Oprah's cars: Surprise!

Dorian Gray

Hypocrisy Detector
Dorian Gray
Joined
Nov 15, 2002
Messages
20,366
Oprah gave a bunch of people some cars in one of her shows. First of all, she didn't pay a single cent for them. But second of all, Pontiac/GM, who gave the cars out, is paying for titles and title taxes and registrations - but isn't paying for the income tax on the cars. Remember, the cars were supposedly given out to poor people.

So basically, Oprah and Pontiac hasn't given just cars, they have given massive increases in the taxes for these people. Pontiac has literally said that if they can't afford the taxes, they should give back the cars.

This was all about Oprah's ego. What a fat piece of crap she is.

(What, did I just ruin it with the emotional appeal?)
 
Dorian Gray said:
Oprah gave a bunch of people some cars in one of her shows. First of all, she didn't pay a single cent for them. But second of all, Pontiac/GM, who gave the cars out, is paying for titles and title taxes and registrations - but isn't paying for the income tax on the cars. Remember, the cars were supposedly given out to poor people.

So basically, Oprah and Pontiac hasn't given just cars, they have given massive increases in the taxes for these people. Pontiac has literally said that if they can't afford the taxes, they should give back the cars.

This was all about Oprah's ego. What a fat piece of crap she is.

(What, did I just ruin it with the emotional appeal?)
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Well, nobody is forcing those people to accept the cars. They can either accept them or not. In the worst case scenario, they will leave the show just as they had come in, they won't be worse off. If GM is paying for the tax, title and license, AND they are giving these people a brand new car for no cost, what's wrong with that? I don't see how you can find fault in this.
 
Why not sell the car and use some of the money to pay the taxes? You'll still end up tens of thousands in the black.

Or am I missing some noose in the American tax code?
 
Dorian Gray said:
...Remember, the cars were supposedly given out to poor people.
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"Poor people?" I was under the impression the recipients were members of her regular studio audience. Could be wrong.

As for paying taxes on the cars, seems as if this situation is no different from what would happen if you won a prize on a game show. Besides, sales tax on a $20k item would be in the neighborhood of $1,500. I'd "buy" a new car for that.
 
Regnad Kcin said:
As for paying taxes on the cars, seems as if this situation is no different from what would happen if you won a prize on a game show. Besides, sales tax on a $20k item would be in the neighborhood of $1,500. I'd "buy" a new car for that.
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Sales tax is not so bad, but these weren't sales. Gift tax is higher. When I lived in New York, which I admit was 30 years ago, it was around 30%. It's probably at least as high in California. Plus, you have to pay Federal and State income tax on the original price of the car.

It's not such a big deal if you can afford to pay the taxes; it's less than the price of the car. But if you can't, you have to sell the car. Now, when you buy something and resell it like this, a good rule of thumb is that you're only going to get 60% of the original value, although you have to pay the taxes based on the new sale price of the car. So, out of the original price of the car, with your 60% return, you have to pay 30% for gift tax, or 50% of what you get for resale, so you're left with 30%. Then out of that 30%, you have to pay Federal income tax on it, which is at best about 10% of the original, so you're left with 20%. Out of that, you have to pay state income tax, which unless you live in a state without sales tax, is probably about 5% if you're poor. So, now, you have 15% left. Which at least is something, I guess.
 
epepke said:
Sales tax is not so bad, but these weren't sales. Gift tax is higher. When I lived in New York, which I admit was 30 years ago, it was around 30%. It's probably at least as high in California. Plus, you have to pay Federal and State income tax on the original price of the car.
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Thanks. I wasn't aware of that, not ever having won anything of significant monetary value. (Grr.) (Or maybe not Grr, come to think of it!)
 
Regnad Kcin said:
Thanks. I wasn't aware of that, not ever having won anything of significant monetary value. (Grr.) (Or maybe not Grr, come to think of it!)
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I had some friends who went on the TV show Concentration. New York show, though nationally syndicated. Maybe before your time. It involved matching tiles from a grid that were revealed two at a time. This is a common video game even now. However, the matched tiles revealed a rebus, which you would then have to guess.

They won. They wound up having to sell every blessed thing they won in order just to pay the damn taxes. These were not poor people, either--they had a weekend place in Connecticut.
 
Oprah? Isn't she a TV personality?

I've never seen her show, but I gather it's popular.

Like 99% of TV shows (except PBS and other non-profits), the networks are just filling in space between commercials. The other 1% of shows are those infomercials.

Charlie (turn off the TV and read a book) Monoxide
 
Regnad Kcin said:
"Poor people?" I was under the impression the recipients were members of her regular studio audience. Could be wrong.
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The show made an effort to seek out people who claimed to have junky cars to be the audience for that show. One presumes, then, that they were at least poorer than the average Oprah audience.


Still, it seems to me that no matter how bad the taxes are, the audience members all came out ahead.
 
this was already covered in another thread but here are the facts:

taxes are going to be around 7K

guests on stage were people in desperate need of a car

audience members in the seats were just "regular" people

oprah didnt pay anything for the car.

Oprah's followers believe her sweat, when distilled, will cure cancer.

Her viewers patiently await further instructions on what book to read next.
 
Dorian Gray said:
Oprah gave a bunch of people some cars in one of her shows. First of all, she didn't pay a single cent for them...
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Oprah and Pontiac get together to do a good deed for people in need, and you complain it wasn't good enough.

No class.
 
aerocontrols said:
The show made an effort to seek out people who claimed to have junky cars to be the audience for that show. One presumes, then, that they were at least poorer than the average Oprah audience.
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Appreciate the info.
Originally posted by HarryKeogh
...guests on stage were people in desperate need of a car...
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Again.

Though one wonders how audience members were screened for such personal and potentially embarassing bits.
 
You know, I *was* planning on giving my car to that poster Dorian Gray, because s/he seems like such a nice poster, but come then I read this thread and learned what a horrible person I would be if I did it. So, no car for you.
 
Oprah and GM did nothing wrong. The real criminal here is the government by trying to extort free citizens. If anyone else did this, they would be in jail.
 
You know, I *was* planning on giving my car to that poster Dorian Gray, because s/he seems like such a nice poster, but come then I read this thread and learned what a horrible person I would be if I did it. So, no car for you.
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Oprah didn't give "her" car to anyone.

It was, at best, a tainted benefit to the people in the audience. Some of them might have to sell the cars to pay the $7500 in taxes, and just like in real life, the cars depreciated in value the instant they were driven home. How much, I don't know, but there you go.

If they decide to keep the car, they have to pay the gift tax out of their own pockets. I feel that if they had $7500 laying around to pay taxes with, they would have gotten relatively decent used cars, wouldn't they?

Then, there's the fact that the whole thing was a huge and cheap infomercial for Pontiac. I imagine that Oprah, the number one show of its kind and at least one of the top ten syndicated shows in the country, commands a large sum of money for advertising time. Let's say it's $250,000 per 30-second slot. This entire show was 44 minutes long - subtract the suspense building, and it was probably about 40 minutes. Keep in mind that this is DURING the show, and doesn't include regular commercials.

Well, 80 times $250000 is $20 million, and remember, this is a conservative estimate. Pontiac spent $7 million. They saved $13 million dollars. Plus, I believe Pontiac gets to write this off since it's a "gift" or "donation". So it may not have cost them anything. In fact, if they saved taxes, that means that basically YOU AND I paid for the cars, if you think about it. But I don't remember getting any credit. You?

Also, there's the fact that there are tons of people who don't have food, or clothes, or houses, or have other situations much worse than not having a car. Plus, there are hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of poverty-level people.

I can just think of better uses for the money, and better uses for the publicity. I guess I like my philanthropists to be silent. Bill and Melinda Gates give out all kinds of money - but you never really hear about it. Each time Oprah, or anyone, gives out a free gift to all the people in the audience - other than a book - it's just a huge advertisement.
 
epepke said:
Sales tax is not so bad, but these weren't sales. Gift tax is higher. When I lived in New York, which I admit was 30 years ago, it was around 30%. It's probably at least as high in California. Plus, you have to pay Federal and State income tax on the original price of the car.

It's not such a big deal if you can afford to pay the taxes; it's less than the price of the car. But if you can't, you have to sell the car. Now, when you buy something and resell it like this, a good rule of thumb is that you're only going to get 60% of the original value, although you have to pay the taxes based on the new sale price of the car. So, out of the original price of the car, with your 60% return, you have to pay 30% for gift tax, or 50% of what you get for resale, so you're left with 30%. Then out of that 30%, you have to pay Federal income tax on it, which is at best about 10% of the original, so you're left with 20%. Out of that, you have to pay state income tax, which unless you live in a state without sales tax, is probably about 5% if you're poor. So, now, you have 15% left. Which at least is something, I guess.
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Isn't there an $11,000 exclusion for gift taxes? Wouldn't the taxes be calculated on the difference between the retail value of the car and the $11,000?
 
Originally posted by Dorian Gray
It was, at best, a tainted benefit to the people in the audience. Some of them might have to sell the cars to pay the $7500 in taxes, and just like in real life, the cars depreciated in value the instant they were driven home. How much, I don't know, but there you go.
Click to expand...

Hey, you forgot that these victims also have to buy insurance for these cars. Gasoline and maintenance will add up too. :rolleyes:
 
Dorian Gray said:
Oprah didn't give "her" car to anyone.

It was, at best, a tainted benefit to the people in the audience. Some of them might have to sell the cars to pay the $7500 in taxes, and just like in real life, the cars depreciated in value the instant they were driven home. How much, I don't know, but there you go.

If they decide to keep the car, they have to pay the gift tax out of their own pockets. I feel that if they had $7500 laying around to pay taxes with, they would have gotten relatively decent used cars, wouldn't they?

Then, there's the fact that the whole thing was a huge and cheap infomercial for Pontiac. I imagine that Oprah, the number one show of its kind and at least one of the top ten syndicated shows in the country, commands a large sum of money for advertising time. Let's say it's $250,000 per 30-second slot. This entire show was 44 minutes long - subtract the suspense building, and it was probably about 40 minutes. Keep in mind that this is DURING the show, and doesn't include regular commercials.

Well, 80 times $250000 is $20 million, and remember, this is a conservative estimate. Pontiac spent $7 million. They saved $13 million dollars. Plus, I believe Pontiac gets to write this off since it's a "gift" or "donation". So it may not have cost them anything. In fact, if they saved taxes, that means that basically YOU AND I paid for the cars, if you think about it. But I don't remember getting any credit. You?

Also, there's the fact that there are tons of people who don't have food, or clothes, or houses, or have other situations much worse than not having a car. Plus, there are hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of poverty-level people.

I can just think of better uses for the money, and better uses for the publicity. I guess I like my philanthropists to be silent. Bill and Melinda Gates give out all kinds of money - but you never really hear about it. Each time Oprah, or anyone, gives out a free gift to all the people in the audience - other than a book - it's just a huge advertisement.
Click to expand...

I just don't understand how you can criticize an act of charity in the way you have. Alot of people have performed charitable deeds for selfish reasons, but I don't think it's too classy to criticize them, because nothing bad is coming out of their charity. Bill Gates recently donated alot of money to India to combat AIDS, and some people say he did this because he will need the Indian government's help in the future since many of Microsoft's jobs will be outsourced to India. Even if this is true, I don't think it's fair to criticize Gates, because he is still performing an act that benefits other people.

In this case, the audience members can sell their cars if they can't afford the tax, and they will still get a few thousand dollars out of it. What's wrong with Oprah giving away a few thousand dollars to her audience members?
 
Mycroft said:
Hey, you forgot that these victims also have to buy insurance for these cars. Gasoline and maintenance will add up too. :rolleyes:
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What???? She's not giving them free Gas for life? Cheap Bitch......
 
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