No voting for/by Saudi women

[Ladewig]

Christian Science Monitor

Women will not be allowed to vote in Saudi Arabia's municipal elections, the first nationwide poll to be held in the autocratic kingdom, the Associated Press reported. The decision, announced by Interior Minister Prince Nayef Monday, dashed the hopes of Saudis seeking democratic reforms.

An electoral official said administrative reasons were behind the decision to ban women from running or voting in the municipal elections that are scheduled to begin in February. The official, who spoke on the customary condition of anonymity, said there are not enough women to run women-only registration centers and polling stations, and only a fraction of the country's women have photo identity cards. Many women in this devoutly Muslim kingdom balked at getting the ID cards - introduced in 2001 - because the pictures would show their faces unveiled.

There is a long, long road ahead if here in the 21st century women say, "God doesn't want me to have an identification card because then people would see my face." Of course, it could be more of a case of men saying, "God doesn't want my wife, sister, and daughter to have identification cards."

 

[zenith-nadir]

Don't you just love a society that treats women like cattle?

Saudi Women Can't Vote, Run in Elections - Tue, Oct 12, 2004

Associated Press - RIYADH, Saudi Arabia - Women may neither vote nor run in Saudi Arabia's first nationwide elections, the government announced Monday.

In another thread I exposed the hypocrisy of Ibrahim al-Samlati, president of the Arab Bar Association, who said on October 9th 2004 at a conference for the Arab Bar Association;

"calls on lawyers everywhere to defend the heritage of humanity in a world based on justice, equality and abiding by international laws and charters."

That was after he bitterly complained about "American insolence and Zionist aggression"....So much hypocrisy...so little time...

 

[Chaos]

Nice allies you´ve got yourselves...

 

[Mike B.]

Nice allies you´ve got yourselves...

Germany seems pretty close:


"Political relations

Bilateral relations between Germany and the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia are good and generally unproblematic. As in other Arab countries, Germany is viewed sympathetically and many in Saudi Arabia would like Germany to play a greater role in world politics, particularly in resolving the Middle East conflict.

Economic relations

Saudi Arabia is by far Germany's main trading partner in the Arab region. Last year exports rose by 14.3% to approx. EUR 3.4 billion, putting Germany in third place among Saudi Arabia's supply countries behind the USA and Japan. Germany traditionally has a high export surplus. Saudi exports amounted to less than a third of imports and declined further last year (2000: EUR 1103.9 million, 2001: EUR 957 million, 2002: EUR 843.8 million).

While Germany's main exports to Saudi Arabia are traditionally medical equipment and finished products (e.g. motor vehicles), there is room for expansion in the fields of environmental technology and plant engineering. For some considerable time the Saudi Government has been announcing some major projects, including railway construction and gas extraction.

The German-Saudi Arabian Liaison Office for Economic Affairs (GESALO) was set up in 1978 by the German Association of Chambers of Industry and Commerce. It is part of the global network of German chambers of industry and commerce, the German Association of Chambers of Industry and Commerce and the bilateral German Chambers of Foreign Trade. GESALO, which has offices in Riyadh and Jiddah, supports and promotes bilateral economic relations between Germany and the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia."

Not that there is anything wrong with it, just the way the world works. I am sure we would all love a secular social democratic regime to take hold in Saudi Arabia, but until that time comes you have to deal with what you have.here

 

[Tmy]

If only they could have free elections like in Kuwaitt.........Oh nevermind.


Hey, I have a theory. Its seems the only way to get democracy in the mid east IS THROUGH TERRORISM!!!!! Terrorists really want democracy. THey know they only way to get it is to piss off the US. That way they will invade and install democracy. If your country is buddies with the US, no democracy to you. If you're a pain in the butt country, DEMOCRACY FOR EVERYONE!

Damn they are clever!

 

[Nikk]

To get back on topic why does an electoral system require photo identity cards?

The British system for example relies on an annual register which is based on the owners/tenants of residential property naming those on the premises who are entitled to vote. No one has to produce any kind of photo identity card either before registration or upon voting. The register is open to public inspection and anyone missing can apply to be included at any time.

Clearly the system is open to fraud and it is possible for non citizens to get a vote but we do not worry about this as inclusivity trumps accuracy where enfrachisement is concerned.

Equally clearly the Saudi's could operate the same sort of system without the risk of males being driven insane with lust by seeing strange women's faces!

 

[drkitten]

The British system for example relies on an annual register which is based on the owners/tenants of residential property naming those on the premises who are entitled to vote. No one has to produce any kind of photo identity card either before registration or upon voting. The register is open to public inspection and anyone missing can apply to be included at any time.

What prevents me from showing up early at the polling place near Joe Bloggs' house and telling the election officials that I'm Joe Bloggs? The election officials can't be expected to know every local resident by sight (that would be a nightmare in a major city like London or Manchester). Would they let me vote? Would they then later prevent the real Joe Bloggs from voting, on the grounds that he's already voted? Would they let him vote again (essentially, having "Joe Bloggs" vote twice)? If so, what's to prevent Joe Bloggs from actually voting twice.

I can't see how this system prevents voters from defrauding the system. But then, I have family who lived in Chicago for thirty years, so perhaps I'm paranoiac about such things. ("Chicago Democrats : vote early, vote often!")

 

[Nikk]

What prevents me from showing up early at the polling place near Joe Bloggs' house and telling the election officials that I'm Joe Bloggs? The election officials can't be expected to know every local resident by sight (that would be a nightmare in a major city like London or Manchester). Would they let me vote? Would they then later prevent the real Joe Bloggs from voting, on the grounds that he's already voted? Would they let him vote again (essentially, having "Joe Bloggs" vote twice)? If so, what's to prevent Joe Bloggs from actually voting twice.

I can't see how this system prevents voters from defrauding the system. But then, I have family who lived in Chicago for thirty years, so perhaps I'm paranoiac about such things. ("Chicago Democrats : vote early, vote often!")

Simple.

We vote for councillors who deal with local government and M.P's who sit in Parliament ( national government ).

About three weeks before an election every household receives a card for each registered voter with the name of the voter on it.

To vote you must hand the card in at the polling station and have your name deleted from the register of electors. In return you are given a ballot form with the name of the candidates but no identifying marks. One votes by putting an X against the name of your preferred candidate, or possibly candidates if it is a local election. So it is impossible to vote without the card.

The system is not completely foolproof as corrupt officials could in theory produce false polling cards. In practice this has only ever been a problem in northern ireland where the vote early, vote often maxim is well known.

It is by the way quite usual for polling stations to serve only a small area and the process is always supervised by local party members and councillors who may very well know many of the voters by sight. This restricts the opportunities for impersonation.

 

[Elind]

To get back on topic why does an electoral system require photo identity cards?

The British system for example relies on an annual register which is based on the owners/tenants of residential property naming those on the premises who are entitled to vote. No one has to produce any kind of photo identity card either before registration or upon voting. The register is open to public inspection and anyone missing can apply to be included at any time.

Clearly the system is open to fraud and it is possible for non citizens to get a vote but we do not worry about this as inclusivity trumps accuracy where enfrachisement is concerned.

Equally clearly the Saudi's could operate the same sort of system without the risk of males being driven insane with lust by seeing strange women's faces!

Good point! Now that fingerprint ID checkers can be bought for $50, and supposedly work well, the Saudis could just use that instead for their voting machines, and the women can vote the men out of office, all the while waddling around like potato sacks, while wearing thongs underneath.