Hence, a person was just executed for a consentual crime, which is to say, a crime that no one was harmed except those that wanted to participate.

Lovely ****ing world.
 
Roadtoad said:
It's easy to sit over here and say, "Yeah, he had it coming. He was carrying dope, and he knew better." Problem is, for a similar crime in the states, he'd have been out in five years. Granted, we've got problems here, but there's something about this story that just grates on me, and I'm not sure I can put my finger on it.
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Maybe because instead of "eye for an eye", they seem to go by "life for an eye". Or that he was killed for ultimately ideological reasons. Or that he was smuggling drugs out of Singapore.
 
I guess it also gives a nice little fillip to the pro-death-penalty crowd in the USA... :rolleyes:
 
Roadtoad said:
It's easy to sit over here and say, "Yeah, he had it coming. He was carrying dope, and he knew better." Problem is, for a similar crime in the states, he'd have been out in five years. Granted, we've got problems here, but there's something about this story that just grates on me, and I'm not sure I can put my finger on it.
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What grates on me is that it is a little more brutality in an already brutal time. Deliberate and carefully thought out and perfectly legal brutality instead of the spontaneous and random sort that we see most days.
 
All times have been brutal.

Isn't Singapore also the place where the American got caned?

I can't say I'm surprised. You can have either peace or freedom. Pick one.

They chose. I guess they did, anyway. How free are the elections over there? What works in the US may not work in Singapore, either. Perhaps they felt the need to set a stronger example. A disproportionate sentence to our eyes may seem a reasonable thing to do in that culture.

Oh, I'm sorry. I implied that the war on drugs is working. I meant in a broader sense, of course.

My point is that we shouldn't judge them by our standards, we should judge them by their standards.
 
They have elections, but if you stand for the opposition party, you can guarantee you will regret it. The government will sue you for libel the second you say anything about them they don't want any one to hear. This will be done until you are bankrupt and in jail for being unable to pay your debts.
 
a_unique_person said:
They have elections, but if you stand for the opposition party, you can guarantee you will regret it. The government will sue you for libel the second you say anything about them they don't want any one to hear. This will be done until you are bankrupt and in jail for being unable to pay your debts.
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I think that's quite accurate - Singapore has been more like a family owned city than a democracy since the beginning.

What I don't understand here is why the guy was so extremely silly. Why Singapore, when drugs are relatively easy to find all over Asia?
 
He was doing it to save is twin brother from loan sharks who were threatening dire consequences if the load was not paid (his life, IIRC). Singapore was not actually a destination, it was just where he was to change planes from Cambodia to Australia. That is he was never going to leave the airport, just walk from one aircraft to the next.
 
Beerina said:
On the other hand, there and here, it is a gross violation of free people to contract between each other, and pursue pleasures, without busybodies backed with armed police sticking their nose into it.

Hence, a person was just executed for a consentual crime, which is to say, a crime that no one was harmed except those that wanted to participate.

Lovely ****ing world.
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Well put.
 
FYI, Singapore has been hanging drug traffickers regularly. The previous one was only a month or so ago. They are also hanged in Indonesia and Malaysia, if my sources are right (or possibly a firing squad...). So this is not an unusual response for the region.

Also (and AUP can back this up), Australian tourists to the region are given specific and clear warnings about the penalties for trafficking, intended or otherwise! So it's not like this came as any surprise.

However, as someone sensible pointed out, Singapore is making a large mistake in simply hanging the traffickers, aka the mules (which is what he was). They make NO attempt to use them to get to the actual dealers and kingpins, etc. It also appears they do not want to cooperate with regional governments to do this internationally either. One might wonder why...
 
Why Zep! You aren't pointing out that they didn't say what they were doing with the recovered goods, are you?

Anyway, so he knew what could be in store for him. Mob threatening his brother? I bet Fox makes a made-for-TV movie out of it.
 
Exactly.

So ..why?

Why punish the mules, but not the big timers?

Who are the big timers in Singapore?

Dope it out. The government is 'more of a family network'. Brutal tactics, control of a populace by fear, capital and corporal punishments doled out on a regular basis. What other organizations work in the same way? Hmmmmmmm.


None of this clicks with the rest of you? Am I just being paranoid?
 
Zep said:
Also (and AUP can back this up), Australian tourists to the region are given specific and clear warnings about the penalties for trafficking, intended or otherwise! So it's not like this came as any surprise.
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FYI

immigration_card.JPG


From here. (Click on picture in right-hands column if it doesn't show here)

and advice from Australian Government - Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade.

Penalties for drug offences are severe and include the death penalty.
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.
 
a_unique_person said:
He was doing it to save is twin brother from loan sharks who were threatening dire consequences if the load was not paid (his life, IIRC). Singapore was not actually a destination, it was just where he was to change planes from Cambodia to Australia. That is he was never going to leave the airport, just walk from one aircraft to the next.
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Surely if he never left the airport, he never legally entered Singapore?
 
Ian Osborne said:
Surely if he never left the airport, he never legally entered Singapore?
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It seems to be the Singaporean law that once the plane lands, you're in Singapore.

And Changi airport is patrolled by (young, ambitious) armed guards.

SAR_air1.jpg
 
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