Pronouns in Signature

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Oct 16, 2018
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Well, I know I'm putting myself out there for criticism here, but I first came to this site pondering balancing skepticism and faith, so that shouldn't be anything new :) I hope those of you I have interacted with here before will appreciate my efforts to be open and genuine and to listen to and consider other perspectives as I try to articulate (and thereby better understand) my own.

I received notice of a new work policy recently that requests employees include their preferred pronouns (e.g. he/him) in the email signature line. My initial gut response was "I don't want to do that" and I've spent some time pondering why that was my reaction. I think the main reasons I responded that way are:

1. I don't think it's necessary. Names (especially in a culturally diverse workplace) are often ambiguous with respect to gender and this has never caused a great problem. By all means, if someone would like to specify to avoid confusion or because it's particularly important to them, no problem, but asking everyone to do this feels like a solution for a non-problem.

2. There are many pieces of personal information that could be included in an email signature but are not typically (e.g. hearing or visual impairment, dyslexia, on the autistic spectrum, visible or non-visible disability etc.). That this has been singled out as a priority seems odd and arbitrary.

3. This feels like an effort to shift a cultural norm that I am comfortable with. I like the idea that cultural norms exist in general, (though I am equally comfortable with the fact that none of us fits them all). I think diversity is fascinating and valuable, but I don't like pretending that norms don't exist, or that they are unhelpful.

Lots of other thoughts here, but maybe that's enough to get the conversation rolling. As always, I appreciate the input of those who take the time to respond.
 
My feedback:

1. I don't think it's necessary. Names (especially in a culturally diverse workplace) are often ambiguous with respect to gender and this has never caused a great problem. By all means, if someone would like to specify to avoid confusion or because it's particularly important to them, no problem, but asking everyone to do this feels like a solution for a non-problem.

It has never caused a great problem for you, perhaps. Me either, for what it's worth. But my impression is that others would have different perspectives on that.

2. There are many pieces of personal information that could be included in an email signature but are not typically (e.g. hearing or visual impairment, dyslexia, on the autistic spectrum, visible or non-visible disability etc.). That this has been singled out as a priority seems odd and arbitrary.

It's a little different, insofar a person's pronouns directly involve how you address or refer to them in conversations; and email is the medium where those conversations happen.
In that context, a person's pronouns are relevant and useful. Those other types of personal information wouldn't be.
 
I can understand the current cultural milieu that requests such a policy and I can see your arguments against you being forced to do so. But I would go for a reductio ad absurdum approach and insist that you be allowed to use Xumf (or nonsense word of your choice) as your honorific. I mean who would possibility be brave enough to object?

You're welcome. :th:
 
My feedback:



It has never caused a great problem for you, perhaps. Me either, for what it's worth. But my impression is that others would have different perspectives on that.



It's a little different, insofar a person's pronouns directly involve how you address or refer to them in conversations; and email is the medium where those conversations happen.
In that context, a person's pronouns are relevant and useful. Those other types of personal information wouldn't be.

Thanks for your feedback Check. On the first point, that's true, but people with names that are common for men and women have run into this quite a bit and "specifying as needed/desired" seems like a reasonable solution.

On the second point, I agree, how you address someone is likely to come up in an email, but similarly, things like colour-blindness, dyslexia, or a learning disability might impact the way we choose to communicate via email. If this is helpful or important to someone, it's definitely worth communicating (respecting this information once received is a given in my opinion), but I don't expect everyone to try to cover this by default.
 
I can understand the current cultural milieu that requests such a policy and I can see your arguments against you being forced to do so. But I would go for a reductio ad absurdum approach and insist that you be allowed to use Xumf (or nonsense word of your choice) as your honorific. I mean who would possibility be brave enough to object?

You're welcome. :th:

Laugh. Thanks Gord. Very helpful ;)
 
Just a minor anecdote:

I have a friend, he's a guy. Born male/cis, straight, the whole nine yards. He's a little on the portly side but otherwise quite unmistakable as a man - if you're looking at him directly. Thing is, his voice is a bit on the high side, and he happens to like his hair longish, as some guys do.

But this causes some problems when people talk to him after having seen him only peripherally. I've been with him out at stores a handful of times, and once the library, and witnessed some person who hasn't looked at him directly address him as "ma'am" after he asks a question.

Every time I've witnessed this so far, invariably the employee turns around or looks up, sees him more directly, and immediately corrects themselves - but, more than that, they've always apologized rather forcefully for the mistake - in a couple of cases, I'm talking profusely. They are "omg, SO sorry!" One time I overheard a phone call he was making where he said "mister" quite clearly to correct someone, and then laughed and said "don't worry about it" because the person on the other end was obviously apologizing.

It's an anecdote, I know. But that is my observation: a whole lot of people seem to confidently assume that a man expects to be recognized and addressed as a man and would be quite upset or offended by accidentally being misgendered as female and called "ma'am" - and at least a goodly number of people are empathetic enough that they are embarrassed and almost overbearingly contrite when they carelessly make that mistake, even when the "recipient" indicates they didn't take offense.

It is incongruous, IMO, with how many people I've seen treat the idea of transgendered individuals asking to be called by the pronouns they prefer as a silly joke.
 
Just a minor anecdote:

I have a friend, he's a guy. Born male/cis, straight, the whole nine yards. He's a little on the portly side but otherwise quite unmistakable as a man - if you're looking at him directly. Thing is, his voice is a bit on the high side, and he happens to like his hair longish, as some guys do.

But this causes some problems when people talk to him after having seen him only peripherally. I've been with him out at stores a handful of times, and once the library, and witnessed some person who hasn't looked at him directly address him as "ma'am" after he asks a question.

Every time I've witnessed this so far, invariably the employee turns around or looks up, sees him more directly, and immediately corrects themselves - but, more than that, they've always apologized rather forcefully for the mistake - in a couple of cases, I'm talking profusely. They are "omg, SO sorry!" One time I overheard a phone call he was making where he said "mister" quite clearly to correct someone, and then laughed and said "don't worry about it" because the person on the other end was obviously apologizing.

It's an anecdote, I know. But that is my observation: a whole lot of people seem to confidently assume that a man expects to be recognized and addressed as a man and would be quite upset or offended by accidentally being misgendered as female and called "ma'am" - and at least a goodly number of people are empathetic enough that they are embarrassed and almost overbearingly contrite when they carelessly make that mistake, even when the "recipient" indicates they didn't take offense.

It is incongruous, IMO, with how many people I've seen treat the idea of transgendered individuals asking to be called by the pronouns they prefer as a silly joke.

That's a good thought exercise; and probably one many people have been on one or both sides of. Thanks. I grew my hair quite long as a young, skinny teenager and ran into that on occasion. I'm guessing your friend would emphasize the "mister" even more clearly if this was bothering him, but I'm also guessing he would have thought it odd for you to suddenly start doing the same.
 
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I share my pronouns upfront (and by the way they're not "preferred" pronouns, they're just pronouns) because I want to contribute to a culture where sharing pronouns is not considered unusual or uncommon.
 
I have signatures turned off.
And this is why I have mine in the custom title field under my user name, rather than in my signature. But the OP was referring to email signatures. I don't have mine in my work signature (the format of which is mandated to a standard) and I don't use personal email if I can help it, so I haven't bothered to add it.
 
I'm guessing your friend would emphasize the "mister" even more clearly if this was bothering him, but I'm also guessing he would have thought it odd for you to suddenly start doing the same.

I think so too; but my focus is less on him and more on both the phenomenon of how other people both assume that expectation, and the level of respect with which they treat that expectation even when it is only assumed. Maybe some or even all of those people have encountered men who really were seriously bothered or offended at being mistakenly called "ma'am" by someone who wasn't paying attention - but clearly, they would treat that offense as serious and reasonable. Compared to how dismissively so many treat the concerns of transgendered folks when it comes to pronouns.
 
I can understand the current cultural milieu that requests such a policy and I can see your arguments against you being forced to do so. But I would go for a reductio ad absurdum approach and insist that you be allowed to use Xumf (or nonsense word of your choice) as your honorific. I mean who would possibility be brave enough to object?

You're welcome. :th:


Sounds too much like "Trumpf" for my liking
 
I can understand the current cultural milieu that requests such a policy and I can see your arguments against you being forced to do so. But I would go for a reductio ad absurdum approach and insist that you be allowed to use Xumf (or nonsense word of your choice) as your honorific. I mean who would possibility be brave enough to object?

You're welcome. :th:

I do like that. :D

How about the appropriate honorific in the language of your ancestors?

That's Kunigaikštis Casebro to you!

(Had to look it up,and I gave myself a promotion to Duke, because it's a self-identity thing. :D ) Otherwise,there is "Eval nake", the only phrase I knew n Lithuanian from my mother. Devil's Spawn Casebro ?
 
I do like that. :D

How about the appropriate honorific in the language of your ancestors?

That's Kunigaikštis Casebro to you!

(Had to look it up,and I gave myself a promotion to Duke, because it's a self-identity thing. :D ) Otherwise,there is "Eval nake", the only phrase I knew n Lithuanian from my mother. Devil's Spawn Casebro ?
For me I'm pretty sure that would be Eorl Arthwollipot.
 
2. There are many pieces of personal information that could be included in an email signature but are not typically (e.g. hearing or visual impairment, dyslexia, on the autistic spectrum, visible or non-visible disability etc.).

Don't worry. It won't be long before employers "request" that you include this information, and more, as well.
 
I think so too; but my focus is less on him and more on both the phenomenon of how other people both assume that expectation, and the level of respect with which they treat that expectation even when it is only assumed. Maybe some or even all of those people have encountered men who really were seriously bothered or offended at being mistakenly called "ma'am" by someone who wasn't paying attention - but clearly, they would treat that offense as serious and reasonable. Compared to how dismissively so many treat the concerns of transgendered folks when it comes to pronouns.

Right. I understand and it's a good point. Cheers.
 
Seriously to answer the OP.

Your preferred pronoun is your business, as is whether you choose to put it in an email siggy or not.

This rather reminds me of when I was attached to the US Navy back in the 1980s. I do not have a second Christian name, I have a first name and last name, and that's it, so when I had to fill in the paperwork to be allotted a room in the BEQ and a temporary account at the PX, the form had a box for my second name, and since I didn't have have one, I left it blank.

When I handed it in, some jumped up, officious little admin clerk gave me the third degree for leaving a box blank. I explained that I have no second name, just first and last. I could see this annoyed him, and quickly told him that there's no point blaming me - my parents didn't give me a second name! He just thrust the form back into my hands, and said... "write NMI in there". I asked what it meant, and he looked at me like I was a piece of something he needed to wipe off his shoe. He said, curtly "No Middle Initial".... at this point, I just laughed, and that didn't do a lot for his demeanor... I thought he was going to have a seizure!

I have since found out that this use of NMI is quite common in the USA... it's not even thing here, which is why I had never head of it.
 

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