Obese kids

[Tez]

Well, this might not be a popular thread, but here goes..

(And by the way, I know nothing of Nyarlathotep's personal circumstances, his thread simply triggered this...)

One of my biggest pet peeves is seeing obese parents bringing their obese children to MacDonalds; the whole family gorging on junk food.

It drives me mad.

I have twice confronted such parents (actually once in MacDonalds, once at some diner) and expressed vociferous dismay at their actions. (What I really hoped to do was give their kids something to think about.)

It borders on child abuse IMO.

Fine - some obesity is probably genetic. Parents with such a genetic disorder should feel a greater parental burden to ensure that their children's lives are minimally affected by their unfortunate genes. Parents of children with myriads of other genetic disorders do feel such a burden. Personally, I think many of these parents subconciously feel some sort of comfort - a kind of affirmation of the acceptability of their own affliction - through having kids that are miniature version of themselves.

Basically I find it hard to believe that, between the ages of 0-14, or whatever, parents do not have enough control over their kids' eating habits to ensure that they don't become obese. Good habits set in these formative years provide a foundation for a healthy lifestyle - after that it becomes the child's own choice. As with anything you teach your kids....

 

[Cynical]

Tez, you make some good points, and obesity IS a problem. But...
your concern borders on an obsession. Were you obese as a child, and you blame your parents for it? Are you obese now, and you blame your parents for making you clean your plate when you were a child? This would explain your attitude.

If not, then where do YOU get off lecturing other people? Sorry to use a boring cliche, Tez, but...

Get a life.

 

[jj]

Well, something to consider, I'm not entirely sure of the point that it makes.

1) Until they were about 5, our kids loved McD's, Burger King, etc.
2) After the younger was that age, they will not set foot in the place, except to get an unsweetened iced tea or use the facilities.

We did not instill this, they did it on their own. We did, of course, grill them some decent hamburgers here and there.

They're 10 and 13 now. Neither is even chubby, they don't even really reach "well padded". The younger one is shortish, and is sometimes thought to be padded, but when you look twice, all the padding bunches up into muscle on command. Yikes.

And they DO eat. And eat. And eat. But, I actually (mostly as a joke) suggested that we stop at McD's on the way home from a trip up to the North Cascades two weekends ago. I thought the car windows would melt. Then we passed a "Krispy Kreme" store/bakery. Well, at least they won't go to Micky D's.

 

[EvilYeti]

Fine - some obesity is probably genetic.

I was with you up until this point. The "obesity gene" myth is one of the most prevalent junk science beliefs in our popular culture. Many self-described skeptics in this very forum believe such nonsense. For the truth on the matter, read Michael Fumento's excellent article here

To Cynical, I ask what you would you do if you saw parents giving cigarrettes to young children, would you say something? Do you realize the healths risks of obesity are only slightly less than smoking?

 

[Luciana]

One of these days I was at the mall and saw a family of obese parents carrying a 10 or 9 year-old girl in a cart, and she was eating a huge sundae with whipped cream and all toppings. They walked slowly, dressed sloppily and were the very image of laziness.

And yes, Tez, I know how you feel. I had the worst of impressions - I felt like going there and saying "look, don't you think that this girl should be walking and not getting 800 calories from that sundae?"

I consoled myself with the thought that the girl was exhausted because she had walked too much, and that sundae was there because she was hypoglicemic... and then I kept repeating the mantra "don't be judgmental, none of your business, don't be judgmental..."

Apart from health problems, there is the fact that she is probably humiliated at school in a daily basis. As we grow old, we can overcome the feelings of inadequecy steming from other people's opinion, but that's extremely difficult to a child. Most likely they will feel miserable and carry many scars throughout their lives.

I wouldn't go as far as calling it "child abuse". For starters, parents think they're doing the right thing. Their children eat what they themselves eat (and isn't that an universal truth?) Children tend to emulate their parents in many ways. Add genetic to the mix - which can mean propensity to gain weight but also an uncontrolable urge to eat - and you have an obese kid, who probably feels very loved everytime he or she gets their sundae with 10 toppings.

 

[Brown]

When I was growing up, kids were taught to "clean their plates." Eating all the food dished up for you was a big deal. Throwing away food was a detestable thing to do.

As an adult, I now find that I tend to clean my plate. In addition, I can directly correlate some of my eating habits to things I learned as a child. Not all of these habits are good ones.

When I was a kid, my family didn't go to McDonald's very often, because it was too expensive (in comparison to home cooking). Accordingly, a trip to McDonald's was considered to be a rare treat. I still like McDonald's food even today.... but I eat it very, very rarely.

One of my best friends raised his kids with a different approach (and I have always thought that this was a wonderful idea): The kids did not have to clean their plates. But they had to understand that there would be no other source of food. If they did not care to eat what was served, that was fine, they could do without if they wished; but they would not be heard to complain later that they were hungry. And if the kids refused to eat what was served, McDonald's was not an option.

 

[kittynh]

What about all the parents with thin kids who take their kids to McDonald's???? Lots of parents do. One girl I know eats the super sized Big Mack meal and a sundae for desert. She's 6 foot at age 13, and still growing and she's rail thin. I pointed out to her mom that one day she was going to stop growing, and that maybe it was better to instill some better eating habits. My kids love Wendy's, salads, baked potatoes, chili.... and I can never get this girl to agree to go there. Admittedly she also plays on many sports teams, but still I think her mom isn't doing her any favors feeding her this high fat stuff very frequently (they always stop after hockey practice). Just because you can see the fat on some kids doesn't mean the parents of the thin kids are less at risk in the long run.

 

[Luciana]

Just because you can see the fat on some kids doesn't mean the parents of the thin kids are less at risk in the long run.

Ok, kitty, those parents might be wrong too. But at least they're not seeing their fat kids getting fatter right in front of their eyes! The different is that you suspect that parents of obese kids are in denial.

 

[kittynh]

well, and there is the old "love is food" angle. I know some families where everything is celebrated with FOOD. It's Friday, they go out to eat at Burger King. Good grades, ice cream! It's something they learned from their family. If you see mom and dad deal with their unhappiness with a bag of chips, you will learn the same coping skills. If mom and dad watch tv in the evening eating Dove bars, you will do the same. If mom and dad get out and run or ride a bike or hike, the kids will follow.

Food and emotions are very intertwined. I just went to a graduation party. There was enough food there to feed an army. People brought food too. The waste was awful. Americans at least celebrate with food, and it isn't always quality, it's quantity! If you don't eat, it's like an alcoholic trying NOT to drink. People actually get insulted.

 

[Luciana]

Food and emotions are very intertwined. I just went to a graduation party. There was enough food there to feed an army. People brought food too. The waste was awful. Americans at least celebrate with food, and it isn't always quality, it's quantity! If you don't eat, it's like an alcoholic trying NOT to drink. People actually get insulted.

I thought that would be a common ground among cultures? Celebration and food walk hand-in-hand, imho.

So yes, if food is love, and it's delicious, and it satisfies you in so many ways - how can you deny that to your child? So obese parents will raise obese kids... they couldn't do otherwise.

 

[Phaycops]

WRT "cleaning your plate." This was true in my family as well, along with the idea that if you didn't eat what there was, that was too freakin' bad! Anyway, the point I would like to make is that portion sizes have been going steadily up in the US in recent decades, both at restaraunts and at home. Just some food for thought (har!).

 

[Missy]

I totally empathise with Tez. Up to a certain age, parents have full control and a responsibility to upold when it comes to their children. Obesity can be controlled wether it genetic or not, and it's fustrating to see how unhealthy and overweight children can get just because their parents aren't doing their job. It's negligence, failure to see that there's a problem and doing something about it. In fact they actually make the problem worse by encouraging bad food habits. It's sad.. really sad..

 

[Jon_in_london]

Re: Re: Obese kids

I was with you up until this point. The "obesity gene" myth is one of the most prevalent junk science beliefs in our popular culture. Many self-described skeptics in this very forum believe such nonsense.

Yeti, while 99.9% of all obesity in the west may not be genetic, its absolutely a fact that certain conditions, such as leptin defciency and hypothyroidism result in obesity.

Ya-boo.

 

[Pablo]

I have twice confronted such parents (actually once in MacDonalds, once at some diner) and expressed vociferous dismay at their actions. (What I really hoped to do was give their kids something to think about.)

This has been mentioned before by Cynical, but I think it is an important point. A point with which I have a problem,

Where do you get off confronting anyone on the street? For what? For EATING too much? And in front of their kids?

Are you obese yourself? Do you smoke? Do you cheat on your partner? Do you indulge in hazardous sports? Do you jaywalk? Are you so confident of your moral high ground that you can afford to see the straw in the eye of others (yes, it's a biblical quote, so sue me)? All of us have our moral and responsability shortcomings, some more blatantly than others, but that does not entitle any John Doe off the street to gloat self-righteously about them. In doing that, you're no better than the Jesus-peddling goody-two-shoes who offer to pray for your sins. It is their (the fat couple's) choice. At some point in the future, it will be that kid's choice. I don't buy the argument that "he's being conditioned for the future". So is everyone. It is not up to you to teach people how to live their lives.
(/off rant)

 

[a_unique_person]

One of my kids has always had a weight issue, but he was 10 1/2 pounds when he was born. We are trying to educate him as to how to control his weight now that he is older. The youngest one was not born with a weight problem, but he is a lazy lad who would rather play computer all day. We have to encourage him to get exercise, then he is ok.

 

[Ove]

I would disagree with some of you here. It is NOT a matter of teaching your child bad eating habits it is about not taching your child anything at all. A lot of obesity comes from lazyness. The child in the Cart with the sundae f.inst. I'll bet that that child has been crying or screaming og having a fit or whatever and the parents, to get some quiet hands out some candy/ice cream/whatever.

Most of the McD culture also comes from lazyness. You come home from work and you just don't want to take the time to cook a meal so McD's just around the corner or you could order a Pizza and the children loves it off course. And off course if Peter is hungry one houre before dinnertime you can allways hand him some ice cream or a peanut butter sandwich or.... And off course when Cola is cheap in the vending machines in Scool why bother trying to teach your children to dring milk?

I know that what i see on TV is the extremes but i have seen some hair raising stuff from USA. I saw one joyous semi fat young american happily munching away on a Big-Mac and yelling "Hey this IS a balanced diet" "Look, there's meat,bread and salad" "McD IS HEALTHY FOOD" (I know, i know, they comes in all shapes and sizes but still.....)

Another disturbing image was from a "Jenny Jones" which i normally DON'T watch. I was zapping one night and suddenly saw theese extremely obese kids. Fascinated i got stuck. It turned out that one of them was a girl aged five looking like a blimp. She practically couldn't walk. It turned out that her mother had started her on solid food at the age of 6 ..... MONTHS. Now her diet was more or less solely McD and equal.

HER MOTHER WAS NOT IN ANY WAY OBESE... rater to the skinny side but as she said "I hate to hear her cry so i just give her what she wan't". In the end i turned off, disgusted beyond belief.

The core of the matter is LACK OF UPBRINGING. Teaching your child healthy eating habits is a struggle, it takes a lot of time and energy but it is vital if you want to give your children a good start in life. Strangely enough seems most parents to be very concerned that their children has the best daycare/education available. A lot of parents are extremely active in scool boards etc. but when it comes to actually spending some time together with their children and teaching them right and wrong a lot of people tend to think that that must be "someone elses job"

WROONNNG!!! YOU are in charge of your childrens upbringing and if they become obese it is YOUR fault nor McD or KFC or ..... They just provide the tools.


Brown : I was also told to "Cean my plate" but the difference was that 75 % of that plate consisted of potatoes,carrots, peas etc. and as someone else pointed out it WAS smaller than today.

Regarding confronting parents on the streets i have had the urge several times but kept my calm. One thing i have done though is "The supermarket line up at 5pm" with the screaming kids. I have allways refused to give my children candy in that situation even if they lay on the floor screamin (they only did it a couple of times then they realized it didn't work) and today if i see other parents in the similar situation i show my full sympati TO THE PARENTS. even helps if i can.

I remember vividly some of the remarks i got like"Why don't you give the child what it want's so the rest of us can have some quiet" and other "helpful remarks" I try to show my full support to the parents and i have had some grateful looks from stressed parents.

 

[Andonyx]

Hang on, I have to agree with....gasp, Cynical?!?! And that Groucho looking guy.

While your points may be valid from an objective view you seriously have to weigh the bad of what you're doing with the good. There's a difference between a parent hitting a child and a parent with poor parenting skills.

Children remember things in ways you may not recall. Dressing down someone in front of their child for their poor parenting skills is NEVER acceptable unless there is an immediate threat of physical harm to the child.

A) Exactly how is that child supposed to learn to respect the rules their parents may lay down for them in the future if some nosy ninny off the street decides her own business is not enough for her to attend to that day and questions them about their parenting in front of the child?

B) What exactly do you hope to give the children to think about other than their own deep sense of shame and failure when a perfect stranger assails them in public about their weight, and embarasses them and their parents?

I can tell you this, even if I make some mistakes as a parent in the future, I would expect my friends and family in a spirit of concern to bring them up at the appropriate time. If you actually chose to bring it up in public in the manner of your choosing, you would indeed also leave with something to think about, and it would most likely be a black eye or a broken nose.

 

[jj]

Re: Re: Obese kids

I was with you up until this point. The "obesity gene" myth is one of the most prevalent junk science beliefs in our popular culture. Many self-described skeptics in this very forum believe such nonsense. For the truth on the matter, read Michael Fumento's excellent article here

To Cynical, I ask what you would you do if you saw parents giving cigarrettes to young children, would you say something? Do you realize the healths risks of obesity are only slightly less than smoking?

Fumento's article does not, in fact, support the extremity of your contention, which is in and of itself a straw man.

Having said that, it's quite true that many people just eat too much and don't get enough exercise.

So it goes. As usual, the truth is in the middle, not at either your extreme or someone else's.

 

[Tez]

This has been mentioned before by Cynical, but I think it is an important point. A point with which I have a problem,

Where do you get off confronting anyone on the street? For what? For EATING too much? And in front of their kids?

Are you obese yourself? Do you smoke? Do you cheat on your partner? Do you indulge in hazardous sports? Do you jaywalk? Are you so confident of your moral high ground that you can afford to see the straw in the eye of others (yes, it's a biblical quote, so sue me)? All of us have our moral and responsability shortcomings, some more blatantly than others, but that does not entitle any John Doe off the street to gloat self-righteously about them. In doing that, you're no better than the Jesus-peddling goody-two-shoes who offer to pray for your sins. It is their (the fat couple's) choice. At some point in the future, it will be that kid's choice. I don't buy the argument that "he's being conditioned for the future". So is everyone. It is not up to you to teach people how to live their lives.
(/off rant)

I am not dressing the parents down for eating too much. I am dressing them down for what I consider abusive parenting. Big difference.

And as far as child abuse goes - yes, I do feel confident of my moral high ground...

 

[Pablo]

I am not dressing the parents down for eating too much. I am dressing them down for what I consider abusive parenting. Big difference.

And who entrusted you with keeping the standards of parenting? Better still: where do you draw your parenting standards from? For a large chunk of the world population, most posters in this forum (those who have children) are guilty of abusive parenting, because they deny their children the benefits of religion. What then? Would I have to put up with the dressing-down? Like Hell I would.

Don't get me wrong: it is irresponsible parenting, no questions about it, and that child would be better off in someone else's hands. That does not give you the right to prey upon them. If your concern is truly for the kid, inform the parents of the risks they are putting him at or, should this fail, contact the authorities and mention this case and see what can be done. Direct action such as you depict it rather gives the impression of someone wanting to assert himself at the expense of others (and no, I am not claiming this is your case; only that , were I to witness such a scene, that's how I'd probably perceive it)